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Which brand of rod & main bearings? |
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captscot
AMC Apprentice Joined: Feb/05/2013 Location: N Brunswick, NJ Status: Offline Points: 241 |
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Posted: Jul/12/2017 at 9:05pm |
I'm rebuilding a 401 for street use and wondering what brand of rod and main bearings is the preferred brand and/or pros & cons of the different brands available?
My standard 401 crank's bearings are marked "Clevite 77" and also have the AMC logo stamped. The bearings and crank look good, so if Clevite 77 bearings were good enough for AMC ..., but then I read comments about Clevite 77 bearings sometimes metal flaking. Federal Mogul seems to always be a good name, haven't heard any complaints, believe their bearings a softer and more forgiving, but hard to locate them from any vendors. Sealed Power is a more recent branch of FM, but are they as good and same material as bearings previously made under the FM name? King Bearings, many AMCer's like them, yet they are very inexpensive, plus hearsay is that USA Clevite and FM bearings have been reformulated with more aluminum to reduce lead content due to EPA requirements, yet King Bearings are made in Israel and still made with lead content. Some like ACL Bearings, but there have been many complaints of receiving Clevite bearings in an ACL box. Do they really make their on bearings or are they Clevite under another name? Think that covers what's currently available. Any suggestions on what to buy? Thanks much, Scott |
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1972 Javelin AMX - orig owner
1985 Grand Wagoneer 1967 Jeepster 1968 Jeep Gladiator 1959 Jeep CJ5 1929 Marmon model 68 |
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FSJunkie
AMC Addicted Joined: Jan/09/2011 Location: Flagstaff, AZ Status: Offline Points: 4742 |
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Clevite 77 P-series were not original equipment to my knowledge. AMC used Federal Mogul bearings that were "sintered copper-lead alloy" and date stamped. Clevite 77 P-series is just the most popular brand of tri-metal copper bearings. Lots of other manufacturers make tri-metal copper bearings, though maybe not for AMC. Tri-metal copper bearings are a heavy duty type of bearing that can withstand very high bearing loads, but have a relatively short service life because the bearing surface is so thin. They are a good choice for an engine that will see a lot of hard use like towing or racing, but is not expected to last much more than 100,000 miles. King only makes bi-metal aluminum bearings for AMC engines. Their connecting rod bearings are King's SI-series and their main bearings are King's AM-series. Both are bi-metal aluminum, but the SI-series contains more silicon which makes them harder, more durable, longer lasting, and gives then a higher load capacity. Bi-metal aluminum bearings cannot withstand bearing loads as high as tri-metal copper can, but they are harder and thicker, so they last much longer. They are also more tolerant of slightly worn or irregular crankshaft surfaces. They are a good choice for a stock or mild engine used under average or favorable conditions where long service life is a goal. The only benefit tri-metal copper bearings like Clevite 77 have over bi-metal aluminum bearings like King AM and SI is increased load capacity. That only benefits you if your engine NEEDS higher load capacity, otherwise it's a waste. King's SI bearings have nearly the same load capacity as Clevite 77, and King AM bearings are only a little behind that. You should know that the vast majority of modern production engines come with bi-metal aluminum bearings as original equipment, including many heavy duty Diesels. Bi-metal aluminum bearings are also vastly superior in situation where there is insufficient lubrication. A tri-metal bearing will toast itself, but a bi-metal aluminum bearing will keep going much longer. You can probably tell that I have King bearings in everything I own...but my engines are stock and I want them to last 200,000 miles. If you are building a race engine, they might not be the best choice. |
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1955 Packard
1966 Marlin 1972 Wagoneer 1973 Ambassador 1977 Hornet 1982 Concord D/L 1984 Eagle Limited |
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Airdrie AMX
AMC Nut Joined: Aug/08/2010 Location: Alberta, Canada Status: Offline Points: 329 |
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I have clevites in the 401 currently in my 72 amx, it also had the am logo clevites in it when i tore it down 10 years ago, it also has no bearings issues and it gets driven hard every time I'm in it LOL. Im also putting together a 426 stroker and have king bearings for it mainly because they have a good rep from the performance crowd here and are easy to find, this engine also had am logo clevites in it date stamped.
I Think whats maybe more important than bearing choice is having a machine shop trustworthy of getting bearing clearances right, seems like this is a often a problem. Edited by Airdrie AMX - Jul/12/2017 at 11:13pm |
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72 amx javelin 401 4spd
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FSJunkie
AMC Addicted Joined: Jan/09/2011 Location: Flagstaff, AZ Status: Offline Points: 4742 |
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On the last 360 I built I bought both Clevite 77 P-series and King AM, SI bearings to compare them and decide which ones I wanted to actually install. The King looked like they were much better quality...if looks mean anything. How they look doesn't necessarily represent how they work, but the King bearings looked much better. You're going to be fine either way.
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1955 Packard
1966 Marlin 1972 Wagoneer 1973 Ambassador 1977 Hornet 1982 Concord D/L 1984 Eagle Limited |
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401MATCOUPE
AMC Addicted Joined: May/20/2010 Location: Salisbury, MD Status: Offline Points: 5367 |
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Just my opinion, the only bearing I will not use is Engine Tech Brand, I just got building my 102nd AMC Gen 2 V-8 and I mainly use Clevite/Michigan 77 or Federal Mogal....King and ACL are great too. I think Michigan 77 is the same as Clevite 77....I remember reading somewhere that Michigan bought Clevite some years back.
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Ross K. Peterson
68X,GoPac,343,AT,52A(1stCar) 68X,GoPac,390,4sp,52A 69X,GoPac,390,4sp,64A 70X,GoPac,390,4sp,87A,8 70X,GoPac,390,4sp,BBO,8 70 Jav SST,390,AT,BSO 74MatX,401,AT,Prototype 74MatX,401,AT |
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401jim
Supporter of TheAMCForum Joined: Jan/07/2012 Location: Brunswick,Ohio Status: Offline Points: 793 |
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King bearings only for me. I have run the gambit on bearings. King seems to be a good quality engine bearing. Plus they are available from Summit ....
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one bad rambler
AMC Addicted Joined: Jan/09/2008 Location: On The Island Status: Offline Points: 2007 |
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There is a lot more to bearings than appearance...There is a big difference between an aluminum and steel backed bearing...You can get away with a lot on daily drivers...but theres a lot happing to a race engines crank at 7 grand plus...Harmonics..twisting..flexing...all bearing killers if the incorrect ones are selected....Our shop has built a lot of Mitsu. 3000gt 3.0L/3.5L i`ve seen the 2 center main bearing (cap side only) delaminate ...Thats also pushing 1,200 hp at the wheels....With research and trial and error it`s all been resolved
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68 AMX 390 4 Speed,68 American,64 American 2 Door Wagon Altered Wheelbase,78 Concord Build 360,727,8.8
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captscot
AMC Apprentice Joined: Feb/05/2013 Location: N Brunswick, NJ Status: Offline Points: 241 |
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Hi, I posted the question of which bearings, so from trial and error what is your preference? An opinion on experience with Federal Mogul, and opinion on King Bearings?
Thanks, Scott
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1972 Javelin AMX - orig owner
1985 Grand Wagoneer 1967 Jeepster 1968 Jeep Gladiator 1959 Jeep CJ5 1929 Marmon model 68 |
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purple72Gremlin
AMC Addicted Charter Member Joined: Jul/01/2007 Location: Illinois Status: Offline Points: 16611 |
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Personally Id run 77s but I may not have a choice
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spiritdude
AMC Apprentice Joined: Feb/21/2017 Location: Cocoa, FL Status: Offline Points: 70 |
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I have never tried the King bearings yet. Like all of the other guys said, a lot of it depends on the application and how you are going to treat it. I am pretty hard on my stuff so I go with the tri-metal bearings. If it is a basically stock engine it isn't so critical. What is critical is proper clearance, absolute cleanliness when assembling your engine, and proper start-up/break in!
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spiritdude
1982 Spirit-10.865 @123.16mph |
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