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M-12 to GM 700R4 Swap
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SC397 View Drop Down
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Points: 5480 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SC397 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/03/2023 at 6:13pm
Ermm


Edited by SC397 - Apr/03/2023 at 8:57pm
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Gadgetman1 View Drop Down
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Points: 74 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gadgetman1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/03/2023 at 6:19pm
I’m not understanding your use of the word “pilot”.  I don’t know what a 727 is.  All of these adapters are not listing the 390 engine, but they do mention the 360 & the 401.  This is about as clear as pea soup to me.  What I’m trying to do, is upgrade to a more modern transmission that allows for less RPMs & better fuel mileage on the highway.
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Points: 462 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RandyB Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/03/2023 at 6:30pm
PLEASE STOP!!!!!

This thread is about BW to GM transmissions, stop posting about 727 transmissions.  Stay on topic
Randy B
68 Javelin SST 343
73 Charger Rallye 340 triple Blk
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Points: 63 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NTX Javelin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/03/2023 at 6:54pm
Gadgetman

first thing i wanted to do with my 68 Javelin 343, was replace the bad m-11b with a 700r-4 or 4L60e.
I soon found that there is no off the shelf "kit" out there as of today that will let you just swap one in.

the 290, 343, 390 with the flat crank flange makes it harder.
but it can be done, just a matter of getting several different adapter kits.

See the parts from previous posts.
you need a crankshaft flange adapter.
bellhousing adapter.
drilled and balanced flexplate.

and what about the crossmember?  the GM is longer
68 Javelin SST 343 Auto
68 Javelin SST 290 3sp
69 Javelin Base 343 Auto

all projects
just getting started
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What I’m trying to understand is if the top adapter will allow a 727 to be ram behind a flat crank why can’t the GM shim be put in it and run a GM trans. I have an original flange adapter that requires the flat crank to machined. I also have the second adapter pictured to run a GM on a late crank, and a jw bell for a power glide. I’ve just neve put eyes on the adapter with the crank spacer
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SC397 View Drop Down
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Points: 5480 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SC397 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/03/2023 at 8:54pm
Originally posted by Gadgetman1 Gadgetman1 wrote:

I’m not understanding your use of the word “pilot”. 
The torque converter on any engine has to locate or "pilot" to the center of the crankshaft.  The torque converter bolts just fasten the torque converter to the flex plate.  The torque converter bolts do not center the torque converter to the crankshaft.  The 390 engine has a small 1 1/4" pilot hole in the back of the crank shaft just like all of the AMC V8's up until 1972.

 I don’t know what a 727 is.  It the transmission that AMC used from 1972 and later.

All of these adapters are not listing the 390 engine.  They won't but the 360 and 401 have the same bolt pattern as a 390

This is about as clear as pea soup to me.  What I’m trying to do, is upgrade to a more modern transmission that allows for less RPMs & better fuel mileage on the highway.
There is no direct kit to do that without some engineering.
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Points: 630 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote 6t8amxetc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/03/2023 at 10:32pm
Originally posted by SC397 SC397 wrote:

Originally posted by Gadgetman1 Gadgetman1 wrote:

I’m not understanding your use of the word “pilot”. 
The torque converter on any engine has to locate or "pilot" to the center of the crankshaft.  The torque converter bolts just fasten the torque converter to the flex plate.  The torque converter bolts do not center the torque converter to the crankshaft.  The 390 engine has a small 1 1/4" pilot hole in the back of the crank shaft just like all of the AMC V8's up until 1972.

 I don’t know what a 727 is.  It the transmission that AMC used from 1972 and later.

All of these adapters are not listing the 390 engine.  They won't but the 360 and 401 have the same bolt pattern as a 390

This is about as clear as pea soup to me.  What I’m trying to do, is upgrade to a more modern transmission that allows for less RPMs & better fuel mileage on the highway.
There is no direct kit to do that without some engineering.


Well maybe one of you should just buy the kit I have listed here for sale and I'll send it to Rick so he can engineer/machine a torque converter spacer! Then everyone can know the answers!!
I'm sure Rick has lots of free time for that little project. Smile 
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SC397 View Drop Down
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Points: 5480 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SC397 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/04/2023 at 5:58am
Originally posted by 6t8amxetc 6t8amxetc wrote:

Originally posted by SC397 SC397 wrote:

Originally posted by Gadgetman1 Gadgetman1 wrote:

I’m not understanding your use of the word “pilot”. 
The torque converter on any engine has to locate or "pilot" to the center of the crankshaft.  The torque converter bolts just fasten the torque converter to the flex plate.  The torque converter bolts do not center the torque converter to the crankshaft.  The 390 engine has a small 1 1/4" pilot hole in the back of the crank shaft just like all of the AMC V8's up until 1972.

 I don’t know what a 727 is.  It the transmission that AMC used from 1972 and later.

All of these adapters are not listing the 390 engine.  They won't but the 360 and 401 have the same bolt pattern as a 390

This is about as clear as pea soup to me.  What I’m trying to do, is upgrade to a more modern transmission that allows for less RPMs & better fuel mileage on the highway.
There is no direct kit to do that without some engineering.


Well maybe one of you should just buy the kit I have listed here for sale and I'll send it to Rick so he can engineer/machine a torque converter spacer! Then everyone can know the answers!!
I'm sure Rick has lots of free time for that little project. Smile 

Correction... He should buy the 904/727/A500/AW4 adapter kit and and find a A500 or AW4 out of a 4L Jeep and directly bolt it to the 390 and not dick around with a GM transmission that is made for a GM engine.
Common sense people..



Edited by SC397 - Apr/04/2023 at 6:35am
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Points: 410 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote amcguru Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/04/2023 at 7:38am
Common sense isn't so common anymore

NAMDRA #3646

"I believe the best social program is a job" ~ Ronald Reagan
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Points: 2726 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Buzzman72 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/04/2023 at 7:42am
There isn't a direct bolt-up kit between the non-Nailhead GM transmission and the '71-back AMC V8.

If you use what's "available," first you add a crank adapter and a bellhousing spacer to adapt the Gen 2 engine to the Chrysler trans with an AMC bellhousing.

Then you add the kit which adapts the crank flange to the GM trans and adds ANOTHER spacer between the block and bellhousing...or more correctly, between the FIRST bellhousing spacer and the transmission.

And your GM trans gets connected, but half a car length behind the engine.

Rube Goldberg would've loved it. 

But YOU won't. In most AMCs, it's already tight between the firewall and the upper transmission bolts.


Edited by Buzzman72 - Apr/04/2023 at 7:44am
Buzzman72...void where prohibited, your mileage may vary, objects in mirror may be closer than they appear, and alcohol may intensify any side effects.
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