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regluing window glass

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Topic: regluing window glass
Posted By: goose
Subject: regluing window glass
Date Posted: May/16/2010 at 3:21am
One of the things that has me confused.. the window glass on my 68 javelin appears to have been glued into the regulators.. or is there something Im missing? (I thought all glass was bolted in)

I need to reattach them as they are barely in the holders.. any suggestions?


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Now how did I end up with 25 5/8" wrenches and 1 9/16"s ??



Replies:
Posted By: tmancusi
Date Posted: May/16/2010 at 6:39am
Originally posted by goose goose wrote:

One of the things that has me confused.. the window glass on my 68 javelin appears to have been glued into the regulators.. or is there something Im missing? (I thought all glass was bolted in)
I need to reattach them as they are barely in the holders.. any suggestions?


Look up this topic thread:
where-to-get-68-javelin-windows-fixed
This should be the URL:
http://theamcforum.com/forum/where-to-get-68-javelin-windows-fixed _topic17319_post155724.html?KW=#155724


Posted By: goose
Date Posted: May/16/2010 at 11:08am
Thanks... I had searched on "regluing windows" ..So after reviewing that thread I have a couple questions, BillD mentions using urethane to glue the glass back in the holders on.. this is all thats wrong with mine,  Both of mine are out of the small channel on the rear only (the channels that attach the glass to the regulator arms). So I will probably redo the front as well. 

1)Is there a brand or specific type of glue I am looking for? im familier with epoxies and such but urethane glue I haven't heard of. 

2) How do you keep from injuring yourself as you beat your head against the wall after the first 3 hours of readjusting the glass?LOL

Thanks again


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Now how did I end up with 25 5/8" wrenches and 1 9/16"s ??


Posted By: billd
Date Posted: May/16/2010 at 11:14am
Search for  javelin window
It's another hot topic. Through 1970 they used an adhesive. In short, clean things up, go to an auto glass place and buy a tube of urethane adhesive. They'll know what to do.........
 


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Posted By: goose
Date Posted: May/16/2010 at 11:18am
HAH HAH !!! Bill you  are too quick for me.. you answered the post as i was posting the questions.. thanks again!



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Now how did I end up with 25 5/8" wrenches and 1 9/16"s ??


Posted By: 73hornut
Date Posted: May/16/2010 at 11:32am
Urethane is the new epoxy, just use that.

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Posted By: amcismeagain
Date Posted: May/17/2010 at 9:19pm
I'd suggest you buy one of the window kits on eBait that connects the two channels together as one solid piece. It will prevent your glass from coming out in the future. I made several sets for fellow AMC owners, and it is the best $50.00 you will ever send on your 68-70 Javelin or AMX. The only better option is to install a set of doors from a 71-74 Javelin.

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Posted By: goose
Date Posted: May/21/2010 at 3:02am
Thank you , Ill take a look and see if I can find them.  I sure dont want to do this again later.

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Now how did I end up with 25 5/8" wrenches and 1 9/16"s ??


Posted By: billd
Date Posted: May/21/2010 at 6:43am
Check out the other threads on this topic.
The issue is twofold:
The grease and lubes in the door get hard, stiff and dry, the window gets hard to crank
and
the adhesive that holds the glass to the brackets lets loose because it's old, not very good to begin with, and, because the grease is hard and stiff and the window is hard to crank.

If you fix it properly with the new adhesives - urethane, and if you clean and lube the window and tracks and adjust things properly, you won't have the issue anyway.
So in short, if you do it right, you don't really need the other quite expensive stuff, it's only a "feel good" or "insurance" thing.
They won't hurt anything, but are more of a crutch in case you don't do the job correctly to begin with. Do it correctly, nothing else is needed.
I've done many many Javelin and other AMC windows over the years - not a one has ever come apart again.
I guess I'm simply saying, IMO, they aren't needed or necessary, but if you have the 50 bucks, there's nothing wrong with 'em either.
(I just have problems paying that much plus shipping for two pieces of aluminum I can buy at Menards for under 20 bucks and use a drill press to put the holes in. The RM thing, I guess.)


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Posted By: FuzzFace2
Date Posted: May/21/2010 at 8:44am
Originally posted by amcismeagain amcismeagain wrote:

I'd suggest you buy one of the window kits on eBait that connects the two channels together as one solid piece. It will prevent your glass from coming out in the future. I made several sets for fellow AMC owners, and it is the best $50.00 you will ever send on your 68-70 Javelin or AMX. The only better option is to install a set of doors from a 71-74 Javelin.

Must be talking about the tie bars like in the pictures below?

http://cars.grantskingdom.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=2099&g2_serialNumber=2 - http://cars.grantskingdom.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=2099&g2_serialNumber=2

 

http://cars.grantskingdom.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=2123&g2_serialNumber=2 - http://cars.grantskingdom.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=2123&g2_serialNumber=2

 

I have a post some where on here of what I had to do to make them work. This was a kit I bought many years ago but only installed on the channels last year. They are not installed in the doors as I am redoing the whole car.

As Bill said you have to clean all the old hard grease out of the tracks so it works smoothly. After I did the tie bar to channels I took every thing to a auto glass shop and had them glue it all together.

Dave ----



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TSM = Technical Service Manual

75 Gremlin X v8 for sale
70 Javelin 360/auto drag car
70 Javelin 360/T5 Street car


Posted By: amc-rookie
Date Posted: Jul/05/2010 at 10:20am
Searched quickly for some tips on re-gluing window glass.
Here's where we are:
1968 Javelin. Drivers door is the issue. Door is off car, window out, as well as window shoes. We have the aluminum bar kit to tie the shoes together. Tracks/channels cna be dropped.
Questions: Do we need to mount the door to accurately locate the glass in/on the shoes? If not, is it just glue the glass in, dry and assemble? We realize the door needs to be mounted to get the glass aligned with the roof rubber. Also, that kit seems to make the shoes thicker, does that cause a problem in use?
Thanks for the help!

Dave


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Project finally underway! near-basket case 1968 AMX #2789 was 290/auto will be 343/auto

Son's car 1968 Javelin 6cyl/3 speed


Posted By: FuzzFace2
Date Posted: Jul/05/2010 at 12:06pm

Below is what I have gotten over the years for gluing the channels back on. If you get them too far forward or back they will not bolt in the door right. Ask how I know, race car I did not have the measurements then.

I have the tie kit on my street car glass but have not installed the glass in the doors yet, will be some time yet. As said clean the tracks & rollers of ALL old grease & dirt. Also when gluing the make sure you space the glass in the channel side to side and should not sit on the bottom of channel or the glass will not go up to the roof seal.

 

Installed the glass sat, the dimensions I used should be good as I used the old glue lines as reference and the window fit great.
 
13 3/8" from the rear edge of glass to the front of the rear channel, then 26 1/8" to the rear of the front  channel, and ended up 12 11/16" between the two channels.

Dave ----



-------------
TSM = Technical Service Manual

75 Gremlin X v8 for sale
70 Javelin 360/auto drag car
70 Javelin 360/T5 Street car


Posted By: billd
Date Posted: Jul/05/2010 at 12:20pm
You need to change from "last 6 months" to anytime, and use the advance search. There's a lot of threads on this, including some very lengthy threads with great detail
That tie is IMO paranoia insurance, as if everything it maintained and done correctly from time one, you won't have issues again - ESPECIALLY with the modern urethane adhesives used now.
Yeah, the old factory stuff let loose from time to time, especially if the grease got dry and hard and the owner kept using the window anyway. But with the modern materials, if it's done correctly (key words there, with clean being gospel) it's going to stay as long as you want it to.
You need to put the glass back how it came out............................FF has measurements that work, but ideally, you'll be able to measure using the "stains" and marks on the glass from the old materials.
CLEAN that glass - the last step JUST prior to assembly with urethane glass adhesive (about 12-13 bucks from any auto glass place) is to clean the glass AGAIN with acetone. Clean the channel in the glass "shoe" - again, last minute cleaning with acetone. DON'T touch the edge of the glass again after cleaning.
 
This is the key:
>> I used the old glue lines as reference and the window fit great<<
 
Yup - that's what I've done in every car (mostly Javelins) I've ever repaired windows in.
No need to mount the door - the factory sure didn't! The glass was glued into its supports before any car was ever put together. They didn't custom-assemble each door glass for a specific car - thus all the adjustments.
And you will go crazy with final adjustments - it can literally take minutes - or as in many cases, several HOURS to get it right.
My passanger side is perfect, the left is good but you can't roll the window clear up with the door closed (so plan ahead, or pull over and stop to roll the window up)
I don't have the patience for such adjustments, and it looks and seals fine with it up and the door closed, so i've never bothered..............


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Posted By: amc-rookie
Date Posted: Jul/10/2010 at 2:21pm
Alright, laid out the pieces and parts to get this together and have more questions than answers. I hate to be a PITA, but probably only want to do this once.
The glass, at the bottom is 42-1/16" long, rear shoe (to the point) is 13-1/8, the front shoe is 16-5/16; if the rear of the rear shoe and the front of the front shoe are tight to the ends of the glass, it leaves 12-5/8" between shoes. I guess that's close to 12-11/16". However, the 26-1/8" suggested front shoe dimension is more like 26. Sound logical? Metal extending past glass sounds bad, IMO.
Also, the front shoe appears to be lined with thin rubber, which centers the glass, the rear is missing this. Is this needed to keep glass centered? Seems like without it, the new adhesive needs to fill a larger gap. Adhesive on both sides of rubber, or just one?
Seems so easy, yet.... puzzling at the same time.
Thanks in advance.
Dave


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Project finally underway! near-basket case 1968 AMX #2789 was 290/auto will be 343/auto

Son's car 1968 Javelin 6cyl/3 speed


Posted By: FuzzFace2
Date Posted: Jul/10/2010 at 5:12pm

Yea channel past the end of glass is bad as I have never seen any like that.

So you are saying with the measurements given 1 of the channels are off the end of the glass? Do you have 1 side you can check for measurments?

As for the “rubber” what you may be seeing is the felt glue strips. This was wrapped around the glass and the channel pushed on till seated. This is what kept the glass centered & off the bottom of the channel. With it in place I don’t think you will be able to get the glass back in the channel.

 

When I did my drag car glass some one over the years had used some thing else that was rock hard. The glass shop told me to clean it all out before they glued the glass back in.

I found my 4” grinder with a knotted flat wire wheel would fit in the channel, I just ran it down 1 end to the other and it was like new. The shop did not center the glass or put some thing to keep the glass up a bit off the bottom. They did have measurements that I went with, at the time I had none, and when I installed the glass found they where not right. When I did my street car I used a tie bar kit I bought for this car and I marked the glass what channels went with what glass, and side went out and the ends of the glass where the channels went. They did center & blocked up the glass in the channels I just have not installed the glass to say how they fit.

Dave ----


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TSM = Technical Service Manual

75 Gremlin X v8 for sale
70 Javelin 360/auto drag car
70 Javelin 360/T5 Street car


Posted By: amc-rookie
Date Posted: Jul/14/2010 at 1:06pm
Should I re-use the felt, or get some new stuff? Without it, nothing accurately locates the glass in the pane (centered). It seems like too much gap for the urethane to hold.
Thanks,
Dave


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Project finally underway! near-basket case 1968 AMX #2789 was 290/auto will be 343/auto

Son's car 1968 Javelin 6cyl/3 speed


Posted By: billd
Date Posted: Jul/14/2010 at 2:08pm
Urethane. Keep the glass centered with narrow strips of the original "tape".
The urethane will work just fine.
I put 3 strips of original tape - in the middle and one near each end.
That centered it in the bracket and kept the glass off the bottom as well. In other words, it set the glass right where it would have been factory. The urethane will setup and hold like crazy.
(It helps that I have a couple rolls of the original stuff here, well, one roll and a small part of another, left over from those years ago.)


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Posted By: FuzzFace2
Date Posted: Jul/14/2010 at 5:10pm

They say Popsicle sticks work good too and who doesn’t want a popsicle on a hot day Thumbs Up

Dave ----



-------------
TSM = Technical Service Manual

75 Gremlin X v8 for sale
70 Javelin 360/auto drag car
70 Javelin 360/T5 Street car


Posted By: amc-rookie
Date Posted: Jul/15/2010 at 6:33am
I thought it made sense to use pieces of the original to center.
Thanks!
We'll give this window repair thing a shot next!

Dave


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Project finally underway! near-basket case 1968 AMX #2789 was 290/auto will be 343/auto

Son's car 1968 Javelin 6cyl/3 speed


Posted By: 348AMX
Date Posted: Sep/16/2010 at 11:15am
I did this to my 68AMX about 7 years ago and the drivers window at that time was completely out of the track..I used 3M window weld adhesive after cleaning out all the old dried up factory sealant...removed and greased the rails and regulator and reisntalled the glass with tracks after it had cured...adjusted the gaps for a near perfect seal with the window rolled up..the seal is SUPER strong...still tight as a drum...I doubt I will ever have a problem again with the windows for as long as I own the car. I used magnetic strips cut to fit into the channels to adjsut the height of the glass as it sat in the channels and then filled the channels with the adhesive and set the glass. Worked like a charm...when you gut the channels you do remove the factory "lining" wich caused the glass to sit lower than originally but it isnt hard to make up the distance. if you dont the glass may have a gap when fully rolled up with the door shut.


Posted By: celtic5119
Date Posted: Oct/08/2010 at 6:20pm
I'm attempting to reinstall/reglue the dvr/passenger windows in my 69 amx. Rolling the window  up when the bottom of the window is 2" below full height, the rear channel tilts up binds and prevents maximum height extension.  Regulator arms appear properly shaped and not bent inappropriately. What am I doing wrong? No I have NOT glued the windows in & wouldn't do so until proper height  & fore aft adjustments made.Cry      

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celticamc


Posted By: 69 ambassador 390
Date Posted: Oct/08/2010 at 6:35pm
TSM shows how to adjust the glass and regulators.  At least my 1969 does.  Look in the back under body.

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Steve Brown

Algonac, Mi.

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Posted By: billd
Date Posted: Oct/08/2010 at 8:59pm
Glue the window into the proper place.
THEN adjust it.
It can take a full day, honestly. And yes, the 68-70 TSMs do show the proceedure.
There's measurements in here that fuzzface (Dave) and someone else provided and instructions on glueing the glass in.
Get that done, reinstall the glass and then adjust it.
OTherwise, it's an exercise in futility, IMO.
You won't get the adjustments done in 30 minutes, even using the TSM, and if you do - I've got a car for you to work on! LOL
You remove the glass and the holders/shoes/brackets that the glass glues into. You follow the proceedures outlined here in at least two good threads on getting the glass glued back in. Then you reinstall that assembly AFTER cleaning out all of the old grease and gunk and re-lubing everything, THEN adjust.


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Posted By: celtic5119
Date Posted: Oct/17/2010 at 11:11am
What do you reccomend for reglueing-laying the glass/shoes on a flat surface, make a stand and do it so the glass is vertical or?

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celticamc


Posted By: hoosieramc
Date Posted: Oct/17/2010 at 11:58am
http://www.amx-perience.com/DoorAdjustmentDiagram.htm -
 
http://www.amx-perience.com/DoorAdjustmentDiagram.htm
 
 
 
AMX Door Adjustment Diagram


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Posted By: billd
Date Posted: Oct/17/2010 at 4:25pm
Originally posted by celtic5119 celtic5119 wrote:

What do you reccomend for reglueing-laying the glass/shoes on a flat surface, make a stand and do it so the glass is vertical or?
 
Like said either in this thread or another on the same topic, I used strips of the old-style "window tape" I have to use as spacers,
I put the urethane adhesive in, and let them stand leaned against my bench or sawhorses, padded the glass with old blankets in case a cat came in, etc.
The strips of "tape" held the window centered in the bracket, and just off the bottom the correct amount, and the adhesive flowed in around, especially with them standing upright.
Re-gluing is easy, adjusting is a @#$%$%


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Posted By: mrblatzman
Date Posted: Oct/18/2010 at 6:30am
I still need to do the one shoe on my 68, and I have thought about a different approach....What do you think???   Window out of car, the original black stuff is still in the shoe and will slide back over the glass and into the original location with no problem...Why not use superglue or glue that holds on the rearview mirror to the windshield instead of all this additional work....It seems this should work...anybody tried it????   Bob Reno in Alabama

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Thankyou....Bob


Posted By: billd
Date Posted: Oct/18/2010 at 6:48am
Won't work on porous or soft materials like the goo that's left in there, and you can't get it clean enough.......... glass, yes, but not the other goo that's in there.
I've used and tried various materials and methods over the years, the only thing I trust any more is the urethane, and at that, things need to be clean.


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Posted By: mrblatzman
Date Posted: Oct/18/2010 at 8:49am
Well shucks...Its sounded good in theory...Thanks for your input...Bob Reno in Alabama

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Thankyou....Bob


Posted By: adrewdavies
Date Posted: Aug/11/2011 at 12:01pm

In any case you can refer to the http://www.threeriversautoglass.com - Auto Glass Repair Specialists from http://www.threeriversautoglass.com - Three Rivers Auto Glass of Pittsburgh specializes in auto glass repair and replacement for cracked or chipped car glass and affordable window tinting. 


Posted By: amcglass
Date Posted: Dec/11/2011 at 5:28pm
NAPA has some   epoxy glue I used for my windows and held well.... they have different strengths and settings    form 1 minute to 10 minute setting time    I used the 3 minute

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Javmanpres

BBG Mark Donohue 401

74 Jav/AMX
71 Matador 2dr sedan delivery wagon
1902 Rambler Runabout     


Posted By: amcglass
Date Posted: Dec/11/2011 at 5:31pm
nice 70 Javelin     lm a new member  just checking it out right now

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Javmanpres

BBG Mark Donohue 401

74 Jav/AMX
71 Matador 2dr sedan delivery wagon
1902 Rambler Runabout     


Posted By: amcglass
Date Posted: Dec/11/2011 at 5:37pm
good advise     Clap

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Javmanpres

BBG Mark Donohue 401

74 Jav/AMX
71 Matador 2dr sedan delivery wagon
1902 Rambler Runabout     


Posted By: 348AMX
Date Posted: May/09/2012 at 11:30pm
   I filled the channels with 3M window weld on my drivers side AMX door 7 years ago and the window in there is super solid still. I couldnt get the glass out now without removing it and the channel as an assembly....it will probably last 20 more years before comming loose again.


Posted By: pairadice
Date Posted: Jul/25/2012 at 1:58am
the urethane for windows is specific for windows and can be picked up at any parts store or paint supply store.  usually comes in a tube like bathroom caulk. works great but can be pretty messy.


Posted By: OzJavelin2
Date Posted: Aug/26/2012 at 7:04pm
Well .. it's finally happend.  Went to wind up the window in my '69 Javelin .. felt some resistance but kept winding, then the front of the window dropped.  After pulling off the panel I realised what happened.  I've owned this car for over ten years and been expecting this day.
Question though regarding the spacing of the window in the brackets.  I can see there seems to be some sought of material spacing the window in the brackets?  Do I just remove ALL the material, space the window with "something" then fill with urethane adhesive?


Posted By: OzJavelin2
Date Posted: Sep/04/2012 at 4:53pm
Originally posted by OzJavelin2 OzJavelin2 wrote:

Well .. it's finally happend.  Went to wind up the window in my '69 Javelin .. felt some resistance but kept winding, then the front of the window dropped.  After pulling off the panel I realised what happened.  I've owned this car for over ten years and been expecting this day.
Question though regarding the spacing of the window in the brackets.  I can see there seems to be some sought of material spacing the window in the brackets?  Do I just remove ALL the material, space the window with "something" then fill with urethane adhesive?

Done .. twice .. after I realised I left one of the guides off and had to pull the whole mechanism to get it back in.  Adjustment is good (not spot-on but close enough).  Only issue I had was finding white lithium grease .. I couldn't get it for love nor money locally, so I just used normal lithium grease.  I'll pull it apart again later and regrease when I find it.


Posted By: JOE S
Date Posted: Dec/01/2012 at 1:22pm
I will be reglueing the door glass as part of my 68 AMX resto project..The glass in my car was reglued by someone years ago and the location of the channels was not correct. The windows never operated properly or sealed correctly.. I have read through the thread and fuzz face listed dimensions for the placement of the glass into the front and rear channels.. I believe that his car was a javelin.. Are these dimensions the same for AMX.. Also has anyone used these dimensions and are they correct..It is also pointed out that the glass should not sit on the bottom of the channel..how thick should the spacer be to keep the glass off the bottom of the channel..

Joe



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