Resurrecting the Blue 74 Javelin with a 401

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   June must just not be my month!  Bad news just got worse.  

Only 7 of my 16 Comp Cam roller lifters (Model 848) were rebuildable.  The 861 won't work to fill in the rest of the set and there are no other 848's available down at Comp.  Its also official that the Cam is junked by the one roller that took down the lobe some.  So, looks like I'm back at that expensive drawing board of figuring out my valvetrain set up.

I've been checking out the Crane options and am considering going with a hydraulic roller.  That would mean switching the springs I got with my Indy heads, but that may not be a bad thing since its a lighter spring and would be more forgiving on a split-duty type car that will probably see a lot more street use once the track car is running.  If anybody has any input to offer on the subject, I'd be willing to check it out, especially if it helps save some bucks.

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Javelin74 Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List AMC Nut Joined: May/18/2010 Location: Scottsdale Status: Offline Points: 281	Post Options Post Reply Quote Javelin74 Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Jun/07/2011 at 4:59pm
	June must just not be my month! Bad news just got worse. Only 7 of my 16 Comp Cam roller lifters (Model 848) were rebuildable. The 861 won't work to fill in the rest of the set and there are no other 848's available down at Comp. Its also official that the Cam is junked by the one roller that took down the lobe some. So, looks like I'm back at that expensive drawing board of figuring out my valvetrain set up. I've been checking out the Crane options and am considering going with a hydraulic roller. That would mean switching the springs I got with my Indy heads, but that may not be a bad thing since its a lighter spring and would be more forgiving on a split-duty type car that will probably see a lot more street use once the track car is running. If anybody has any input to offer on the subject, I'd be willing to check it out, especially if it helps save some bucks.

amx39068 Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Visit Members Homepage Add to Buddy List Supporter of TheAMCForum Joined: Feb/21/2008 Location: Arizona Status: Offline Points: 10036	Post Options Post Reply Quote amx39068 Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Jun/07/2011 at 7:10pm
	I really like the Crane 302-2 cam for street and strip. It is a pretty big cam for a Hydro yet still streetable albeit with the right converter on an auto but a lot of fun on a standard tranny. I've done two or three engines with this particular cam and love the way they run with both stock and even higher than stock compression engines. A lot of other forum members like it as well.
	Dan Curtis, AZ AMC collector quality Restorations, Parts & Engines - amcmusclecars.com

Javelin74 Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List AMC Nut Joined: May/18/2010 Location: Scottsdale Status: Offline Points: 281	Post Options Post Reply Quote Javelin74 Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Jun/08/2011 at 2:30am
	Thanks for the tip, Dan. My uncle runs a similar cam in his 70 AMX (401) and loves it. I'm having a hard time convincing myself to cut costs and go with a flat tappet, but as I start to stare at the engine parts floating around my garage while waiting for me to make a decision and live with my budget, I am probably going to tip in favor of your suggestion. It would be nice to go with the Crane or Johnson hydraulic rollers, but I'm just not seeing it in the cards if I want this thing running when temps start dropping in the PHX area. While I'm asking for tips, any good suggestions for rod and main bearings on the reassembly? It's probably going to be more of a street car now that I have a track car in the works, but it will certainly see a open track day on a road course every now and then. I may be able to keep my mind off my misery while I put the bottom end on the 401 back together, at least.

amx39068 Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Visit Members Homepage Add to Buddy List Supporter of TheAMCForum Joined: Feb/21/2008 Location: Arizona Status: Offline Points: 10036	Post Options Post Reply Quote amx39068 Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Jun/08/2011 at 8:07am
	A lot of folks diss the Clevite 77s but I have had good luck with them on anything I have used them on. King still makes AMC bearings and most everyone seems to think they are good. I have used those as well and they have also been problem free.
	Dan Curtis, AZ AMC collector quality Restorations, Parts & Engines - amcmusclecars.com

Javelin74 Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List AMC Nut Joined: May/18/2010 Location: Scottsdale Status: Offline Points: 281	Post Options Post Reply Quote Javelin74 Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Sep/11/2011 at 4:04am
	Well, finally got back into the garage now that its not 110 out there any more. Now that the motor has been machined and the bearings and assorted odds and ends are here, the assembly can get rolling. Crank is in and the #1 piston has been dropped in. Hoping to get the bottom end done tomorrow. In the meantime, I've stripped out the old carpet and found an old rust hole in the interior that needed some patching from the old days back in Florida. Also started running the wiring for the Big Stuff 3 ECU. Hopefully have this thing back running just as the weather gets nice in AZ.

Javelin74 Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List AMC Nut Joined: May/18/2010 Location: Scottsdale Status: Offline Points: 281	Post Options Post Reply Quote Javelin74 Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Nov/02/2011 at 10:18am
	Well, after a couple of assemblies and disassemblies and dealing with some clearance issues, I'm finally back on track with getting the 401 completed. Just waiting on the right length pushrods to get here and I should have all the puzzle pieces at long last. I've decided to go with a Herbert Cams hydraulic roller and a set of Johnson's lifters (sold by Herbert). Still need to double check my piston/valve clearance once I've got the right length pushrods to move the valvetrain, but I'm not expecting a problem since lift is moderate at .555 (at least, moderate for a roller), but everything with this build seems to be having little issues. So, Fingers-crossed!!! I'm going to run the internal pickup with the Canton since it will see limited track time and always be on street/DOT tires. Just decided against the extra plumbing needed with the external set up, which I'll save for the track car build up. Also just got my rebuilt Harland Sharp rockers back so those look good as new and ready for the stud girdle setup. Due to all the little pieces still trickling in over the last month, not much progress has been made. Just saving it for a good run over a single weekend, which may be this weekend so long as all the parts do not give me any other unexpected problems. I'll post one pic, but as you can see, little has happened in the way of visual progress since the last pic...

Javelin74 Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List AMC Nut Joined: May/18/2010 Location: Scottsdale Status: Offline Points: 281	Post Options Post Reply Quote Javelin74 Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Jan/26/2012 at 9:54am
	Well, if it wasn't for another whoops/delay, I probably could have 2 of these built by now. Looks like the new Big Stuff 3 ECU does not support Hall Effect signals like the one off the Accel Dual Sync distributor I got to run the cam/crank signals...Really? Its 2012 and somebody makes a "high end" aftermarket ECU that has no support of Hall Effect signals??? So now I've got a distributor that does me no good on this project and I need to come up with a drastically different plan B because MSD nor FAST (or anybody else) make an IPU based signal dual sync distributor for AMC. So, looks like I may have to convert the MSD distributor I planned on running in the track car to make my cam signal and go to a crank wheel...more money...more time...and summer is going to be rapidly approaching in the AZ desert. At least everything else seems to be going smoothly, the ECU is working otherwise, getting oil through the block via a primer, etc... Well, here's a pic for an update.

Javelin74 Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List AMC Nut Joined: May/18/2010 Location: Scottsdale Status: Offline Points: 281	Post Options Post Reply Quote Javelin74 Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Jan/26/2012 at 9:55am


Javelin74 Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List AMC Nut Joined: May/18/2010 Location: Scottsdale Status: Offline Points: 281	Post Options Post Reply Quote Javelin74 Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Mar/19/2012 at 2:35pm
	Finally got the planets to align long enough to get the 401 running and broken in. Audio isn't great since its just off my phone and it was in the car with me, but at least its something. Had a couple of oil leaks to tackle so I spent Sunday doing a tear down and retorquing the heads (had a little leak off on of the extra 3/8th head bolts, too), setting the valve train, sealing the suspect leaks, putting the exhaust back on, and overall buttoning back up. The Big Stuff is pretty nice to use with the wideband O2 sensor guiding the tune. I may need to step up the injectors though. Haven't hooked up the cam signal yet to sync the injectors, but the crank trigger was working like a dream (once I sorted out the fact that I failed to use a 12v signal that was on during cranking as well as when powered on ---> rookie move!). She got really hot so I'm going to double check the timing, maybe pull some advance out, and try firing it up again tonight now that the gaskets have had a night to sit and cure. I may have to pull the intake off to reset the seal. What I first that was a leaking pan and/or rear main seal may have actually been a leak from the back of the intake gasket. The front seal up real good but I may have not got a good enough bead on the back. Fingers crossed, I located that with a little camera and tried the ghetto fix of fingering in some sealant after wiping the oil off real good with thinner.

Javelin74 Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List AMC Nut Joined: May/18/2010 Location: Scottsdale Status: Offline Points: 281	Post Options Post Reply Quote Javelin74 Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Mar/28/2012 at 1:30pm
	Well, she's running and broken in but unfortunately the leak at the back of the intake manifold is going to require a another few days of mending work. I'm not sure if the leak is from under or above (or both) the spacer that I made to fill the giant gap created by the Indy heads. I had epoxied the spacers to the block so I'm assuming the leak is coming from above but I won't know until its all pulled apart. I was able to cure the few other issues and leaks I had relatively easily but there had to be one that would be difficult. (One issue was the fact that the electric fan had to be reversed as you can tell from my reaction in the video to how it was blowing, and yes, I know that fan is loud). I'm stilll having weird issues with the MAP signal my ECU is seeing. I've been talking to some Big Stuff 3 reps and they are trying to find an answer for me. The ECU is reading half the value of vacuum that is actually coming off the MAP sensor. Voltage seems dead on all the way back to the pin on the ECU so it may require sending the box in...not the first time I ran into a problem like this. I had something similar with my older Haltech unit. The car still runs ok but I have to adjust the base program for half the value of vacuum (no boost yet, I'm trying to sort the motor out w/o the supercharger first). I did run it around the block and to get some fuel. Other than the intake manifold oil leak, she feels good, is making good oil pressure and sounds nice. I still need to throw the interior together and repatch the hole from where the Tremec went in. So long as the oil leak fix is succesful this weekend, I should have her back on the road and 100% together in the next 2 weeks.