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Resurrecting the Blue 74 Javelin with a 401

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Javelin74 View Drop Down
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    Posted: Mar/04/2011 at 1:47pm
Well, finally got around to taking the 401 I've been lugging around for the last 10 years to the machine shop today to get the blue car rolling again.  As stuff develops, I'll post some pics and probably throw out some questions for input.  For starters, here's the build plan...  Your 2 cents is appreciated.
 
Planned specs-
.30 over with Wiseco Pro Tru R-domes (expecting b/t 9.25-9.5 compression)
Stock rods w/ ARP hardware
Indy SR heads w/ extra headbolt holes (probably bowl port)
Torker intake w/ EFI conversion run by Big Stuff 3 ECU for sequential injection (42 lbs injectors???)
Powerdyne supercharger set at 6-7 lbs boost
Hooker super comp headers going to 2.5 dual exh w/ X-pipe
Comp Cams solid roller (276/280- 232/236 at .050 - .560/.580 lift)
Canton RR pan w/ external pickup and internal oil valley line
 
I think that covers the basics.  I know the compression would make some shake a little bit when added with a supercharger, but having read up on it, I think the centrifugal Powerdyne with aluminum heads, modern R-dome piston shape, and cam should be safe as long as I don't go nuts with too much advance on the timing. 
 
Thoughts? Comments?  Anybody got a desktop dyno?
 
It will still run through my TKO Tremec and Ford 9" rear. 
 
 
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Javelin74 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Mar/04/2011 at 1:48pm
BTW, the motor is off to Bailey's in Mesa, AZ...so thanks to Dan Curtis for setting me up with his motor man.  Got to see his 390 sitting on the bench while I was given the tour of the shop!!!
 
Thanks Dan!!!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BigBadJav Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Mar/04/2011 at 9:32pm
I can't speak too much for your combo, I really dig it, sounds like a great set of components, except for one piece. 
 
Why run the years-old Torker design when there are so many much more modern (and scienced-out) intakes out there?  I realize when you are running boosted the intake runner design becomes almost nearly moot,  but more power is ALWAYS a good thing, right?
 
If I were you, I'd run either an Indy or an HLR intake.  Either one I think would be easier to convert for EFI, as well.  I doubt the Torker has enough meat to drill for injector bungs without welding some additional material to the tops of the runners.
 
As for the compression with a blower, I had a friend bolted a 8-71 Huffer to his SS396 '70 Chevelle that had 12:1 pistons in it.  Ran it 25% underdriven (thing only made like 3psi of boost)  but you know what?  That thing ran like a raped ape!  And held together for a long time until he finally decided to sell it.
 
The big stuff 3 system should be able to be set up with a boost retard, so the timing won't be too much of a problem once you get the spark and fuel maps dialed.
 
You may, however, consider adding an intercooler to the system of some kind and/or a water/methanol injection system to help keep the detonation at bay.
 
Can't wait to see it all together. 
 
And have you considered going Turbo rather than supercharged?  I've always wanted to put together a Twin-Turbo 401 and see what it would do.  Messing with desktop dyno once I came up with a 1200hp combo!
ASE Certified Auto Tech, 14 yrs. experience. If I can't fix it, it ain't Broke!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Javelin74 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Mar/05/2011 at 1:29am
Thanks for the input, BBJ, and words of encouragement.
 
I'm running the Torker with the injection since I've already had it converted from about 15 years ago.  I ran the intake on my 360 with a Haltech E6 ECU and the powerdyne.  If they were around back then, I would have loved to have the Indy intake.  I'll throw in a pic of the intake below.
The 360 had the old low compression forged TRW's so I obviously never had any "ping" issues and even ran a a pulley that gave me 10 lbs.  But the 401 is definitely going to be a different animal.
 
When the old Powerdyne's were starting to get a dime a dozen from all the 5.0's blowing up from them, I picked one up that had been rebuilt for $400, so mocking up a bracket and getting a pulley made were relative simple.  All in all, it probably ran me about $600-700 to get the set up running.  I didn't want to mess with oil lines at the time, so the Powerdyne was a perfect fit.  Plus, they seem to run cooler so intercoolers really don't make as big a difference as they would with a Vortech or Procharger or one of those gear-driven beasts.
 
I've toyed with the idea of going turbo someday, but honestly, since most of my yah-yah's are got on a road course rather than a 1/4 mile, I already get a little nervous with the amount of power I have to get down coming out of corners on DOT tires.
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Javelin74 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Mar/30/2011 at 3:14pm
Well, all the parts are in EXCEPT for the Wiseco 401 pistons I ordered from Summit and the Indy SR heads I ordered (which should be in this or next week).  They were saying first week of April for the pistons but now the online info is saying 4/22/11.  Aargh!  Cry
 
In the meantime, the 360 has been pulled from the engine bay and I've got 2 gutless 74 Javelins sitting in my garage waiting to be brought back to life while the weather is perfect down in the Phx area.  I had hoped to get a few rides in before the nasty summer heat came, but not looking too likely now.Unhappy
 
In the meantime, I'm going to start wiring in the Big Stuff 3 ECU and harness and do some long overdue suspension and interior upgrades to the Blue Javelin and turn my attention back to the track car while waiting for the 401 to get finished.  Been throwing some ideas around for paint on the track car and after some intense pressure by the girlfriend, I'm considering Big Bad Orange with 2 black stripes over the top of the car.  My uncle has a 70 AMX painted BBO, and its got a nice "racey" look to that color.  Not sure how it would look on a "big" Javelin, but if not, I may go with a red.  Nice thing about Forza 3 is I can play with some ideas and get a sense of how they look.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote amx39068 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Mar/30/2011 at 5:09pm
Dan,
Glad it worked out for you. Baileys builds nice engines and stand behind their work. Bill is a hoot and Bob is a great guy.  If you get stuck on the pistons feel free to give me a jingle and I will contact Vic Ellinger directly and see if I can help move it along. 
 
Too bad you weren't doing a 360.  I have a brandy new set of their forged 360 pistons still in the box sitting right behind me in my office. 
 
BTW, another forum member from up north in tundra belt is in town and dropping by for a visit Saturday afternoon and then we are heading over to the Pavilions around mid afternoon until dark.  You are welcome to join us if you want.  I am debuting my green AMX which is now running well and hope to bring the Breedlove Tribute out as well although I am told that the water pump weep hole has started leaking at the showrooom/shop where it is currently residing so it may get a new water pump Saturday morning.
Dan Curtis-Owner and CEO AZ AMC Restorations; Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/amcmusclecars/ & Curtis Real Estate Development
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Javelin74 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Mar/30/2011 at 5:58pm
Much appreciated, once again Dan!!!  My uncle is in town from CO for the weekend, and has already been asking about hitting the show on Saturday.  I'll plan to look for a green AMX out there.  Might be a little on the later side (but hopefully by sunset) since we were thinking of heading down to Firebird to watch a little racing.  Mainly an import event down there this weekend, but still a decend showing of V8's at the event.  This is actually the event at Firebird from last year when my 360 let go...which reminds me, what size/type of 360 pistons are you talking about? 
 
My blown 360 was 30 over and is probably in need of another bore after the 20 years or so of abuse it saw, but I'm considering using that block in the track car so I might be interested, actually!  Smile
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote amx39068 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Mar/30/2011 at 6:56pm
They are the forged .030 over Wiscos with a 1.590 compression height and a 21cc dish comiing in right around a pump gas friendly 9.8 with small chamber heads doglegs if .010 is taken off the top of the block or 9.3 with big chamber heads.
 
I was going to build a stroker 343 with those pistons on bushed 68/69 390 390 rods and a 390 crank but the 70 AMX I am picking up has a good 70 360 in place of its original 390 so I am going to pull it and use the 360 in the Rebbie convert instead of the stroker 343.  It is not stock so I don't really think it matters a whole lot.  In fact, I may even restomod the convertible and have a real blast with it.  As a result, the 360 pistons are excess stock.
Dan Curtis-Owner and CEO AZ AMC Restorations; Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/amcmusclecars/ & Curtis Real Estate Development
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Javelin74 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Mar/30/2011 at 7:19pm
Well, if I end up with a different 360 block to build, I'll keep you in mind for a set of .30 overs.  Sounds like you ended up going with the easier project in the end, but it always is fun to imagine the "what if's..."
Hopefully, I'll catch up with you this Saturday!!!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Traveller Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Mar/30/2011 at 11:23pm
Good luck on Wiseco ETA's!  They told me the high compression pistons will be done by the end of next week, but told me the lower compression versions wouldn't be done until the 1st week of May.  I hope you get them earlier.  The last set we got went from a 1st week of January to a 1st week of February ETA.  We got them around the 8th.  They're nice parts although make sure you check weight.  I had one that was 3.5 grams light so I had to mill the other 7 to match.  They were all marked with the same weight, so someone must have read the scale wrong or been in a hurry.
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