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Corelation Between Dash VIN # and Door Plate? |
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5_AMXS
AMC Nut Joined: Jan/08/2011 Location: Chicagoland Status: Offline Points: 270 |
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Posted: Jul/19/2013 at 11:24am |
I sure this is in the forum, but perhaps I can get a quick answer: What's the correlation between the VIN number on the Dashboard and the Metal Door Tag - aside from the: Body Type, Model, Trim and Paint.
What are the Stamped numbers at the base of the metal door plate. I'm aware that for the 70's models the VIN was printed on a Sticker.
Thanks
Scott
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whizkidder
Supporter of TheAMCForum Joined: Mar/03/2008 Location: North Georgia Status: Offline Points: 2972 |
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On my 70, the sticker has the VIN and the build sequence number from the bottom of the door plate. Ties the VIN of the car to the sequence it came down the line.
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Ron Frost
marne1ancient @ gmail.com 910 nine two two 0563 "There is no limit to what a man can do, so long as he does not care a straw who gets credit for it. Charles Montague |
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304-dude
AMC Addicted Joined: Sep/29/2008 Location: Central Illinoi Status: Offline Points: 9082 |
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For me and most others, the build sequence does not truly indicate VIN sequence. They are two separate numbers. The body build number can be in reverse order compared to VIN. Though there are times when two sequential VIN cars may have sequential build numbers. So don't expect to be able to process the last numbers of a VIN from a body build number.
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whizkidder
Supporter of TheAMCForum Joined: Mar/03/2008 Location: North Georgia Status: Offline Points: 2972 |
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I didn't say it ties the sequences together -- it ties the VIN to the build sequence for that car. Can help confirm that the VIN is correct for the car (or at least the door) that the door plate is on.
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Ron Frost
marne1ancient @ gmail.com 910 nine two two 0563 "There is no limit to what a man can do, so long as he does not care a straw who gets credit for it. Charles Montague |
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mramc
AMC Addicted Joined: Jul/12/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 3219 |
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* I'll take the second question first. AMC had 3 body plants: Lakefront, Milwaukee,& Kenosha Main but only two final assembly lines: East & West. The number at the bottom of the door plate will start with either E for east or W for west and then the number from the start on that line that the car was made. you had to have some system to have 3 body plants feed into 2 assembly lines. Ok, first question: the US government standardized the VIN system in the mid to late 1960's There are several places that break down the AMC VINs on both this forum and several other places on the web. AMC stopped using engine serial numbers in 1959. AMC used an engine day build code. The only part of that which usually carries over to the VIN is the code letter for the engine for the engine displacement, But there are several exceptions to that. The engine code letter is the 7th character in the VIN and usually matches the letter on the valve cover engine day build code tag. Then an AMX is 30 series car or a model 6939-7 and the 397 carries over as part VIN . that is on the door plate. So, unlike the other 3 US auto companies who used engine serial numbers there is little to match on the tag codes & VIN Tags , so per say IMHO there is no such thing as a Matching Numbers AMC. There just are not real numbers that match in total. Four numbers match at most. LRDaum |
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LRDaum
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5_AMXS
AMC Nut Joined: Jan/08/2011 Location: Chicagoland Status: Offline Points: 270 |
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Thanks Mr AMC. Two questions- one for clairity and one new. Examples from my tag.
1. E0479XX - What exactly does that mean? Is that the number of sequential cars made that year?
2. Body: R019409 is that the number of this "body-type" made that year?
This particular question relates to a 69 AMX BSO w/ Leather interior.
Thanks!
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5 AMX's
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amx39068
Supporter of TheAMCForum Joined: Feb/21/2008 Location: Arizona Status: Offline Points: 11576 |
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E stands for East line and the other numbers are the sequence number of your car's build. VINs were assigned when the order for the car was placed resulting in oddball optioned cars that took longer to build due to unique configurations frequently having a lower VIN with a higher sequence number.
Edited by amx39068 - Jul/19/2013 at 7:37pm |
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Dan Curtis-Owner and CEO AZ AMC Restorations; Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/amcmusclecars/ & Curtis Real Estate Development
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348AMX
AMC Addicted Joined: Jul/03/2007 Location: Massachusetts Status: Offline Points: 4165 |
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The only part of that which usually carries over to the VIN is the code letter for the engine for the engine displacement, But there are several exceptions to that. The engine code letter is the 7th character in the VIN and usually matches the letter on the valve cover engine day build code tag. Then an AMX is 30 series car or a model 6939-7 and the 397 carries over as part VIN . that is on the door plate. Four numbers match at most. LRDaum
[/QUOTE] Not numbers matching in the same way that a big three car is numbers matching...but you just summed up what a "numbers matching" AMX would be made up of; here are some examples:, ...the model series; obviously if you have an amx door tag on a javelin or the other way around, its not a numbers matching car anymore; the engine, obviously if the vin has a 390 code, and the car had a 304 swapped in, its not a numbers matching car anymore, the model year,(same deal if its different than its not a numbers matching car anymore). The assembly line location, and the serial number, and body number, can all be approximated to be the original numbers that were put on the tag when the car was being assembled. The door tag is chronologically related to the vin in the vast majority of the cars out there and there are enough documented examples of original vins and serial numbers that have been listed throughout the net to be able to tell if a door tag is matching to the vin and car, and of course via the options codes on the tag. So if you have a VIN ending in 350,XXX and the body number is 24,000 its WAY WAY off, and thats not a numbers matching car anymore. Other individual component production dates in several places on the cars should preceed the estimated build date extrapolated from the VIN sequence and door tag serial numbers...if there are dates that came after, than its not numbers matching. In my opinion and all original AMX will definately have enough production infor on the car to call it numbers matching....AMC style of course My 2 cents. Edited by 348AMX - Jul/19/2013 at 8:56pm |
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mramc
AMC Addicted Joined: Jul/12/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 3219 |
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1. E0479XX - What exactly does that mean? Is that the number of sequential cars made that year?
E is for the east assembly line. W is for the west assembly line. AMC called it a sequential assembly line number. The 0479XX is the number from the start of the year on that line the car was produced. East line produced the small cars : Gremlin,Hornet, American, Javelin & AMX. West line did the big cars: Matador/Classic/Rebel , Ambassador & Marlin East door final assembly line West door final assembly line The building was built circa 1943/1944 to product air craft engines and AMC used it for alignment, repair and storage of new car. The door have since I took this photo been completely covered over last I saw. But the cars were all driven out these two former doors and into an open storage yard. Second question next. LRDaum |
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LRDaum
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mramc
AMC Addicted Joined: Jul/12/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 3219 |
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2. Body: R019409 is that the number of this "body-type" made that year?
I'd like to give you a good answer to this question unfortunately AMC was never good at documentation on any thing they built. They were generally in to knowing how much of what they needed of what ever to schedule for production then making one of one cars. Discounting the Canadian AMC plant that used only the car bodies it built. AMC had 3 body plants feeding into two final assembly lines. Some years of body building have a letter denoting which plant built which body, some years don't. Kenosha main used we believe K or none at all depending on the year. The Lakefront plant came on line circa 1962 and is believed to have started with 000001 then, and used L to start the body number. Kenosha main may have restarted with one then also. It is believed that the Milwaukee body plant also may have restarted with one also for the body number when the third body plant Lakefront came on line to keep thing straight. Milwaukee's body numbers are believed to start with M for Milwaukee. (Milwaukee was the old NASH Seaman's body plant.)To top it off there also seems to be an R and A used for body numbers. The R and A may have been used at Lakefront. Milwaukee got the over flow or the slow seller. Most of the Ambassador bodies were built there, in Milwaukee. Some years Hornet would sell very well so they build extra Hornet bodies in Milwaukee. I know the Lakefront plant build all the Renault Alliance bodies . Lakefront build all the Pacer bodies. And before that the last of the Javelin body production was moved to Milwaukee to make way for remodeling Lakefront to build the Pacer bodies. So, it is with in reason that the R was used for Lakefront during that period and most if not all of the Javelin and AMX bodies were build at Lakefront. The known 1970 Javelin and AMX body numbers seem to be from Tom Benvie's documentation seem to jive at 32,326 built. So, a brief word on Bodies In White , or the basic steel body shell. I'm assuming that the AMC factory did not consider the Javelin and AMX BIW to be that different. Just 12 inches out of the rear floor pan and different rear quarter panels. Fairly simple in terms of body building. Ok, so I'll make one other assumption here on the body NUMBER itself. That being if the basic body did not changed, no new quarter panel or sheet metal changes that AMC just kept build the bodies with out starting back at one. That would account for some of the larger body number on some volume models like Rambler Americans being a good example. The basic shell of the 1966 to 1969 did not change in those year. You have different trim and grilles , and upholstery but the basic shell remained the same. This is the way I think AMC did this. But you may noticed the qualifiers in this. Because I'm not 100% sure. But it's a pretty good theory at this point sans more documentation. LRDaum |
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LRDaum
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