TheAMCForum.com Homepage
Forum Home Forum Home > The Garage > AMC 6 Cylinder Engine Repair and Modifications
  New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - Water running through intake on a 258
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Events   Register Register  Login Login

Click for TheAMCForum Rules / Click for PDF version of Forum Rules
Your donations help keep this valuable resource free and growing. Thank you.

Water running through intake on a 258

 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <1 34567>
Author
Message
Lyle View Drop Down
AMC Addicted
AMC Addicted
Avatar

Joined: Jul/17/2014
Location: None
Status: Offline
Points: 772
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lyle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/20/2017 at 10:24am
Many years ago my girl friend (now wife) had a bought 68 Javelin with a 232 that the previous owner told her he had put a "marine" head on. It had a water supply to the intake and I never even thought about it as a teenager.
Off the line she would beat mustangs, camaros, cudas (fast girl)... but the car ran out of air (I believe) at 40MPH and at 60MPH it was tapped out - nothing left to give.
I don't have pictures and I have not been able to "google" this intake. I don't even know if this was just what she was told or if this thing even existed.

Back to Top
farna View Drop Down
Supporter of TheAMCForum
Supporter of TheAMCForum
Avatar
Moderator Lost Dealership Project

Joined: Jul/08/2007
Location: South Carolina
Status: Offline
Points: 19610
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote farna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/21/2017 at 5:41am
Never heard of a marinized AMC six, but could have been...

I had a Clifford intake on my J-10 for a while. Daily driver. Doesn't get too cold in South Carolina, but we do have one or two Arctic blasts that come through and drop temps into the high teens at night, so still below freezing in the mornings. Only lasts a few days, maybe a week at most, but that truck would stumble and spit and sputter fro the first 15-20 minutes of driving during those times, even after a 5 minute warm-up. Had to baby it along for a bit. Would do that for the first 5 minutes of driving even on cool days (30s, low 40s). It needed 5 minutes to get warmed up good and run right even on a summer morning, but that's typical of a carbed vehicle even with exhaust heated manifolds. We all have been spoiled by EFI cars which crank and are ready to go immediately!  Many of us have forgot that an engine needs to get up to operating temp before it really runs right... unless you have a computer closely controlling tune to make everything right to run cold.

I finally screwed a 3/4" copper line under the intake to help it warm faster. Helped some, would have helped more if I could have insulated it against the bottom of the intake. Was thinking about it, but the old engine gave up first. Truck came from up north and had some rust issues, and had been used as a snow plow for 5-6 years to clear a couple of apartment parking lots (just outside NYC). So it had some hard miles on it!
Frank Swygert
Back to Top
5spdwagon View Drop Down
AMC Addicted
AMC Addicted
Avatar

Joined: Jun/29/2012
Location: Guy ton ga
Status: Offline
Points: 522
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 5spdwagon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/21/2017 at 6:08am
So do you think living in south ga should I put the water in the intake or leave it out? This car will not see any freezing temps ever.
Real hot rods have 3 pedals
Back to Top
farna View Drop Down
Supporter of TheAMCForum
Supporter of TheAMCForum
Avatar
Moderator Lost Dealership Project

Joined: Jul/08/2007
Location: South Carolina
Status: Offline
Points: 19610
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote farna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/21/2017 at 6:56am
Worst thing is on cool mornings you'd need to drive a bit slower/easy for five minutes until it warmed up good. I'd connect it though. Won't hurt a thing, and there will be some warm water just from convection to the intake. Then on really cool mornings you can crack the heater n just a little and it will warm up quicker, turn heat off after 5-10 minutes. That way if you do have to or decide to drive one cold morning it will run fine in half the time if you didn't have it. But you don't have to have it under the conditions you describe. 
Frank Swygert
Back to Top
uncljohn View Drop Down
AMC Addicted
AMC Addicted
Avatar

Joined: Jan/03/2013
Location: Peoria AZ
Status: Offline
Points: 5394
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote uncljohn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/21/2017 at 9:36pm
I have not had to set up an AMC engine to run in the cool weather with out carburetor heat. But I ran a MOPAR 225 that was running 13/1 compression and a cam and never really had a problem with it. I was using a Carter AFB and an Offy intake. That was back east where it would get down to freezing in October. I used to put a piece of cardboard over the radiator to bring engine temperature up quick and of course gasoline was 104 octane from the Sunoco 260 pump.
I have an AMC 232 with an offy intake, an Eagle exhaust and an Isky cam but compression is only 9/1 which is about all 91 octane premium is happy with. My 258 with a BBD 2bbl and a single exhaust header (with no carburetor heat) ran fine here in Arizona and ran even finer when I went to Port Injection but as that made the manifold be a "Dry" manifold it really did not care whether there was carburetor heat or not.
From my experience I would not worry about carburetor heat. And of course I have two V8 cars with Air Gap intakes which not only have no exhaust heat but are physically separated from touching the engine surfaces. The AMC engine in my Javelin uses an Edelbrock and the SBC in my Hornet uses a no-name Chinese knock off and they don't seem to have a problem either.
\
70 390 5spd Donohue
74 Hornet In restoration
76 Hornet, 5.7L Mercury Marine Power
80 Fuel Injected I6 Spirit
74 232 I-6, 4bbl, 270HL Isky Cam
Back to Top
tomj View Drop Down
AMC Addicted
AMC Addicted
Avatar

Joined: Jan/27/2010
Location: earth
Status: Offline
Points: 7522
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tomj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/22/2017 at 8:13pm
other than possibly slightly choking the flow of air through the manifold, the coolant pipe will NOT affect the mixture temperature. it's almost certainly there to stabilize (warm, and cool) the temperature the carb and manifold, not the air. 

the air and fuel charge sucked through the carb into the cylinders (1) passes through in milliseconds, not long enough to be warmed by the tube (2) the surface to volume ratio of the air to the tube is too small to be useful (3) evaporating droplets of fuel in the air charge is isothermic as heck, and drops the air intake 80 - 90 degrees F -- i know that because i measured it directly with a thermistor, plus it's plain old fizzicks you can look up in a book. it takes a lot of heat to vaporize the fuel.

i've never tested it (and doubt i ever will) but i bet the pipe in the manifold simply doesn't work very well or do much. it didn't last long in that configuration. the 1982? up aluminum manifold has both a water jacket AND an electric heater directly under the carb. that last has got to be to brute-force evaporate wet gas that might drip or condense out of the carb right above it. i think that's the best manifold for AMC sixes. its very light too.


1960 Rambler Super two-door wagon, OHV auto
1961 Roadster American, 195.6 OHV, T5
http://www.ramblerLore.com

Back to Top
5spdwagon View Drop Down
AMC Addicted
AMC Addicted
Avatar

Joined: Jun/29/2012
Location: Guy ton ga
Status: Offline
Points: 522
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 5spdwagon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/23/2017 at 4:03am
I just cant decide if I should hook it up or not.
Real hot rods have 3 pedals
Back to Top
vinny View Drop Down
Supporter of TheAMCForum
Supporter of TheAMCForum


Joined: Jan/05/2012
Location: Calgary
Status: Offline
Points: 2837
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote vinny Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/23/2017 at 8:44am
I have a 66 and a 67 232 with WCD carbs. Neither has the heat tube.

Now I don't remember what the situation was with my 196 but maybe I never had the heat tube hooked up or removed it if there was one. There were certain conditions, maybe foggy and close to freezing that it would ice up and pretty well quit running. Let it sit for 5 minutes and good to go again. I can't remember it happening more than a couple or few times so it was quite rare. I was pretty sure at the time that it was carburetor icing.
Back to Top
5spdwagon View Drop Down
AMC Addicted
AMC Addicted
Avatar

Joined: Jun/29/2012
Location: Guy ton ga
Status: Offline
Points: 522
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 5spdwagon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/23/2017 at 9:02am
I don't have to worry about icing it only gets in the 30a here a few weeks a year
Real hot rods have 3 pedals
Back to Top
tyrodtom View Drop Down
AMC Addicted
AMC Addicted


Joined: Sep/14/2007
Location: Virginia
Status: Offline
Points: 6199
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tyrodtom Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/23/2017 at 9:06am
There's been so many posts about this,  but I don't remember if you ever said what year 258 you've got and which version of the water heat your engine has, and if your car has the heater bypass cutoff or not.

If it's the water tube going from the front of intake to the rear, with the water tube in the intake runner itself,    But if you've got the water cutoff at the firewall, no hot coolant is going through it anyway, as long as you don't cut on the flow to the heater.  So if those conditions are met,  unhooking it gains you nothing.

If your car has no heater cutoff on the firewall,  then hot coolant is flowing through it all the time.  IMO you don't need that in GA.,  in the summer. 

It's easy enough to hook it up,  or not,  just bypass it.  Why not try if both ways and decide for yourself.
66 American SW, 66 American 2dr, 82 J10, 70 Hornet, Pound, Va.
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <1 34567>
  Share Topic   

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Forum Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 12.03
Copyright ©2001-2019 Web Wiz Ltd.

This page was generated in 0.109 seconds.
All content of this site Copyright © 2018 TheAMCForum unless otherwise noted, all rights reserved.
PROBLEMS LOGGING IN or REGISTERING:
If you have problems logging in or registering, then please contact a Moderator or