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speakers

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MattyCoupe View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MattyCoupe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan/02/2014 at 11:28am
Originally posted by 71 Javelin AMX O.O. 71 Javelin AMX O.O. wrote:

George & Uncle John:
 
Your expertise in the speaker area is impressive.  However you did not answer my basic question....can an OEM, orignal AMC speaker, be re-built to today's standards to get better sound quality?  I understand the radio may not have the power to drive the newer speakers, but is there something that can be done to the orignal speakers to get them to sound better?  Maybe I'm just deaming here and you may not know if this is possible?  I appreciate all the discussion on this subject.
 
Steve
'

Yes, you can have your speakers rebuilt. They're a few places that do it. Orange County Speaker, Speakerlab, and Neil speaker repair are a few. Contact all three before you decide which to use. Make sure you go over your wants/needs with the reps, so they're no surprises on either side.

OCS did my JBL concert cabinets and my original set of Kenwoods that my parents bought new before I was born. LOL. They did me good on both.
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71 Javelin AMX O.O. View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 71 Javelin AMX O.O. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan/02/2014 at 11:40am
Matty:
 
Thanks for the recommendation.  Were the results better than what you started with?  Do you feel for the cost it was worth it?
 
Steve
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MattyCoupe View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MattyCoupe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan/02/2014 at 2:49pm
Originally posted by 71 Javelin AMX O.O. 71 Javelin AMX O.O. wrote:

Matty:
 
Thanks for the recommendation.  Were the results better than what you started with?  Do you feel for the cost it was worth it?
 
Steve

Steve,

With the JBLs, Yes. They sound perfect, nice and crisp. With the Kenwoods, I didn't have anything to compare them to,the surrounds were rotted when I got them. but they sound amazing now! With the JBL, well worth the cost(1/3 the price of new set), with the Kenwoods, it was a sentimental thing.  
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71 Javelin AMX O.O. View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 71 Javelin AMX O.O. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan/02/2014 at 2:53pm
Matty:
 
One more question.  Were the speakers for a vehicle or in home use?  The names you stated sound like home speakers.  I researched a radio restorers web site, Auto Electric and they state that you can't really re-build car speakers.  When they tried the results were not up to the cost or quality expected.  Seems like my idea of keeping my mint orignal speakers and getting better sound out of them, is not possible.
 
Steve
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote uncljohn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan/02/2014 at 2:59pm
Yes old speakers can be rebuilt and or repaired, it is not rocket science.  But in general for an old car that in and of itself does not have any increased value due to OEM style speakers being in it, why bother and incur the expense when you can buy functional replacements.
But it can be done here for one example and I am sure many others.
http://www.heavysoundco.com/oldcarradiospeakers.html
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71 Javelin AMX O.O. View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 71 Javelin AMX O.O. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan/02/2014 at 3:19pm
Thanks Uncljohn, I'll give him a call and see what he says.  His web site looks like he workes with old car speakers.  The other companies were not that specific.  Maybe I can get the oriognal sound back. He did state that tempuature can affect speakers and with -20 to +100 deg range here, they have experianced that!
 
Steve
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george w View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote george w Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan/03/2014 at 7:03am
There are places that can "rebuild" regular car and older radio speakers. Typically this is a "recone" job where the speaker's paper cone and voice coil are replaced with new. Parts are available for most of the popular sized, american made speakers of that era.
In most cases the recone will restore the speaker to a close approximation of it's performance ( or lack thereof ) when new.

A rebuild of this nature would not really be considered an upgrade however. There may be rare cases where the recone materials may be better than the OEM materials used, but not usually that much better.
More modern "hi-Fi" speakers like the JBL/s and Kenwoods mentioned earlier typically are repaired by "re-foam" kits. This is where the speaker is otherwise OK but the rolled foam rubber outer cone suspension, called the "surround" had deteriorated and is replaced. The remaining critical parts like the speaker's original cone, voice coil and spider are left intact. This is a very common repair procedure for this type of high quality speaker.

The smaller sized car speakers, like the 5-1/4" pincushion round speakers that AMC used, can usually be reconed but it's typically not done because it's not cost effective. These speakers used simple, pressed paper cones and were of low quality even by sixties standards.
These speakers were nothing more than cheap, table radio grade speakers adapted for automotive use. Keep in mind that up through the mid 70's there still was a domestic table radio and home tv/stereo console manufacturing business that sourced their speakers from a handful of OEM domestic speaker maufactuer's that also supplied product to the auto industry. Jensen was probably the best known as they also succesfully manufactured and marketed upgraded aftermarket speakers in the popular 5-1/4 and 6 x 9 sizes. Everyone knew and wanted to upgrade to Jensen "Coaxials" at the time. Other well known domestic OEM speaker suppliers of the era were Rola, the OEM division of Jensen, CTS of Paduca Ky and Becker. I beleive that most of AMC's 5 1/4" speaker product came from Rola/Jensen. There's typically a 3 digit number stamped on the back of the speaker frames or magnet structures that designated the OEM manufacturer.

Currently available aftermarket replacements typically will cost no more and are usually far better in materials and sound performance and are very reasonably priced.
Long time AMC fan. Ambassador 343, AMX 390, Hornet 360, Spirit 304 and Javelin 390. All but javelin bought new.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 71 Javelin AMX O.O. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan/03/2014 at 8:41am
George:
 
I can see what your thought process is.  Why spend money to restore when aftermarket replacements will not cost more and give better sound performance.  I have to decide what I perfer.  Originality and a little better sound, or go with a new speaker that has far better sound performance?  I'll have to see what the rebuilder says.  I know they want business, but you hope that he's honist.
 
Steve
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote amxdreamer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan/03/2014 at 12:16pm
Steve, I purchased and aftermarket 4x10 for my AMX and covered it with grill cloth like the originals were done. You can't tell the difference from above yet the sound is "decent". This is from someone that competed in IASCA (car audio competitions) at a fairly high level (world finals twice - 7th and 9th). There are a few members here that work in the audio field or own shops, hopefully they can also provide some feedback.

The speaker I installed was a 4ohm model so the factory AM/FM will actually be working a little less to power it. Plenty of volume but I barely turn the stereo on, I prefer to hear the music the car makes :)

As you can see in this picture, I used the original wiring harness and installed foam etc. as per the factory and every bracket, screw etc was restored.



Edited by amxdreamer - Jan/03/2014 at 12:23pm
Tony
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george w View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote george w Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan/04/2014 at 6:20pm
Nice job with the new speaker. One note though, if your original speaker was 3.2 ohms then the radio may be working a little less due to the slightly higher rated 4 ohm impedance of the new speaker. On the other hand if the OEM speaker was rated at 8 ohms then your radio could be working a tad harder as the 4 ohm speaker can draw more current from the radio's amp ( though I suspect you know this already with IASCA experience ). Your new speaker is likely to be more efficient than the original as well. Another advantage for the new.

Somewhere in the late 70's to early 80's the speaker/audio industry "rounded up" the impedance ratings so the 3.2 ohm rating kind of went away and 4 ohm became the standard spec. Since the actual working impedance of a speaker varies rather widely one can assume that there's no functional difference between a 3.2 ohm and a 4 ohm speakers.
It's kind of like when the auto industry went from gross hp ratings to the net ratings. The 3.2 rating was probably at or near the minimum rating for the speaker and the 4 ohm is likely the nominal rating. DC resistance will always measure a lower figure than the impedance rating.
Long time AMC fan. Ambassador 343, AMX 390, Hornet 360, Spirit 304 and Javelin 390. All but javelin bought new.
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