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PVC compressed air piping BAD

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White70JavelinSST View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote White70JavelinSST Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan/09/2014 at 9:15am

Dave, I respect your opinion,  and I appreciate your experience.

However I will never suggest to anyone to use PVC pipe for compressed gasses.
 
Every manufacturer of PVC pipe and CPVC pipe do not recommend it's use for compressed gases. Makes me wonder why....... 
 
Here's another blogspot on the subject.
 
 
Really, I'm not trying to get an argument going here. All I'm trying to do is pass on a bit of safe thinking to our hobby. With all that RM running around we need a reminder every now and then.
 
Armand 


Edited by White70JavelinSST - Jan/09/2014 at 9:25am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 401MATCOUPE Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan/09/2014 at 9:43am
I think I had a major advantage to this subject in the past....  Ihave seen a lot of shops with PVC or CPVC, which ever..plastic pipe.  I am not a fan and I was running Galvanized in my shop, when I went to the local salvage yard that also buys Surplus materials from large companies and mills.  I found a bundle of 3/4" Stainless Steel Pipe and a few sections of 1/2".  I bought it all by the pound...ended up cheaper the Galvanized, then realized after shopping the McMaster-Carr catalog how much fittings cost...my gosh, crazy price.  Went back a few weeks later to the Yard, anD asked about fittings, no problem..$3.00 a pound, I bought every 3/4" fitting he had a a bunch of 1/2"....he even included some 1/2" and 3/4" Stainless Ball Shut Off Valves for same price.  I thought I was out of the woods, until I needed to thread the pipe....crap, that stuff is tough, asked some friends and one had the Stainless Cutting Dies and another had a power threader.  So I have all of my newest part of shop in Stainless, check out the local Salvage and Surplus...there are still ways around massive expense.  I used an excellent layout diagram from TP Tools (was TIP Sand blast), they sell great plumbing kits...I bought one and duplicated in Stainless.
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FuzzFace2 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan/09/2014 at 10:23am

Originally posted by White70JavelinSST White70JavelinSST wrote:

Dave, I respect your opinion,  and I appreciate your experience.

However I will never suggest to anyone to use PVC pipe for compressed gasses.

 

Every manufacturer of PVC pipe and CPVC pipe do not recommend it's use for compressed gases. Makes me wonder why....... 

 

Here's another blogspot on the subject.

 

http://compressedair-intel.blogspot.com/2013/06/pvc-piping-for-compressed-air-disaster.html

 

Really, I'm not trying to get an argument going here. All I'm trying to do is pass on a bit of safe thinking to our hobby. With all that RM running around we need a reminder every now and then.

 

Armand 

Armand, It is all good no argument here either. Just want to help others pick what works best for them and be safe doing it. 

I am also not for the Home Depot plastic pipe even if the heavier grade but did you read the spec on what I posted?

http://www.aircompressorsdirect.com/RapidAir-M7500/p7618.html

Designed For High-Demand Air Tool Users
Heavier duty components for longer air runs in larger buildings

HDPE Tubing With Aluminum Core
High density polyethylene maintains any hand-bent shape
Easy wall installation- no need for special pipe benders

3/4 Inch Couplers
Maximum air pressure is 175 PSI at 70° F; 140 PSI at 140° F

Meets OSHA Guidelines
Compatible with common compressor oils
Convenient temperature range -40°F to 140° F

Nickle Plated Brass Double O Ring Design
Split ring allows disassembly
No expensive tools required

Master Kit Contains:
3 air outlets, one 3/4 inch NP straight fitting, 2 tees, 20 clips
100 feet of 3/4 inch HDPE tubing
Additional fittings and tubing sold separately

Leakproof & Corrosion Resistant
Installs quickly, lasts a long time

 

I guess if you look at the HDPE Tubing and not Aluminum Core you would think plastic pipe.

Look at the 2nd one down HDPE Tubing With Aluminum Core so it is not the HD pipe and is made just for this applation. I think it is the same type system they use on Power Block TV and they have pushed it on one of the shows IIRC.
Because of the temps in my garage (60*-100*) and what my comp. shuts off at (150-175 psi) I would have to cut back the shut off psi to be safe if using this kit but other than that I would run this and not worry.

 

As they say it is up to the users to do what they want.

My .02

Dave ----



Edited by FuzzFace2 - Jan/09/2014 at 10:27am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FuzzFace2 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan/09/2014 at 10:53am
Originally posted by 401MATCOUPE 401MATCOUPE wrote:

I think I had a major advantage to this subject in the past....  Ihave seen a lot of shops with PVC or CPVC, which ever..plastic pipe.  I am not a fan and I was running Galvanized in my shop, when I went to the local salvage yard that also buys Surplus materials from large companies and mills.  I found a bundle of 3/4" Stainless Steel Pipe and a few sections of 1/2".  I bought it all by the pound...ended up cheaper the Galvanized, then realized after shopping the McMaster-Carr catalog how much fittings cost...my gosh, crazy price.  Went back a few weeks later to the Yard, anD asked about fittings, no problem..$3.00 a pound, I bought every 3/4" fitting he had a a bunch of 1/2"....he even included some 1/2" and 3/4" Stainless Ball Shut Off Valves for same price.  I thought I was out of the woods, until I needed to thread the pipe....crap, that stuff is tough, asked some friends and one had the Stainless Cutting Dies and another had a power threader.  So I have all of my newest part of shop in Stainless, check out the local Salvage and Surplus...there are still ways around massive expense.  I used an excellent layout diagram from TP Tools (was TIP Sand blast), they sell great plumbing kits...I bought one and duplicated in Stainless.
 
Modular Metal Piping Kits
401matcoupe, what kit did you buy a steel or Maxair kit? I see the steel kits for $40-$350+ that is a lot of $$ for a kit.
 

From TP Tools http://www.tptools.com/RapidAir-MaxLine-3and4-Air-Piping-System,7625.html?b=d*13437

Has a nice picture of the pipe and how it is made.

This like from the other Co. this is from the same manf. And is made just for compressed air systems.

Dave ----

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SirDigger Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan/09/2014 at 1:06pm
As I stated earlier, PVC is not PVC,
and PE-HD or HD-PE as you guys name it something totally diffrent.
Just pick a System that is tested for the job, and you are good.
Rumors told me, that no manufactor/reseller in the States would be label a unsafe system suitable for pressured Air, just to avoid the laywers..

PreasureRate of a Tube is one thing, the other things to have an close Eye on, are the UV-Ray Resistance and the "Preasure Change Cycles"

A Water pipe may have the doubled needed Preasure Rate,
but it lags on UV-Ray radiation(there is no sun and Welding at 4ft depht)
and on the Preassure Change Cycles.



 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 401MATCOUPE Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan/09/2014 at 3:22pm
My shop is all plumbed in Stainless Steel Pipe....I bought the Coalescing Filter and Regulator kits from TP Tools with Steel Piping...I didn't have enough Stainless SOV for the whole shop, so I used the better valves at the high use areas.  Here is a picture of the kit I used:

http://cached.tptools.com/RS/SR/product/67/3450-06_R_17f636c6.jpg

Here is a sample of what I built at one of the termination points to get as much moisture out as possible.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FuzzFace2 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan/09/2014 at 4:24pm
Nice setup. To plumb in SS is nice if you can do it. As you found if yo udont get it 2nd hand it can be $$$.
When I get a larger garage I will plumb it but for now in my 1 car a hose from one end to the other works.
Is that A/C I see there?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 70amcpwr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan/09/2014 at 7:59pm
And after all is said and done and the factory end of our air hose leaks........we cut it off, put a barb and hose clamp on it, and turn the air back on Ouch. that's more dangerous than anything yet posted in my opinion. Or, am I the only one that has done that Wink.


 Oh, don't forget to wrap the clamp w/electrical tape, that buys you a couple weeks before it loosens up and you need to re-tighten it.


Edited by 70amcpwr - Jan/09/2014 at 8:02pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote brownspirit Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan/10/2014 at 7:46am
Either way, personally I think PVC pipe is a terrible product for anything but DWV applications. I would use pex tubing if I was gonna cheap out, with a few extra hangers/clamps. If and when it failed it is not as dangerous. I would also regulate it down to 90 psi right off the compressor. I don't care how many success stories there are, it's a risk/return thing. I will pay a few extra dollars to eliminate or reduce a hazard in my shop. Andy
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jeremy0711 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan/15/2014 at 3:39pm
I am not promoting this to be used but will state my experience using it. This is one of those things that is regulated due to lawsuits and improper installations.

I had cpvc in my old garage for nearly 10 years without one issue with it. It is a sealed system that doesn't leak and I left it on 24/7 at 160 psi all the time. It was regulated down to whatever at the hose reels. I also had na insulated garage that was drywalled that all the of piping was in. Billd got all excited before about this stuff too with me. It worked for me then. The main hazards that you see with this tubing is when you route it in the extreme temps and route into areas that it can get damaged. You also see pvc and not cpvc tubing blow also in all the HORROR stories. They were usually above the drop ceilings and so forth exposed to the extreme temps. CPVC is a more durable and less shattering type of piping. PVC is a brittle and shattering type of piping. I had been working in an extremely noisy environment where a steel pipe blew. It sounded like a bomb going off. I couldn't imagine what the noise would have done to your ears at a place 50 times smaller. It can throw shrapnel out also depended on where and how it broke under high amounts of pressure. That piece of steel pipe was 15 feet up in the air and nothing was touching it. Steel pipes do tend to leak at threaded areas and corrode really bad inside the pipes as they sweat constantly. This can make a mess with what you are working on plus damage the tools you use. I don't have any regrets using cpvc pipes in my old garage. What I do with my new one is up in the air at the moment.

When I sold the old house, I torn down all of that plumbing and threw it out. That pipe does not break hardly and will fold numerous times before it breaks in two. PVC is not the same it will pop and shatter. This I did test out in the old house about a year ago.    

I have cpvc pipe in the basement at the moment. I might have to cap one end off and run 160 psi through it. While I'm behind a 3/4 piece of plywood, I just might have to test this theory of expoding PCV/CPVC pipes vs. sledge hammer.       

Edited by jeremy0711 - Jan/15/2014 at 6:28pm
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