Your donations help keep this valuable resource free and growing. Thank you.
|
1965 195.6 oil filter |
Post Reply | Page <1234> |
Author | |||
tomj
AMC Addicted Joined: Jan/27/2010 Location: earth Status: Offline Points: 7522 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||
Ron, I somehow never saw this thread nor your elegant solution. I reinvented a similar solution, but your cover looks a lot cleaner. Is it a milled block? Did you resolve your head oil seep? Where's seep from? Along the plug/pump side? What's the plug on the front edge of the cover for? I am about to make another full-flow pump, I was thinkign about some means to prime the pump, a plug or maybe a zerk for a grease gun (since Zerks have a check valve). As Frank says it needs sealer along the oil-drain side. I had one engine with a number of small but annoying seeps along that long edge. The engine was otherwise fine and I didn't want to pull it and buy another headgasket. I cleaned the crack out as good as I could with a can of spray carb cleaner (ruined the paint), then sealed it externally with JB Weld. It ends up being a very thin layer, not visible. Then I repainted that side. Removal years later no big deal, just a thin crust to scrape off with a putty knife.
|
|||
1960 Rambler Super two-door wagon, OHV auto
1961 Roadster American, 195.6 OHV, T5 http://www.ramblerLore.com |
|||
RonFrancis
AMC Apprentice Joined: Nov/30/2014 Location: Coatesville, PA Status: Offline Points: 231 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||
Tom, Actually the company that rebuilt my engine used one of you old posts to decide what to do. I believe the block is billet. I think the plug was to allow drilling a passage way inside? I'm not sure what you mean about priming, etc. Sorry. We checked the head torque several times but see no reason to for a long time. I have about 7000 miles with no movement in the head at all. I drive it hard, too. I asked about sealer on the gasket but they insisted it wasn't needed with whatever they did. We drilled a hole in the thermostat for continuous flow. It takes extra time to warm up but the head problem should never be an issue. I'm not and engine guy. I think I was just lucky getting a good block to start and a really good re builder. My car had a Flathead to start. My replacement OHV even had a correct year build date. I hope this answers your questions. If not explain what you mean by the priming. Thanks for the complements. Ron Francis |
|||
Ron Francis
|
|||
farna
Supporter of TheAMCForum Moderator Lost Dealership Project Joined: Jul/08/2007 Location: South Carolina Status: Offline Points: 19611 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||
With just a small hole in the thermostat I routinely ran my 195.6 12-14K miles before torquing the head. The valves need to be adjusted at the 10-14K mark too, so it's no big deal to stick a torque wrench on the head bolts while the valve cover is off. I occasionally had 3-4 bolts move a little, usually no more than 1/4 turn before a nice "click" at 62 ft/lbs (click type wrench, of course!). I did this yearly when the car was a daily driver (for 14 years!). It's just a good practice with the 195.6 OHV even with better cooling mods. The heads are hard to find without cracks due to both age and having been run hot a few times over the last 56+ years. Best to do what you can to make sure it doesn't crack! When you replace an oil pump you typically pack it with Vaseline or some similar light grease that will easily dissolve in oil. That "primes" the pump -- makes it suck much harder and faster when first started. After an engine has been broken in it's not really necessary. Wouldn't hurt, especially if a car sits a long time between starts. A pre-lube setup would fix that though.
|
|||
Frank Swygert
|
|||
tomj
AMC Addicted Joined: Jan/27/2010 Location: earth Status: Offline Points: 7522 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||
Ha! That's funny. Glad ti worked out! Frank explained the priming thing... the 195.6's oil pump has it's own drive gear, so you can't prime the oil pump (with a tool inserted into the distributor hole) before starting, which as Frank points out, is critical at new-engine startup. So it's packed with vaseline at build time. It's a mild PITA but one time.
I've been thinking that maybe an added port to fill (prime) the pump, but it's probably more complexity than optimum. |
|||
1960 Rambler Super two-door wagon, OHV auto
1961 Roadster American, 195.6 OHV, T5 http://www.ramblerLore.com |
|||
wittsend
AMC Nut Joined: Apr/15/2020 Location: California Status: Offline Points: 413 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||
Why not just thread a pipe (with attached funnel) into the MANY input ports on the main oil galley and pour oil in from above instead of pumping it from below? Not saying the Vaseline is a bad idea on the gears, just saying there is a route to getting some oil into the galley very prior to initial start up.
Aside from that I have also left the sparkplugs out and just cranked the motor prior to initial start up. No compression reduced the load on the bearings significantly and it spins faster to get the oil flowing sooner. With either method you are no worse off than if the oil pump was able to be driven by a rod/dill motor prior to starting. In every case the system will lose pressure but will have (some) oil remain in the galley. Frankly I even wonder if priming washes out the assembly lube? Oh, well, regardless of method it isn't staying there long anyway. Seconds after starting (and the rest of the engines life) it will be lubricated by oil (only).
|
|||
'63 American Hardtop
|
|||
nickleone
AMC Addicted Joined: Oct/04/2008 Location: westminster co Status: Offline Points: 1429 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||
The new LS engines don't have a distributor. I have seen articles in HOT ROD where the put an oil pump in a bucket of oil and use a drill to build pressure. A flex line is connected to the engine to prime it.
I took a portable air tank rigged a valve and a line to connect to the oil galley of the 196. Filled the tank with 5qt of oil and pressurized the tank. I had a gauge on the oil line at the head and i could see oil on the top end. Nick
|
|||
nick
401 71 Gremlin pro rally car sold 390 V8 SX/4 pro rally car sold 1962 Classic SW T5 4 wheel disc brakes |
|||
bigbad69
Supporter of TheAMCForum Joined: Jul/02/2007 Location: Ottawa, Ont. Status: Offline Points: 6614 |
Post Options
Thanks(1)
|
||
|
|||
69 Javelin SST BBO 390 T10
|
|||
tomj
AMC Addicted Joined: Jan/27/2010 Location: earth Status: Offline Points: 7522 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||
I assume (ahem...) that the point is for the suction side to draw, not so much the tiem to fill the pressurized side. Gravity pour from the pressurized side won't pass through the gears. That's my working assumption, lacking physical evidence and not willing to do that particular experiment on one of my own.
That's a good point. With assembly lube that low speed, low load crankign seems unlikely to harm anything. But will a dry suction side ever draw from the pan? That's the basic question. It could even have a simple answer.
I assume that is true. It shortly becomes an oil additive, and in whoever's procedure I've copied, that oil is changed after 20 minutes of run time. Experts (not me by a mile) have determined that those initial few seconds matter, a lot. THat is part of my hesitancy to crank-prime. The vaseline thing is a PITA, but a minor one. With a major positive side effect. Done once, on a new and inherently expensive engine. So I'm in no hurry to take short cuts. What's the gain? |
|||
1960 Rambler Super two-door wagon, OHV auto
1961 Roadster American, 195.6 OHV, T5 http://www.ramblerLore.com |
|||
farna
Supporter of TheAMCForum Moderator Lost Dealership Project Joined: Jul/08/2007 Location: South Carolina Status: Offline Points: 19611 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||
Note that the vaseline pack is extremely easy on a 195.6 with the external oil pump. On most engines you have to drop the pan.
|
|||
Frank Swygert
|
|||
wittsend
AMC Nut Joined: Apr/15/2020 Location: California Status: Offline Points: 413 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||
Just for clarification I saw "Priming" as filling the entire oil system with oil. Thus the pump, galleys and to a minor extent getting oil to the bearings without (hopefully) washing out the assembly lube. This in theory (given residual oil) would more quickly get oil to the needed surfaces. I see this as beneficial over a completely "dry" engine (but not disregarding assembly lube). Thus why I suggested pouring oil in through one of the many main galley holes. I did not mean to supplant using Vaseline in the pump gears. Nor was I intending it to be a means to backfill the oil pump.
So: 1. Assembly lube on wearing surfaces. 2. Vaseline in the oil pump. 3. I tend to pour on oil on the rockers before I tight down the valve cover. 4. In the case of the AMC 196 engine, being there are about 3-4 input points on the main oil galley getting that little bit of extra oil in the system even if only gravity fed. 5A. Prime with a drill and rod to turn the oil pump (not AMC 196). 5B. Or..., crank the engine with the plugs removed until pressure is detected. I think we are all on the same page but perhaps I didn't explain it well in my post. |
|||
'63 American Hardtop
|
|||
Post Reply | Page <1234> |
Tweet
|
Forum Jump | Forum Permissions You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot create polls in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum |