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WIPER MOTOR WIRING

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gregsgs View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gregsgs Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: WIPER MOTOR WIRING
    Posted: Dec/10/2013 at 6:32pm
I am restoring a wiper motor with my son and on the wiper there are 4 wires or sleevs from the motor to the rotator. Since we are tring to make it look new and work good can any one Please tell me were we can buy the same type of wire. We have called all over and have had no lock. It looks like 20-24 gauge wire in greeg, yellow, maybe orange and dark brown. Any help would be great.
its a 71 Javalin.
Thank You
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bbgjc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec/10/2013 at 9:08pm
Here you go.
http://www.wiringharness.com/  They make reproduction harnesses for AMC's
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rebel Machine Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec/10/2013 at 9:11pm
Keep in mind the ground between the switch and wiper motor comes from the chassis. If you bench test it you'll need to make that connection.

-Steve-

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pit crew Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec/10/2013 at 9:22pm
Originally posted by Rebel Machine Rebel Machine wrote:

Keep in mind the ground between the switch and wiper motor comes from the chassis. If you bench test it you'll need to make that connection.

-Steve-

And be sure you don't make that ground connection with your body. Take it from the voice of experience, it does not feel good at all.  Shocked

73 Hornet - 401EFI - THM400 - Twin Grip 20
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote billd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec/11/2013 at 7:19am
Originally posted by gregsgs gregsgs wrote:

I am restoring a wiper motor with my son and on the wiper there are 4 wires or sleevs from the motor to the rotator. Since we are tring to make it look new and work good can any one Please tell me were we can buy the same type of wire. We have called all over and have had no lock. It looks like 20-24 gauge wire in greeg, yellow, maybe orange and dark brown. Any help would be great.
its a 71 Javalin.
Thank You


I'm not sure what "motor to rotator" means as far as "rotator". Do you mean the motor to park switch and wiring harness that leads to the switch inside?
The wiper motors work by grounding and connecting certain wires. Not at all like you normally think of automotive wiring such as a blower motor that has the motor grounded and you supply the positive power feed to make it go.
They are hot and you ground some and connect others to make it go.
Did you search and find my posts on wiper motor wiring? And the test connections?

Now the wiring from the park switch to the motor itself is cloth covered on the Prestolite wiper motors.   Green, red, yellow, black.

Then the harness to the inside switch is black, red, yellow and blue.

Black to black, red to red, yellow to yellow, then green motor to park switch, blue harness to park switch.  (so green cloth wire from motor is connected to the blue harness wire through the park switch)
BUT - there are two greens exiting the motor so be sure you watch what goes where. One green goes to the brushes and feeds the armature, the other green feeds the series field coil. (these have a series field and a shunt as the motor speed is controlled in this way otherwise it would speed itself to death in a free-run)
To replace the cloth wires you have to disassemble the motor and get into it's guts.
(that's what I do as a side business)

I have the cloth wire so can actually rewire the motor itself with new cloth wire. It's not real easy to find in the proper size and color but antique radio buffs can often lead you to it.
You can buy the harnesses from the vendors listed in the vendor section of the forum here in the trading post area. (sale, wanted, vendors, etc.)

In this top picture I have it connected up for testing - the large red wire on the left of the photo (back side of wiper mounting) is clipped to the ground strap, and leads to the battery negative to ground the wiper motor during testing. Yeah, don't rely on YOUR BODY to ground it. Shocking, isn't it?







And finally your 71 should have a Prestolite ESY series wiper motor and if so this is how the wiring goes:





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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kapptaink Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec/11/2013 at 7:42am
Greg, I took markers and recolored my cloth wires. You can't really tell even if you lean against the fenders of my car which nobody should be doing unless they are married to me, and the wife better be naked if she is touching the car.
PrevOwned:73HornetX 360/a727 Blk/Blk-69Javelin/R/R-69AMXBlk/W-69JavelinPrimer
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gregsgs Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec/11/2013 at 6:17pm
First I want to thank all of you for your quick return and all of the information you gave us. As a first time person and new to AMC its nice to see the AMC people help each other. In the past I have had other types of cars and the people were not as nice. I did read the information from billd and that is way we started the project. We have the wiper working and we have it painted we just were going to replace the wire. We did find a company called RadioDaz in the north east and they have a lot of wire and all kinds of coverings. If any one knows were to get the same kind as AMC used. With the help of you people my son and I will keep working on.
Thank You All
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote THE MENACE Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec/11/2013 at 6:47pm
You might want to try "Del City Wire" too.
 
Dennis
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The Craig Breedlove "AERO AMX"

Still Owner:
SS/AMX #9 replica (THE BIG MENACE)
70 AMX 416, EFI, Nash 5 speed   
70 Javelin 401, 727 (Wife's)
72 Gremlin Autocross Project.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Steve_P Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec/11/2013 at 9:21pm
I bought the wire from McMaster.com.  heat shrink too.  If you keep the wires constrained flat, and are careful with the heat and don't over do it, you can make an exact repro of the factory harness.  The wires have been arranged in the same order on every harness I've looked at.
 
Edit: I have the wires at 16 ga and colors arranged as
blue
black
red
yellow
 
try 7587k55
 
.50 PVC heat shrink tubing 7132k571 (.75 flattened and measured diameter), ~.02 thick, is what I used and my notes say that .38 would also be ok.  And that the length will shrink 8% LOL
 
polyester mesh, braided thermo tubing is .1" ID  Orange, yellow, black, green.  Don't remember where I bought this.
 
black PVC tubing, 1/8 or 3/6" ID  From mcmaster.  Not sure what I used. my notes say OE was .14" ID and .025 wall.  7132k513 for 3/16"
 
I was able to find the terminals, can't remember if they were standard, I have them as 1/4" wide
 
actually, I may have a spare new harness, let me know...


Edited by Steve_P - Dec/11/2013 at 9:45pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote billd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec/12/2013 at 7:07am
The colors the original poster names are the wires from inside the motor frame itself, to the park switch/plate and thus, to the switch harness.
The motor to switch harness wire is blue - he states there's a green wire. He says "from motor", so I assume he means the wires that do deteriorate rather than the harness going into the switch.
I also assume "rotator" means the "gearbox" and park switch.
That's why I replied with the term "cloth wire" as that generically covers the wire type from motor to the gear and park switch area.
For that he is correct, it's not 16 gauge, and it is "cloth" covered wire in red, green, black and yellow, although being cloth wire it fades and gets dirty so the black appears more brown, the red looks either orange or pink depending on how it aged, yellow often looks tan.
The motor in the 3rd photograph I posted above the owner didn't really want a "full blown restoration" just to look nice and work perfectly. So I did not replace the internal wires - but one can tell they are in very good shape, and only a bit faded. One can also tell in the photo that they are/were yellow, green, red and black.
The schematic I posted is from Prestolite, the maker of the original motor, and they list the motor wires as yellow, red, black and 2 green. Those connect to the car's motor to switch harness where the colors change a bit - yellow, red, black and blue (instead of green).  The two green motor wires connect to one side of the park switch on the motor transmission, the blue harness to switch wire connects to the other side. So the effect is yellow to yellow, black to black, red to red, and 2 green through park switch to single blue.
I've had some NOS as well as well-kept used originals apart and the wires inside the motor itself reveal the true colors. They are fine wires, more like a 22 gauge (I never directly checked as once they get smaller than an 18 gauge I need to compare and measure as I tend to lose track these days! But what I bought from a restoration place matched the original motor wires perfectly.)

For those curious, I have taken apart NOS motors to replate parts or get them refinished as often it's the years, or box and shelf wear that is unkind to them and NOS doesn't mean perfect and just like it left the factory, it only means it's never been installed, is technically new, but old original stock.  I also determine what is proper and correct that way as one can't always know if an "original off the car" has been touched or repaired by other hands in the past.
As I used to work in an electronics engineering and manufacturing company and have huge rolls of heat shrink I picked up from our manufacturing department warehouse when they "cleaned up" after changing controller models or series and designs. This heat shrink was in dispenser boxes, an inch to 2 inches wide, 2+ feet across, hundreds of feet of tube per box. They were going to toss it into dumpsters but sent an email telling employees it's going away, you want it, come get it.  I got my truck and backed up to the manufacturing department and retrieved a half dozen rolls/boxes in various sizes, some 2-3" diameter before heated, some more like .1-.2"
Because one of the QA people from the engineering department is an old radio buff, collector and restorer, and I started my tinkering in electronics with old radios, I learned where to find the proper types of wire needed for various things. David Perkins can tell you almost anything you ever wanted to know about antique radio, recording devices (including wire recorders) and more, besides being an EE.

The harness motor to switch is readily available made and ready to go. Do watch the end connector - that varied with car and year to an extent. But that's a part that's really easy to find. I know Chuck has had them, vendors have carried them, and Mr. Bass can probably furnish those - he can furnish the clips, springs and washer for them. (Ross can supply some of those as well)

I believe the last "harness" I bought was something like $35 or $40 so it depends on if you wish to "DIY" or buy one ready to solder into place.  They also come with the foam seal as well, so you don't have to mess with that although that part is pretty simple to replicate or duplicate.

Like Steve said you can make your own motor to dash switch harness using 16 gauge wires and heat shrink tube, then getting or making the foam seal, or, simply contact one of the listed vendors or David Bass and buy a ready-to-go-harness.
However, if I read the first post right, you were wanting the motor wires themselves, the r, g, b, y wires from inside the motor frame to the outside.
If it's the latter and it's the cloth motor wires, the fine gauge wires, I can possibly help there........... let me know.
If the former, use Steve's specs and make one as a father/son project (with a bit of pride to go with it, and a learning process that can lead to other wiring projects) or buy one from a vendor.

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