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Rambler with Jag IRS, Take 2!!

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farna View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote farna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/02/2016 at 8:12pm
Here is a sketch of what I think I'm going to do. It's not to scale of course! I got the 1.5" by placing a 2x4 across the top of the Jag cradle. Hmmm.. mentioned that in the last post, didn't I...

Frank Swygert
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote farna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/24/2016 at 9:02pm
Found a minor snag. The new mounts are supposed to fit all Series III (79-92), but the "frame" side of the new mounts are slightly different from the ones on the cage. They are shorter and bolt holes are smaller. No problem since I am making stand-off plates. The new width is 2-3/8", so a 1/2" plate on the outside and 1/4 on the inside will work. 1-1/2 Rambler rail + 3/4" = 2-1/4" total. The mount tops will pull in a bit or I can use washers to make up the extra 1/8". Already bought the 1/2" and 1/4" plates. Will use all steel plates.
Frank Swygert
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote estes Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep/02/2016 at 1:50pm
Looks good so far!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote farna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep/02/2016 at 6:06pm
 Bought 16 5/16" grade 8 bolts (the holes in the new mounts are 5/16") today, along with a new cobalt drill bit. Looks like it's going to be a few weeks before I can find time to work on the car again. I was a bit concerned at first about the 5/16" bolts, but there are 8 holding the rear axle in. If that worked for Jaguar it should work for me!
Frank Swygert
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote farna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep/20/2016 at 6:56am
Got it all bolted in! Had intended to make the rear plates taller, but a helper misunderstood and cut them shorter. No big deal, not much stress on any. I made the front ones extend all the way up to the floor, even fitting under a lip between the floor and rail. I guess that was made as a pinch weld flange... couldn't see any specific reason for it, but I'm sure there is one.

My helper drilling holes in plates, before cutting rear.



Positioned by attaching lower leading arms. They remained in the same position as they were with the previous install, so should align the rear axle properly as it is raised into place. Bolted the plates onto the mounts before raising. I used lengths of 1" pipe that I happened to have on hand between the plates on the mounts to prevent crushing.



All bolted in and ready to go! The short rear plates can easily be seen. Would have preferred them all the way up to the floor. I can always pick up more plate and make a new set. Thought about it, but there should be no issues. Will watch it for a bit, and if there is any shifting I'll make new plates.



I got the wheels back on, but battery was too low from sitting three months to start car. I also have to have the over-the-axle exhaust pipe redone. Had to cut it out to get old axle out, but it wouldn't have worked with the new setup anyway. It passed between old crossmember and half shaft. The new one will be able to pass OVER the Jag cage, so a bonus of axle being able to be dropped without cutting exhaust. I expect a LOT of noise reduction due to the rubber mounts. Right now I installed a temporary turn-down on the exhaust pipe right in front of the axle. Will drive to exhaust shop like that... so won't get a feel for noise reduction of mounts until new exhaust is installed. Bought a bunch of bends at the local auto parts thinking I might be able to put something together, but I'd have had to use a piece of flex pipe for one of the bends. That would have eventually have needed replacement, so just decided I could wait a bit longer. Been sitting for 3-4 months, another week or two isn't going to hurt, but I'll take it for a test run this weekend with the exhaust turn down.


Edited by farna - Sep/03/2018 at 6:32am
Frank Swygert
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote LakesideRamblin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep/20/2016 at 7:38am
Nice work Farna. Thanks for sharing and good luck at the exhaust shop.
LakesideRamblin
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"If you could kick the person in the pants responsible for most of your trouble, you wouldn't sit for a month." T. Roosevelt
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote farna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep/21/2016 at 5:57am
One note: I measured the rear sills ("frame" rails) again with a mic. They are actually 1-5/8" wide, not 1-1/2", so there was no 1/8" to make up when bolting the plates on. Guess I was in a bit of a rush when measuring initially. 
Frank Swygert
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 304-dude Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep/21/2016 at 7:08am
Well live and learn... you did say that you will have to cut new ones because of your helper's error. So negating error by flipping a coin, or by seniority depends on who is in charge.

The main thing is you have a handle on it, so it is just a matter of cutting new plates.

Donno, because of the spacing between rail and IRS brackets, I would weld a cross plate just above where the IRS bracket ends when mounted. It will put less stress on the IRS bracket in pinch and twist. Though your plates seem thick enough to be stable under extremes. I guess I just don't like seeing such distance between mounting points with no reinforcement. The Jag brackets seem a wee thin for lateral compression. As, the further the distance between two points allows for torque and angle applied to be amplified.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote farna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep/22/2016 at 5:51am
There is a piece of 1" pipe in the center of the Jag mount, clamped between the bolts. The metal piece on the mounts are only about 1/16" thick. The pipe clamped in there provides a lot of support. I had considered using short bolts and maybe even tapping the plates, but the pipe does provide a lot of support, as you stated. Couldn't have used long bolts without the pipe -- as you stated, the mounts are a bit thin for lateral compression. Otherwise I don't see much to be concerned about. Those mounts have to take a lot more lateral force in the rear of a Jag (they were also used on the XJS V12 sports car) than in my Rambler. A cross piece wouldn't hurt though... even if just another pipe and bolt through rather than welded.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 304-dude Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep/22/2016 at 6:05am
well, I just thought how things looked and all. You have the items in front of you, so I am sure in your best judgement, you will do what you feel is best.

A while back in my replies... I stated to make a saddle. Meaning a support to fit in the bracket. like a cut in half square tube steel. It would take up some of the space between the rail and the wider Jag bracket. Sort of a dual purpose thing. Those plates are thick! Not a bad thing, as they serve their purpose in spacing and holding things in place.

As for Jag brackets doing their job... yes they do fine, but I look at things differently on how things mate and function together. Some may see two sandwiched plates are not going to be any different bolted together offset, rather centered. Maybe I am a symetric thinker, or it is just that I notice how angles and distances interact more or less with how things mate. I could just be an over thinker and all. Ha!
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