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Custom performance oriented front brakes

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343sharpstick View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 343sharpstick Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Custom performance oriented front brakes
    Posted: Jan/18/2021 at 6:45pm
I started to build a brake upgrade using the new larger ARGO 'pacer' spindles.
These new spindles share the same geometry as a Mustang II. So there are all sorts of aftermarket options that will fit these spindles.

As as example of the size difference, the large diameter on the stock spindle is 1.24. The new spindle diameter is 1.37.

On the new spindle, I'm planning on using the Wilwood Pro hub, and the Wilwood GT48 curved vane 12.72 x 1.25 rotor. This will require a 16-inch or larger wheel.

Then for the Caliper I'm looking to use the Wilwood Forged Superlite Internal 4 Caliper. It's huge, and been a bit of a challenge to fit.

I prototyped the caliper bracket in wood, and will have that machined in aluminum.

When it's all done I'll have the same spacing from the knuckle mounting surface to the wheel mounting surface as my previous brake package, the Aerospace brakes kit. So I'll be able to use the same wheels.

These spindles will provide other much less expensive custom options as well for those trying to upgrade brakes.

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343sharpstick View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 343sharpstick Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan/18/2021 at 7:02pm
I have manual brakes, and recently installed the new 15/16 Wilwood master cylinder with tandem reservoirs and the Wilwood adjustable proportioning valve.
I did need to remote mount the rear tank, so that was a bit of a PITA.
On my last outing I found it works nicely, but still need to adjust for more rear brake bias.




Edited by 343sharpstick - Jan/18/2021 at 7:08pm
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tomj View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tomj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan/18/2021 at 11:46pm
Nice work! Can't wait to see the completion.

I'm not aware of the Argo/pacer spindles... will go look up!

1960 Rambler Super two-door wagon, OHV auto
1961 Roadster American, 195.6 OHV, T5
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tomj View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tomj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan/18/2021 at 11:48pm
Are you using the Argo steering arms? Are the bolt-on compatible with the "AMC spindle" base and Packer knuckle?!


1960 Rambler Super two-door wagon, OHV auto
1961 Roadster American, 195.6 OHV, T5
http://www.ramblerLore.com

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farna View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote farna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan/19/2021 at 7:26am
What bearing set does the ARGO spindle use? I'm assuming it's the old "Big Bendix" bearing set that AMC used 75-76 on all, 77-78 on the Matador and Pacer. Hmmm... Pacer may have used it until the end, as did the Matador.
Frank Swygert
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343sharpstick View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 343sharpstick Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan/19/2021 at 9:38am
I'm using stock 1970 and later steering knuckles, with the 1969 steering arm.
It's mix and match like legos.

I've not had a factory Matador or Pacer spindle, only this aftermarket unit. I think it's safe to say that both use the Mustang II dimensions, which may not be common knowledge?

The Argo spindle has an inner bearing shaft OD of 1.3775 and outer bearing shaft OD of .8656. I am using the Wilwood bearing kit 370-0884 and 370-0882.

There may be uses for this new part within the AMC community in addition to what I've done.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Red Devil Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan/19/2021 at 2:27pm
McIntire Machine (Sp??) sold a kit several years ago using the 12.19" x 1.25" 8-bolt rotors and the Superlite caliper. A couple pictures someone posted of a trunnion car.




The Argo spindle looks to have same dimensions as the AMC big spindle, as Farna commented. Ford bearings fit (same cones). AMC used different cups in their hubs, so different Set#s. Spacing is close to a couple Ford hub options.

I considered the option of incorporating the caliper bracket into a lowering plate, but never built anything … time and lack of motivation got the better of me. Good to see you making progress!

Someone posted a model of a Wilwood Superlite caliper on GrabCAD if you have solid modeling software.



Edit: Added picture of AMC lowering plate/caliper bracket combo with Superlite caliper and 8-bolt rotor

Hope this helps, RD.

Edited by Red Devil - Jan/19/2021 at 2:58pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Javelin_GT Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan/19/2021 at 3:20pm
I bought a set up from Argo to experiment with using a race hub like this on the front of the race car.  Ended up using GN spindles and hubs but may revisit this one day.

Mustang II and Pinto are the same dimensions.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote farna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan/19/2021 at 3:58pm
I recall someone using Ford Mustang II rotors on an AMC spindle, but I think that is the more common smaller spindle, not the "Big Bendix" spindle. Everything AMC made, disc and drum brakes, used the same spindle dimensions (as far as the bearings and where they ride on the spindle -- mounting base thickness varied) EXCEPT the 75-78 models. Although 77-78 Hornets and Gremlins used the smaller caliper, they still used the big bearing set, making those rotors the hardest to find and most expensive when you do. The first Scarebird disc conversion used Ford Ranger rotors with Ford bearings. I don't have the list of parts handy, but I'm pretty sure they were the standard Ford ranger bearings, and the same as used on Mustang II (and earlier Mustangs). There was a small spacer ring required for the seal on the rotor that also pushed the inner bearing out slightly, so the Ford spindles must have been a little shorter than the AMC spindle... by about 3/16" IIRC.
Frank Swygert
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Amx68 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan/19/2021 at 8:53pm
Farna, I've had that style Scarebird 'kit' waiting since 2009. I have a picture of the parts list but no way to post it currently. 

It listed 95-97 Ranger rwd 2-wheel abs rotors and same year inner bearing/seal, and the Javelin outer bearing. And the 90 Celebrity calipers/pads. 
1968 Amx - Was 390/4spd, will have mild 360/5spd T5 (project)

1999 Jeep Cherokee Limited - 4.0L Auto, 3-link front, 6.5" lift, 36" Swampers, locked front/rear, 4.56 gears, doorless, etc. Wheeled & DD
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