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Stock 360 output

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WesternRed View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WesternRed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/25/2018 at 8:06am
At least it looks the part, assuming full beater spec is the desired look:




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Red20 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/25/2018 at 11:36am
Build the 401, add centrifugal supercharger. Well built TF with good converter. Order wheelie bars!
1969 Javelin SST "Screamin' Banana" - Totaled Feb 2018
1973 Hornet Sportabout X "yellajack" - 360/727/TracLoc DAILY DRIVER
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ken_Parkman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/26/2018 at 8:40am
Plan your 401 build, then order a 8" race converter for that. Would suggest a 904/998/999 tranny, far better than the 727, and get that converter neck. Use it with the 360, will be fine, and just put the 360 together with the 232 cam you have. The converter will let it work. Put a set of headers on; I'd use the cheap hedmans. Even with the port mismatch they will work well. Stall maybe around 5000, shift at 5600-5800 rpm, make sure there is enough oil in the engine, and run maybe high 11's tuned right. Save your money for the 401, build it as money is available, put a roll bar in the car, run 10's. Maybe invest in a good oil pan, which can be used on the 401.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WesternRed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/26/2018 at 6:18pm
Red20, I like your thinking, but the wallet doesn't.

Ken, appreciate your valuable input as always.

Had a long chat to the local converter shop on Friday, they of course suggested a LS swap, cheap eBay turbo or N2O as possible solutions, but ultimately can work with what I have although more compression was highly recommended.


Their recommendation was the 9.5" slingshot converter, mainly because it offers a lot of versatility for future growth and is relatively easy to tighten or loosen should the need arise.

Cost is roughly Aussie $1350, for comparison a 10" TCI Streetfighter from Summit (US$600) is about AU$1000 landed.

At this stage I think the plan will start with pulling the motor and seeing what I can do with the crank, we have a general type machine shop at work and there is a possibility I can get it modded to take the TF converter, otherwise I will get the other later crank I have looked at.

I can take the crank out the bottom and leave the heads in place and it will give me an opportunity to measure the bore size to see if some flat top pistons can be slotted in without too much cost and effort.

Cam can be brought back to 6 deg ICL with a new timing set as you suggested or I can decide if I should slip a smaller cam back in.

The ultimate goal is probably the 401 with enough power to need a cage, but that's probably a couple of years off at least. At the moment if I can run 12's and do some dial your own handicap racing, it will give me a good opportunity to get some seat time and improve in other areas like reaction time, which is currently all over the place. The cage and tidying up bodywork can come and then the big engine.

PS: Just remembers I do have a rusty old set of Hedmans down the shed that I had completely forgotten about.




Edited by WesternRed - May/26/2018 at 6:22pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 70amcpwr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/26/2018 at 7:00pm
I'm not the expert that some are (but am speaking from experience) if you're not going to build a 401 or something from scratch I would pull the motor out, tear it down completely and inspect. You could be loosing compression from something as simple as head gaskets. What are you really saving by skirting around it?? A days of labor and $200 @ the most. I do this w/ every good running motor I have, if not it comes back to haunt me in an expensive way.

Then maybe hit it w/ a hone if the walls are good, maybe replace the rings, Maybe you have a bearing or two about to go South that needs replacing. You have no idea what the valves are like if I recall. Piece mealing never works, at least not for me.

Personally, after that I'd look @ spark (type), fuel, and exhaust. As far as artificial intelligence, I don't think it has a place here, it's to busy "compensating", sort of like the government, yeah the read outs are cool. Good ol 650 cfm of your favorite flavor, easy to make adjustments for any condition.  

Got to remember a stock 1970/71 360 was a conservative 285 hp.
70amcpwr You just can't fix stupid.
SOLD 1970 BBO Javelin, wifes 73 AMX 360 4spd. Next project 1969 AMX
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WesternRed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/26/2018 at 7:35pm
I think fresh bearings is a given, re-ring is probably on the cards, full gasket set is not a big deal. I'm just scared of finding stuff the "has" to be fixed where possibly ignorance is bliss. A leak-down test might be in order before it comes apart.

Lowest budget option on the engine is probably a quick hone, a set of flat tops and resize the stock rods with good bolts. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WesternRed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/29/2018 at 5:30pm
Slicks are now packed away for winter and I've started tearing it down, this thread has got a bit long winded so probably a good time to reflect on it's first season.

Took roughly 2 years to turn it from a non-running wreck saved from a junkyard into something that could make a run down the strip. Key details were swapping in a running 1971 360 of unknown history, performer, 600 vac sec Holley, free flows, rebuilt 727 with unknown converter, rebuilt AMC20 with Truetrac, Moser axles and 4.10 gears as well as fixing up suspension and brakes.

29/11/17 first night out with 265/50/14 street tires:

Best time 16.23 @ 87.9 mph, best 60' 2.69

06/12/17 swapped out the street tires for 26" x 10" slicks, didn't really need traction but the T/As were old and cracked so I'd been told not to come back with them on the car.

Best time 16.07 @ 91.2 mph, best 60' 2.68

20/12/17 advanced ignition timing from 5 deg initial to 15 deg initial (thanks pfordamx)

Best time 15.00, best mph 93.8, best 60' 2.30

3/01/18 installed a Holley Sniper with 1" open spacer on the Performer over Christmas

Best time 14.42  @ 95.9 mph, best 60' 2.24

31/01/18 replaced the rear main seal, not really a performance improvement, but the previous weeks Sniper data logs showed that I wasn't getting full throttle, so fixed that

Best time 14.24 @ 98.0 mph, best 60' 2.25

14/02/18 installed electric fans, fixed overheating issue with the old factory flex fan

Best time 14.12, best mph 98.1, best 60' 2.15 

28/02/18 installed reverse pattern manual valve body, did struggle with gear selection that night, but managed one clean run

Best time 14.00 @ 98.1 mph, best 60' 2.13 

7/03/18 the previous week had identified some problems with axle windup (driveshaft was hitting the floor), so added some homemade slapper bars, which fixed that and modified the shifter to fix the gear selection issues

Best time 13.98 @ 98.4 mph, best 60' 2.14

9/05/18 new bigger badder cam, only got one run before the starter motor died

Best time 14.60 @ 98.0 mph, best 60' 2.48

16/05/18 back with another starter, but it became pretty obvious that the new cam wasn't helping

Best time 14.37 @ 98.7 mph, best 60' 2.36

26/05/18 tried advancing the cam 8 degrees, bad idea

Best time 14.59 best mph 96.5, best 60' 2.30

Made a total of 62 runs over the season and made some good gains until changing the cam sent things backwards at the end of the season. Pretty happy with it so far and hopefully I should be able to build on it with some changes over the winter break.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Red20 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/29/2018 at 6:26pm
I can’t wait to see some 1.50 60’ times and low 12 sec runs. Keep at it!
1969 Javelin SST "Screamin' Banana" - Totaled Feb 2018
1973 Hornet Sportabout X "yellajack" - 360/727/TracLoc DAILY DRIVER
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Red20 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/29/2018 at 6:32pm
I gotta say it again - I enjoy the “figure it out” nature of your thread here. Guys like myself don’t have much in the budget to make power and speed with dollars, so it’s an exercise in budget conscious tinkering to do more with less and strive to understand the car as well as possible. I added an additional full sized leaf with the eyes cut off and clamped all of the leafs forward of the rear axle after talking to an old timer once and was amazed at how much better my Javelin hooked up. Didn’t cost me a dime as I carefully removed and reused leafs and leaf clamps from another set of leaf packs I had lying around.
1969 Javelin SST "Screamin' Banana" - Totaled Feb 2018
1973 Hornet Sportabout X "yellajack" - 360/727/TracLoc DAILY DRIVER
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WesternRed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/29/2018 at 7:54pm
I hindsight I shouldn't have advanced the cam and spent a bit more time on tuning instead. I'm surprised that nobody mentioned "lean bog" from the sniper data log posted a couple of pages back when the new cam was installed. The EFI only self tunes up to a point, some stuff still needs a bit of manual help like acceleration enrichment (equivalent to Holley pump shot). Had a little bit of a tinker with that on the last night and that's how I got a bit of 60' back, but it was still far from perfect.

I don't think the Sniper really offers anything more than a well tuned Holley in terms of fuel and air delivery, but the data logging feature is pretty impressive and it's something I've got to put a lot more time into understanding once everything else is a bit more settled.     
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