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SS/AMX History and Documentation

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tbenvie View Drop Down
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  Quote tbenvie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: SS/AMX History and Documentation
    Posted: May/08/2009 at 5:14pm
Disclaimer: The following people provided info, feedback, and help with this post.  I would like to thank them all. Jim L'Esperance, Ross Gilbert, Ted Kijek, Dave Siipola, Dick Erlandson, and Robert McCorkle, former original owners of these cars. Mike Weaver and George Gudat, current owners of these cars who operate the www.ssamx.com website, and whom I have corresponded with over the years about these cars. Rick Wyman, Steve P, Bill D, Scott, and Ian from this site who research the various aspects of the cars. "Kevin of Cincinatty", Joe R. from NY, Rick C. and others for what they contributed.  Andre Jacobs, who shared info with me years ago and Dave Lesick, both current owners of these cars.  Eddie Stakes from www.planethoustonamx.com for some info on his website. And the many photographers whose pictures I used on this thread whom I am not able to identify.  Steve Avery, especially for his photograph interpretations. More when I think of them, but this is an assembly of collected works and I no way wish to take credit for much of what is here.
 
If you have anything to add, please PM me here, or use my e-mail: tbenvie@comcast.net 
I can also be reached by phone most evenings (508) 378-1423.
 
Thanks
 
 

I don't know where else to post this, so I thought I would put it here.  Please note-some of these images were taken from various sites on the net.  I have original copies of the documentation and factory/magazine pictures and can scan and post them if someone wants to see my copy-I just thought I would save some time posting what is already scanned.

I do NOT have copies of many of the color pictures on the web and do not take credit for them.

The beginning is always a great place to start, so let’s get a little history of the beginning out of the way.

When George Hurst left the Navy he opened a repair shop in Philadelphia and quickly became known for his engine swaps.  This was made easier because he developed a set of motor mounts that allowed for a number of engine and then later engine/trans swaps.  The tranny swapping was a natural beginning to an industry creating shifters.  Hurst eventually contacted enough buyers that he built a production facility in Warminster, Pennsylvania, to go along with his research facility in Madison Heights, Michigan. Jack “Doc” Watson was hired as an engineer to work in Michigan and he quickly became involved in some special projects, most notably the Barracuda wheelstander “Hemi Under Glass” and the “Hurst Hairy Olds.” 

Here is an early showing of some Hurst cars at the drags:


Hemi Under Glass wheelstander (Named because the engine is under the big back window):

Hurst Hairy Olds:

Hurst’s biggest break came when Pontiac agreed to sell his shifters as a dealer installed part in 1963, then made them OEM (factory installed-Original Equipment-Manufacturer) in 1964. Other auto makers followed suit, and soon the Hurst shifter was available in most muscle cars right from the factory (AMC in mid-69, to coincide with the new Hurst inspired SC/Rambler).

In 1968, Watson made a special Oldsmobile for George Hurst.  George convinced Olds to make the car, and in June 1968 the first of a series of Hurst Olds were made.  The cars were made in the Lansing, MI assembly line, and then sent to Demmers Tool and Die Company (in an old warehouse) for assembly.  These were NOT done at the Hurst facility.  Here is one:

Also in 1968, Hurst contracted with MOPAR to make 50 Hemi Darts and 50 Hemi Barracudas.  (50, as that were what NHRA required for homologation).  Final tally was about 80 Darts and 70 Barracudas.  These cars were sent to Hurst minus a number of components, to include the entire front-end sheet metal!  Some of the changes for the car were fiberglass front-end sheetmetal, with a huge scoop on the hood.  Plastic windows, but the door mechanism to roll up the windows was missing-instead, straps were used to open/close the windows.  The car used Dodge van seats, and most importantly, the 426 Hemi engine.  A number of items, such as the heater, were deleted.  These cars were made at the Michigan Hurst facility.  (An interesting note-the front end was kept natural fiberglass black color-no paint).  Here is a picture (and the scoop-though larger-should look familiar):

 


“From the web:

In 1968, Dodge released one of the most feared drag cars ever: the 1968 Hurst Hemi Dart.  Dodge would ship Dart body shells to Hurst and they would install a ram-inducted 426 cu in (7 Liter) Hemi V8 under the hood.  Using fiberglass fenders and hood, belt straps for window cranks, and A100 seats for decreased weight, this car and its sister car, the Hurst Hemi Barracuda, would dominate Super Stock for decades to come; in fact, it still does today.”

 

“During the 1968 model year, between 50 and 70 (reports vary) Dart 2-door hardtops were fitted with the 426 Hemi engine.  These cars were purpose-built race cars, did not come with a warranty, and were not intended for street use (although some enterprising purchasers did manage to register them).  They are variously known as Super Stock or "LO23" Darts, the latter taken from the first four digits of their VINs.  The cars were built without engines and shipped to Hurst for completion.  Many weight-saving measures were taken, including omission of the heater, radio, and sound-deadening insulation.  The cars also came with fiberglass front fenders and hoods, as well as light weight Corning glass side windows that were raised or lowered with straps instead of the normal regulator assemblies.  As an additional weight-saving measure, the standard bench seat was replaced by two lightweight buckets sourced from the Dodge A-100 van.  The Dart's rear wheel openings were radiused out to allow for larger tires.  The cars were shipped unpainted, with black gelcoat on the fiberglass front clip and gray primer from the firewall back.”

There was one other interesting Hurst car with Dodge for 1968.  New York City changed the specifications for interior dimensions for their taxi cabs.  Only the Checker could meet these.  Dodge hired Hurst to lower the floorboards of 1500 cars so they would meet the New York specs.  Who would think-a Hurst taxi!

At this same time, some point in early October 1968, AMC had some talks with Hurst about supplying the new shifter for their line of car, most notably the new for 1968 AMX and Javelin.  These talks for the shifter evolved into talks about building two cars for AMC:  the Rambler SC/Rambler, an out-of-the-box street race car, and the SS/AMX, an out of the box quarter mile race car. 

Here is an "A" scheme SCRambler:
 

Here is a "B" scheme SCRambler:
 
Work began on the cars, but I do not know exactly when.  AMC already had a Performance Division in place, notably to promote the Grant funny car Rebel driven first by "Banzai" Bill Hayes, and when he was injured he was replaced by Hayden Proffit. A Performance Activities binder was sent to dealers with the promise of many future bulletins to help local performance events.  Here are three:






They were gearing up to race the Javelins in the Trans Am racing series in 68, and felt someone in charge of performance would be an asset to the company. Carl Chakmakian was the man for the job.  



Here are some pics of the 68 Javelin Trans Am cars and Grant's Funny car:
 

(Before the corporate red, white, and blue paint scheme) 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
AMC also ran an ad about their racing program, and promising more to come:
 

A prototype Super Stock 1969 AMX was made for testing.  It was painted the soon-to-be traditional red, white, and blue.  A number of hood scoop designs were used, and one was selected to begin trials.  Through some trial and error, a final product was tested and presented to the AMC brass.  They were more than impressed, and gave the go-ahead to begin production.  The NHRA deemed 50 cars were needed for homologation purposes, so 50 were to be built. 

So what is homologation?  Here is a definition:

“In motorsports, Homologation refers to the approval process a vehicle must go through to race in a given league or series.  The regulations and rules that must be met are generally set by the series' sanctioning body.  The word is derived from the Latin homologare for "agree".”

“In racing series that are "production-based," (that is, the vehicles entered in the series are based on production vehicles for sale to the public), homologation entails not only compliance with a racing series technical guidelines (for example, engine displacement, chassis construction, suspension design and such) but it often includes minimum levels of sales to ensure that vehicles are not designed and produced solely for racing in that series.  Since such vehicles are primarily intended for the race track, use on public roadways is generally a secondary design consideration, except as required to meet government regulations.” 

So a minimum was needed to build a car for use on the track.  The NHRA declared 50, but other sanctioning bodies were not the same.  It is said 100 Trans Am Javelins were built in 1970 for homologation purposes.  What were they homologating?  This car had a tri color paint scheme with dealer available spoilers front and rear.  I’ve always heard 100 for homologation reasons, but never was able to document this. 

This is called “hearsay evidence” until it can be supported. 

There is support that at the beginning of the 1970 SCCA Trans Am racing season the homologation standards changed.  Now a percentage of the previous years’ production must be made to homologate a car or part.  For 1970, AMC came out with the Mark Donohue Javelin.  

It had a special spoiler, and a percentage of the previous years Javelin production had to be made to allow AMC to use this spoiler on the race car.  The total needed was 2501 Mark Donohue Javelins.  Now for years the AMC community said they had to make 2500 and “one in case something happened”, etc.  If this were true, then there would also have to be 2500 AAR Cudas and TA Challengers.  There were not-their production numbers were as follows:

“From the web:

Officially 2,724 AAR 'Cuda's with US specification (Y05) and 149 with Canadian specs (Y07) were produced at the Hamtramck, MICHIGAN Plant between March 10, 1970 and April 21, 1970.

The T/A would only be available for 1970 as Dodge pulled out of Trans Am racing.  Only 2,142 T/As were made.”

As you can see.  Less than 2500.  Yet for years, the AMC hobby repeated “2500 plus one extra in case something happened”.  (And what would happen?  They just had to make the cars-if one was damaged, do you think they would have to start all over?)

And for history, here are the production numbers for the Boss 302 Mustang, Z/28 Camaro, and Trans-Am Firebird, all 1970 SCCA Trans Am race cars:

“Boss 302- Production numbers were 1,628 in 1969 and 7,013 in 1970.  Base Price in 1970 was about $3,720.”

The Z/28 option code was introduced in December 1966 for the 1967 model year.  This option package wasn't mentioned in any sales literature, so it was unknown to most buyers.  The Z/28 option required power front disc brakes and a Muncie 4-speed manual transmission.  The Z/28 featured a 302 cu in (4.9 L) small-block V-8 engine, 3" crankshaft with 4" bore, an aluminum intake manifold, and a 4-barrel vacuum secondary Holly carburetor of 780CFM.  The engine was designed specifically to race in the Trans Am series (which required engines smaller than 305 cu in (5 L) and public availability of the car.  Advertised power of this engine was listed at 290 hp (216 kW).  This is an under-rated figure.  Chevrolet wanted to keep the horsepower rating at less than 1hp per cubic inch, for various reasons (e.g. insurance and racing classes).  The factory rating of 290 hp occurred at 5300 rpm, while actual peak for the high-revving 302 was closer to 360 hp (268 kW) (with the single four barrel carb) and 400 hp (298 kW) (with optional dual-four barrel carbs) at 6800-7000 rpm.  The Z/28 also came with upgraded suspension, racing stripes on the hood and trunk lid, '302' front fender emblems on the early cars, and 'Z/28' emblems in late 68 & 69.  It was also possible to combine the Z/28 package with the RS package.

Only 602 Z/28s were sold in 1967.  The 1967 and 1968 Z/28s did not have raised cowl induction hoods as was optional on the 1969 Z/28s.  The 1967 Z28 received air from an open element air cleaner or from an optional cowl plenum duct attached to the side of the air cleaner that ran to the firewall and got air from the cowl vents.  15-inch rally wheels, were included with Z/28s had while all other 1967-9 Camaros had 14-inch wheels.

The origin of the Z/28 nameplate came from the RPO codes - RPO Z27 was for the Super Sport package, and RPO Z28, at the time, was the code for a Special Performance Package.

67 Production numbers:

RS: 64,842

SS: 34,411

Z28: 602

Total: 220,906

 

68 Production numbers:

RS: 40,977

SS: 27,884

Z28: 7,199

Total: 235,147

 

69 Production numbers:

RS: 37,773

SS: 34,932

Z28: 20,302

Total: 243,085

 

1970- "Z-28 Special Performance Package" featuring a new high-performance LT-1 360 hp (268 kW) 380 lb*ft (520 N*m) of torque 350 cu in (5.7 L) V8

 

1970

Production Numbers

Z28

8,733

$572.95

 

1970 Eliminator production figure = 2,267

1969 Eliminator production figure = 2,250

 

Here are the 69 Production Figures:                                        1970 numbers:

Javelin-40,675                         1/250th=1017                         Total made-2501 Mark Donohue Special

Mustang-299,824                    1/250th=7496                         Total made-7013 Boss 302

Cougar-100,085                      1/250th=2502                         Total made-2267 Eliminator

Camaro-243,085                      1/250th=6077                         Total made-8733 Z28

Firebird-87,011                                    1/250th=2175                         Total made-3196 Trans Am

Barracuda-31,987                    1/250th=800                           Total made-2873 AAR Cuda

Challenger-new for 1970                     1/250th=?                    Total made-2142 TA Challenger

 

 

And while I am on production numbers, here are a few more:

1512 SC/Ramblers were made.  Why?  Because that is all they sold. (It was a mid-year production car). If they could have sold 3,000, they would have.

There were 784 SC360s made.  Why?  Because this car was never meant to sell a lot, but to get people into the dealerships.  A letter was sent out to dealers stating the timeline for ordering SC360s had ended, and production had ceased on the car.  

It was never designed to be a big seller.  Here are two Primary Source Documents showing just that:

 

 

 

Machines:  there were 1936 cars made.  Here is the Primary Source document:

 

 

Despite this “in-your-face-can’t-get-any-clearer” document, people still say 2326 were made, or “depending on the source, there were 1936 or 2326 made”.  Please, what is the other source????  This is THE final production document from AMC.  There were ONLY 1936 made.  Could we please get it right!

 

Back to the Super Stock cars.  It is written all over the place that the NHRA needed 50 built cars to be sanctioned for racing.  Here are some examples from other makes:

“These 50 special Novas fit into NHRA rules structure, but the stylish though often heavier Camaro remained the weapon of choice for most competitors; with the new transmission, Chevrolet had cars in both SS/C and SS/CA.  By the time they arrived (Spring 1968), (Gibb Chevy Nova II)” 

“W-30 Olds Smith and Chief Engineer John Beltz, along with Hurst's Jack "Doc" Watson sold Oldsmobile management on the idea of building a limited run of special 442s engineered to compete on the drag strip and positively annihilate any musclecar on the street, even the Hemi.  A run of at least 50 cars was necessary to homologate this special 442 for NHRA competition and legalize all the parts that comprised the package.”

“Though the ZL1 Camaro was the sleeper's sleeper, it was never meant for road use.  The idea was to homologate these cars for NHRA Super Stock racing.  To satisfy the rule, Chevrolet had to build and sell at least 50 of them.  La Harpe, Illinois, was the home of Fred Gibb Chevrolet.  Gibb requested the first batch via the Central Office Production Order (COPO), the way for dealers to obtain special equipment on Chevrolets so long as the process did not interrupt the normal flow of production cars.  In short, if you (Gibb and Harrell) knew the right guys (Vince Piggins, et al), you could pretty much get whatever you wanted.  In extreme haste, Fred Gibb ordered 51 of the socially unacceptable beasts and the first load was delivered on New Year's Eve, 1968.  A few weeks later, while Gibb and I were looking over the Camaro's mundane appointments at Harrell's shop, he told me that he was so excited about the event that he'd left a party early to be at his store when the truck arrived with its historical cargo.”

Despite everyone saying 50, the AMC crowd still says “52 plus....here it comes-one in case something happened”.  Thus the “52 or 53, depending on the source” you see quoted.  (And again, what source?)  Even though it may be written all over the ‘net that 50 were needed, where is the Primary Source document that proves this?  I haven’t seen one for the other models, but I do have one for the SS AMX!  A letter was sent out to various dealers that had a racing program in place-not every dealer got this letter.  It was dated November 4, 1968 and mailed November 5 (and was received at CA Cox Rambler, Wollaston, MA on Nov 7-he dated everything).

 

 

 

Note the price-not to exceed $5000. This was signed by Bill McNeilly, the VP of Marketing, who had the enviable job of promoting this and other AMC cars. 

Here is a copy of the envelope (I told you Cox saved everything, dated it, 3 hole punched it and put it in a binder). 

 

 The letter as seen above mainly asked for 50 dealers to step forward to order the car or it would not be made.  Price would be about $5000.  The deadline to order was November 20, 1968.  An order form was attached.  AMC was going to build a Super Stock race car!  It is very clear they must build FIFTY (50) cars.  So why do so many people quote “they had to build 52?”  Where did this come from?  Just more AMC speculation that is repeated enough that it becomes the standard.

So, can we all agree AMC only had to build 50 cars?

 

Let’s look at one other clue from this Primary Source document.  Note the date?  Somewhat early in the model year.  So why do we see “after the success of the SC/Rambler, AMC worked with Hurst to build a race car”.  What success?  1512 cars is not really a success.  Plus, the SCRambler was introduced to the public at the Chicago Auto Show March 8, 1969.  The SS/AMX cars were being made at this time, with 50+ confirmed orders. They were released late March and early April.

Therefore, the “success” of the SC/Rambler had nothing to do with the SS/AMX. They were both actually conceived at the same meeting.

Two myths down…….

The November 20, 1968 deadline came and went and only 40 cars were ordered.  A second letter dated December 2, 1968 was sent to the dealers again (Mailed Dec 2, 1968 and received Dec 5, 1968).

This letter stated the dealership was contacted as they had sponsored a race car the previous year.  It went on to say what was going to be done to the car:

Hood scoop and induction

Special manifold and carbs

Clutch and bellhousing

Modified cylinder heads

Relocated battery

Modified suspension

Altered wheelwells

It also stated it was not for street use, did not pass emissions, and had no warranty.

Nothing about tires and wheels, paint, pistons, etc. etc.

And get this:

"the prototype vehicle is nearing completion". 

 

So here is an admission from AMC on a Primary Source document that states a Hurst SS/AMX was made that is not in the sequence commonly accepted.  Call it prototype or whatever, it is a Hurst-made SS/AMX, but this car surely does NOT fit into the VIN sequence we have all seen and acknowledged as “the only ones made”

Another myth down (and FYI-the whereabouts of this car is known-Howard Maseles raced it for Hurst, then Jack Thomas and then it was sold to Garrett Ghezzi, who still owns it and races it competitively.)

Here is a copy of the Dec 2 letter:

 

 

 

 

So, you now see why I questioned the production numbers of these cars.

Here are some pictures of the original prototype AMX (note the scoop).  The car was sent to Miami FL for development, then on to Orange County Raceway to introduce to the Press.  It was also a time to introduce HL and Shirley Shahan, who were signed by the Southern California AMC dealers to race a SS/AMX on their behalf.  (HL Shahan did a lot of prep work on this car before the release to the press, a lot of it at the Hurst facility).

(Another myth-she was signed by Corporate AMC, but she raced for the Southern California Dealers Association.  AMC retained ownership of the car and it had to be returned when the Shahans were done with it).  

And here is an interview (I do not know the author):

Here she is with Bill McNealey of AMC, George Hurst, and her husband H.L.  This was mid-February 1969 at Orange County International Raceway, Calif.


This is one of the test runs down the track for the Press.


I have to wonder about this scoop, but then again, they did design the Hurst Olds scoop and the SCRambler scoop.

Here she is inside the car.  Note back of scoop, heater controls (remember, it was a prototype.  

No big deal).  Headrests have been removed.  And is that a clock knob?

And again. Carpet is obviously cut, no radio pod, tach in the center pad, the car had headrests 

but they have been removed.  Waffle style headliner.

And a block of wood on the clutch pedal!


Definitely a white car.  Still has hood hinges, missing core support bars, filler in front of radiator, 

(Piece attached under the hood did not see production).

(Some of these pics came from a Car Craft article).

Also involved with this project was David Landrith, who had just signed on with Hurst and would 

leave in 1971 to start his own racing consulting firm-one of his first customers were the 

Shahans and their Hornet and Gremlin SS cars.  Here is a scan of Dave:



Though it may look like this SS/AMX he is sitting in has leather seats, further study with a better computer application just shows it to be the "dots" in the 69 upholstery.

 
And Dave was not the only one to come from Hurst:

And the New York Zone also had a Performance Specialist (I wonder if all the zones had one):


 



Edited by tbenvie - Dec/28/2009 at 8:48pm
Thomas M. Benvie
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  Quote theamcguy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/08/2009 at 7:31pm
Tom;  None of the documents or figures were included in the post.  Can they be reposted?  Thanks
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  Quote Hornet_X Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/08/2009 at 7:41pm

So here is an admission from AMC on a Primary Source document that states a Hurst SS/AMX was made that is not in the sequence commonly accepted.  Call it prototype or whatever, it is a Hurst-made SS/AMX, but this car surely does NOT fit into the VIN sequence we have all seen and acknowledged as “the only ones made”

 

Another myth down (and FYI-the whereabouts of this car was known in the early 80s-Howard someone owned it.  Anyone know more?)

 Yes I do.
 
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  Quote PlazinJavelin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/08/2009 at 8:22pm
Thanks for the write up Thomas, I still hope you put all this documentation in to book form some day and get a publishing deal. Looking forward to the pics to go along with the post.
 
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And will you share? This AMC history lesson is an excellent bonus prize for deciding to join the hobby just last Nov. Can't wait to hear more. Your first name wouldn't be Howard would it? :)


Edited by PlazinJavelin - May/08/2009 at 8:26pm
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  Quote PHAT69AMX Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/08/2009 at 8:32pm
"Also, the images are not part of this article yet-I will add them probably Sunday"
 
( theamcguy - Second sentence in the first post )  Wink
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  Quote tbenvie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/10/2009 at 6:16pm

Now the cars were a go.  Cars were shipped to Hurst for final completion.  There were two pictures of the cars in the facility, one from Car Craft, the other from Car Exchange.  And someone put them both together to show the shop. (Picture has been credited to A. B. Shuman, but he said it was a Hurst publicity shot.  I wonder how many they took? Shuman used the pic in an article he did about the Shahans for Car Craft -see article below.)

So let’s look at photo number 1.

The cars appear white with black wheels.  Possibly 3 aircleaner assemblies stacked near the crate.  Some hoods appear to be upside down on the roofs, other are still on the car.  Decklids are open.  There appears to be an engine/tranny combo on a wooden pallet in front of one car.  There is a portable engine puller in front of one of the cars.  There is some stuff on top of the upside down hoods.  And please note:  Rocker Moldings!

Another myth undone.

Now look at photo number 2. 

There are obviously some stamped metal parts in the crates.  No idea what they had to do with AMC.  They are possibly floor pans from the Dodge Taxi project as thy were being worked on when owners came to take delivery of their AMXs.

The first car looks like it is missing the steering wheel as you look through the passenger door window.  And look all the way back at the car up higher than the rest.  Sure looks like a Javelin to me, missing the door and nose.  So anyone know what that is doing there?  A Hurst SS/Javelin?  And does it have paperwork, or will it be lost to history because it does not?  More later, but this is the Hurst NASCAR Javelin.

Now look at both pictures combined and cropped by Kevin of Cincinatty:  

How many cars do you see here?  I’m counting 3 cars between the upright posts.  That is all that will fit.  It looks like there are 6 cars in a row, times 4 rows, or 24 cars tops.

Now here is some “hearsay” evidence.  This is word of mouth evidence without any documented back-up.  I talked to “Doc” Watson in the mid 80s, I think about 1984-85.  He told me numerous times AMC was the worst company to do business with as they wanted things “on the cheap”.  One thing he told me was a story about the cylinder heads.  Hurst wanted 50 sets of heads sent to Crane, modified, and then sent back to Hurst for installation.  AMC wanted Hurst to remove the factory heads, send them to Crane, then wait for them to come back.

Watson told me arrangements were made to send half the cars to Hurst for the modifications, then when done they would take the other half.  AMC sent all the cars at once, which really ticked off the boys at Hurst.  He told me he sent half of them back to AMC.  So was there room outside the plant to store the vehicles until they were done?  And if so, is that a practice Hurst used?  There must be some pictures or documents somewhere.  This picture does NOT show all the Hurst cars being modified.

Here is a picture of the Hemi Darts outside the Hurst facility.  You can see it did not hold 50 cars:

Another myth down.

And speaking of myths.  For the longest time, everyone said the SC/Ramblers were also done at the Hurst facility.  Swore to it, some even saw them there.  Used this photo to document it:

Now there is a problem if you just look at a photo without further investigation.  This is a photo of a number of SC/Ramblers.  Compare it to the SS/AMX photo number 1.  Does this look like the same building?  Same walls, light, windows, height of ceiling, etc?  No, it is not the same building.  Where is it, then?  This is a warehouse HL Shahan used to store and work on the SC/Ramblers sent to him for the press runs at Orange County International Raceway.  And then I found this photo and published it in the New England AMX Club newsletter, the AMX-Press:

 

Though the picture is celebrating an AMX milestone, look what is on the assembly line behind the AMX?  Yes, proof positive the SCRambler was made on the East Assembly line in Kenosha.

More AMC myths exposed.

So just what was done to these cars at Hurst?  Here is what was written in the original letter to the dealers:

 So the cars started off as a regular production AMX with a short option list.  All cars painted P72A Frost White (and this is very different from a “body in white”, which is a unibody assembly in primer, not painted).

The cars had a charcoal interior and were equipped with a 390 4 speed, posi rear with 4.44:1 gears, manual steering, manual drum brakes, no undercoating (which was an option, so it was not added to the option list), and no sound deadener (which is carpet sound deadener, not body sound deadener).  No radio, no clock.  They were not Go-Pac equipped, so no stripe.  To start.  We have proven it had rocker moldings.  Now, what about mirrors, wipers, heater assembly?  Spare tire assembly?  Wheels and tires?  More later.

Here are two build sheets posted on net.  (The first is from the ssamx.com website):

 

(Second sheet from www.performanceamstyle.com)

The Sequence Number on a Build sheet is really the Body Number from the door tag.  This is the sequential number of Javelins and AMXs coming down the line of the Body Plant.  This particular number is R022185 on the first sheet, R022203 on the second sheet, showing they were made the week of January 11, 1969.  They are 18 cars apart. (Note:  I do not believe the cars came with a door data plate. Why would it?  They did NOT conform to Federal specifications!)

The Serial Number is the last 7 digits of the VIN, in this case X213585 (Car #26) for the first sheet, X213589 (Car #30) on the second sheet.  Here, they are 4 digits apart.

Haven't broken down the "Order No." yet, but you can see they are 18 digits apart.  (18 the other way from the Sequence Number)

It was a common practice to build the bodies and ship them to the final assembly plant not necessarily in the same order.  Therefore, the Body, Sequence, and VIN number were rarely in sequence.

The Zone shows “00”.  This usually stands for a factory based car, so probably is correct.

The car will be shipped via ground “G”.  It is an AMX (39-7), with the color 72 Frost White and interior 31F, charcoal vinyl.  The tire code is “00”.  Interesting as I don’t have this code.  I was told the car was delivered on Javelin spare tires on black rims, and there are pictures of the cars with black rims and skinny front tires.  Another source shows E70 x 14 blackwall tires. At any rate, the "00" could also mean a special order wheel color, as black was not the standard wheel color for a frost white car.

A “2” in seatbelts and a “1” in headrests are standard for 1969.

A “9” for engine is a 390, an “M” for trans is a 4-speed.  Gear Ratio “F” I have as 3.54:1, standard on a 4-speed AMX.  These were changed to 4.44:1 as shown in the Special Instructions" section of the sheet.

No number in “DE”, Dual exhaust.  Interesting there is no number because it did come with an exhaust.  A “1” in “TGD” shows it had a twin grip differential.

Next line: “WE” is Weather Eye, for a heater.  The “9“ shows Command Air.  This doesn’t make any sense.  More research needed. At any rate the heater was not installed on the assembly line and the car received block-of plates. (A large one for the heater motor, another for the heater core, another to take the place for the heater control, a block-off for the defroster ducts (made of cardboard), and lastly a plate that blocks off the opening where the fresh air would flow through the heater core through the cowl vents.

I do not know what the “6” is in TS LGR.  I haven’t seen this on other AMX build sheets. TS stands for "Third Seat" and LGR means "Luggage Rack", codes used for wagons.  AMC did put codes in boxes that were not standard for that model to designate something (the Donohues I am pretty sure had a "4" in the box for cruise control, an option not available on the Javelin)

The “1” in HDC LDC is for Heavy Duty Cooling.  The “1” in HB is Heavy Duty Battery.

Under Special Instructions, assembly line workers were told to delete sound deadener (under carpet) and hood insulation, install special 4.44:1 rearend gears, and allows for “deviation of No. 96”.  Sure wish I knew what “deviation of No. 96" was-anyone care to guess? 

By the VIN, the first sheet shown here should be car # 30; the second would be #26.  However, Hurst assigned them their own numbers.

I also wish there were other Build Sheets for the other cars.

From letter #2 from American Motors:

Hood scoop and induction

Special Manifold and Carbs

Clutch and Bellhousing

Modified Cylinder Heads

Relocated Battery

Modified Suspension

Altered Wheelwells

It also stated it was not for street use, did not pass emissions, and had no warranty.  And noted the car did not conform to emissions standards (could this be the "deviation of 96", meaning no emission controls on the engine)?  Being a 4 speed, the car would have a smog pump and all related components.

No mention of pistons at all.  No mention of a different shifter assembly, or parts.  Does modified suspension also mean axles?  Or just shocks and springs?  Any other deleted items?

This could be answered in the third letter from Hurst.  A number of dealers were unhappy about the readiness of the car, and let AMC know just how unhappy they were.  To answer this, AMC performance sent a letter to the dealers that ordered a car:


HMMMM.  "One of which you have purchased"  Why would Cox get this at his dealership?  Could this mean he actually ordered an SS/AMX?  He got this letter, and that is what it states, right?  I would say yes.  But...look at the date.  This could not be for the car listed on eBay because that car wasn't even on the production line when this was sent out.

And look at the signature.  More here:

So Chakmakian is gone. 

What a shocker for the dealers who ordered this car!  "Only those items needed to be installed per NHRA specs!"  Who would have thought that and read into it when the first letter came out?  Dealers were outraged!  They sure seemed to have expected the car to come balanced and blueprinted, and maybe even overbored.

And I wonder what the mention of the paint job meant?  When I asked Watson about the car's paint, he stated that Hurst was not a paint shop, and didn't paint the cars.  This seemed to make sense with the delivery of the Hemi Darts with an unpainted nose.  But again-this is "Hearsay"-no proof.  I have been trying for years to find out how and where these cars were painted, but no luck.  Probably a local shop. Plus, was a tri-color paint job extra cost?  I would think yes.  Later in the letter, there is a mention of tri-color paint, so they obviously came that way.  

While at the Hurst facilities, a sheet was put on the windshield with a checklist and car number.  Here is an example:


Here is a cleaned-up blank:

The sheet designates the car number and if it was all white, or red, white, and blue.  Some interesting work:  cut and patch floor pan.  Know why?  More later.

How about "set up air package?”  What is this?

There was also a sheet for the engine.  

Luckily, there are two different cars with this sheet.  Two items here not previously mentioned: Pistons and Flywheel.  I wonder what the big "R" stands for?

So there is a missing document.  I don't have it, but hopefully someone does.  This is the actual order form for the dealers.  This form would give the options for color, for instance.  It would specifically spell out what comes with the car, and what does not come with the car.  It would determine the paint scheme.  And most importantly, it would show prices.  The original letter showed a price of about $5000, yet it is reported they cost almost $6000.  That is a HUGE difference for 1969.

Now here is some NHRA update Tech Sheets:


Note the carb type-a Holley 4584, with AM part #4487187. Here is a pic of the carb numbers:





 

NHRA Technical Specifications

 



Issued:        1 March 1969

Revised:       4-1-69, 4-17-70, 7-17-70, 4-1-71, 4-26-74

               6-24-95, 2-4-05, 12-21-05 WR, 8-3-06 WR

Bulletin #:    Amer-69   Page 1 of 1

Specifications for the   1969 American Motors engines


H.P. Disp.     C.R. Ind. Make Model/Transmission         Manifold  R.R. Lifter         Head cc   Notes 


315  390      10.2  1-4  Cart AFB-4664S/SM   4665S/AUTO  3191736-C 1.6  H              49.10

340  390      12.2  2-4  Holl 4584/SM ONLY               4486228   1.6  H              57.00       2


Notes

2    Super Stock Only    Carb size 1562x1562/1250x1313


            Deck   Piston Type                   

H.P. Disp.   Cl    Dish/Dome  Ht    Vol    Valves    Cam Lift    Springs     Gasket   Head Cast Notes                    


315  390     .028    FLAT w/trough 13.94cc  2030/1630 425/425    Outer Only    .040     3188558

340  390     .038    DOME w/n       3.60cc  2080/1740 425/425    Outer Only    .030     558,291,993  A                                                                                                                                   


Notes

A = "O" rings may be used in the heads or the block if desired.

     It is not mandatory for a racer to use "O" rings, it is

     optional. A head gasket must be used in either case.



This brings up some questions.  First are pistons.  It isn't mentioned in earlier letters, but does show up in the engine checklist.  I have seen a number of brands mentioned, but my question is:  the parts were only supposed to be things the NHRA needed changed.  Were pistons one of these?  What is really silly to me is for the company to put standard bore pistons in the car, plus no blueprinting/balancing.  Then, they send out a notice on how to make free floating pins!  Well, the answer is the domed top of the piston.  AMC had to install these so the racers could use them.  The racers could overbore the cylinder as much as they wanted, but would have to use flat top pistons if AMC didn't put these domed ones in.  And there is a story that one racer used a piston with a different top design for the valves and had to change them.

Anyway, here is a letter from Brian Higgins to me from the late 80s.  He sent me an article that was written about his car (Westbury Rambler's S & K car).  You can see his writing in the margins:




Here is a better copy of the article, scanned from an original magazine (Super Street Cars, Feb 1970):

Nope, this isn't going to help as they talk about what pistons are in the motor, but not if 

they came that way.  I say this as they also talk about the cam in the engine, and they 

were definitely NOT changed from factory. (Because there are a number of factors that go

in to selecting a cam, to include altitude, so a Boston cam would be very much different 

than a Denver cam. Thus, the factory-stock cam was left in the engine).  I've also heard from owners 

that Hurst did nothing to the bottom end of the car (we know they put on a stock oil pan.  Seems 

crazy that they would pull the pan to replace the pistons, then put the stock pan back on.  How much 

more would it cost to put a deep pan and pick-up in?)  Anyone with definitive info on the pistons?  JE 

seems to be the piston company verified by most owners. That is verified with this notice found in a 

period drag publication Drag News:


And please note the carbs again.  I have seen everywhere carbs from 600 to 650 cfm.  Hurst put two 

Holley 4584 carbs on the intake (and I may be thinking of something else, but were they also labeled

 "L" and "R"?).  They are 570 cfm, and ONLY came on the SS/AMX cars, so sure have a premium price 

on them. 

Let's look at an article from Car Craft June 1969 posted by Phat69AMX:


First, there is mention that "most" of the cars were sold to dealers.  I wonder how many were sold to a private individual, and how they found out about it?

The prototype car originally ran an R4B and Holley 3bbl, and the heads were done by Hurst.  I wonder how they decided to send them to Crane when the project got going? As we all know, the intake became the Edelbrock Cross-Ram.

The stock horsepower for a 1969 390 engine was 315 hp.  The magazine mentioned that after some more tweaks, to include the crossram, they were able to get ANOTHER 28 horsepower from the car.  Let's see, that equals 343hp, yet the car was rated for 340-and this does not include the horsepower increase with the R4B, etc.  Wonder what the real horsepower on the prototype was?

Mentions Holley 4210 615 cfm carbs.  We know that is wrong.  I wonder how they determined the carb size for the final build, especially when the bore/cam was still to be determined by the new owner?

"That's all there will be.”  How did they know?  Here is a part that bothers me.  There is documentation that shows the beginning VIN sequence.  There is also mention the names of the owners will be sent to the NHRA for certification, or homologation.  But where does it say there will be no more made?  And they only had to send 50 names and VINs to the NHRA for certification, why would they have to send other names once the car was homologated?  There is no documentation that I have seen or heard of that says "this batch, and no more."  Remember the mention of the Hurst Hemi Dart?  They made 50, then later made 30 more.  Hmmmm.

Original parts and pieces are available from Hurst and AMC....”  I will look and find these prices in 1969.  There is a mention of the almost $6000 price for the car, a huge sum in 69.

JE Forged 12.25:1 pistons.  Someone must have a program to see hp ratings with the various parts on the car.  Total weight 3025 pounds.  Didn't it weigh about 3200 when new?


This post is locked.  Any comments?  Please post here:

http://theamcforum.com/forum/ss-amx-posts_topic10530.html



 



Edited by tbenvie - Dec/28/2009 at 8:53pm
Thomas M. Benvie
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  Quote Steve_P Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/11/2009 at 9:58am
The Trans Am homologation numbers for '70 break down like this:
 
1/250th total of 1969 production for company, or a minimum of 2500 (whichever is greater)
 
8200 chevy
7000 ford
2800 dodge
2500 AMC and Plymouth
 
This is from SCCA and quoted in a 1970 magazine.  I didn't write down the source, but those are the numbers listed.  I haven't verified them by back-checking with 1969 production figures. 
 
So, AMC had to make 2500 1970 Donohue Javelins as a minimum.
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  Quote tbenvie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/11/2009 at 1:16pm




Edited by tbenvie - Jul/13/2009 at 7:49pm
Thomas M. Benvie
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  Quote Steve_P Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/12/2009 at 9:00am
Tom, I know I pulled that out of a 69-70 magazine.  I do not quote internet posts.  I think you're misunderstanding?  I said:
 
1/250th total of 1969 production for company, or a minimum of 2500 (whichever is greater)
 
It's for the company (or division) and not the car model.  So, chevy would be 1/250 (or 2500 min) 1969 production of chevrolet, not camaro.  And AMC would be by total AMCs made, not javelin.
 
I don't know 1969 AMC production offhand, but I know it wasn't 500k; therefore, they had to build 2500 min per what I said, and this is what they did (2501)
 
I have 500++ vintage magazines so I'm not going to search for my source- I should've written it down but am sure it came from home as it is written on a notepad from there and I remember running across the figures and writing it down. 
 
I looked in my Trans Am hardback book and they say 2500 min. 
 
Feb 1970 Car Life magazine said 2500 or 1/250 but did not give specific breakdowns.  So, this can be checked if anyone wants to search for 1969 chevy, ford... production.
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  Quote billd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/12/2009 at 9:15am
I wish I had your magazine collection - I'd find a service to scan and catalog/index the articles, esp anything with the key words AMC, etc. - and put it online.
 
Steve I think you have posted that info before - it sure looks familiar -
Tom has some production numbers here - and I have some others, just haven't made time to get it posted yet. Once I get home I get lazy -
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