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New 1968/69 Javelin/AMX/Rambler suspension upgrade

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Topic: New 1968/69 Javelin/AMX/Rambler suspension upgrade
Posted By: 343sharpstick
Subject: New 1968/69 Javelin/AMX/Rambler suspension upgrade
Date Posted: Jul/15/2017 at 2:50pm
I’ve developed a new suspension upgrade for the pre-1970 Javelins, AMX and Ramblers

- Install larger tires
- NO MORE TRUNNION!
- Uses standard Coil-over
- Improved suspension geometry.
- Retain current Braking system
- Uses Stock Lower control arm and strut rod

The Price of the kit is $800 and you buy the Coilover of your choice (I’m using the single adjustable QA1 with great results), and the QA1 Ball joint (QA1-1210-201S).
Kit uses the 1970 or later steering knuckle, I have some available to purchase as well, or you can supply your own.

Web-site is on the way, but I’m posting this here first.

The pictures below of the kit installed is the development kit I have on my car. Additional pictures are the actual finished parts.

I’ll be at the AMC Homecoming in Kenosha in a few weeks, and I’ll have a kit there to check out, and my Javelin will be there too. Stop by with any questions

Mike Summers/Dairyland Fabrication LLC








Replies:
Posted By: 343sharpstick
Date Posted: Jul/15/2017 at 2:52pm
 


Posted By: 6768rogues
Date Posted: Jul/15/2017 at 5:22pm
What do you think the bottom line price for everything needed to do the job would be?

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Content intended for mature audiences. If you experience nausea or diarrhea, stop reading and seek medical attention.

Located usually near Rochester, NY and sometimes central FL.


Posted By: 343sharpstick
Date Posted: Jul/15/2017 at 6:17pm
Good question.
I have a QA1 shock package with the single adjustable shock.
This includes two of all the following parts from Summit Racing:
- QA1-DS501     Shock
- 7888-109     thrust bearing kit
- 12HT400     12 in. 400lb Spring
- QA1-1210-201S     Ball Joint
Total for all these parts is $593.58 + Shipping.

That brings the total for all parts needed for the upgrade to $1,393.58




Posted By: 6768rogues
Date Posted: Jul/15/2017 at 6:43pm
Plus 70 or later steering knuckles. Thanks for your response.

-------------
Content intended for mature audiences. If you experience nausea or diarrhea, stop reading and seek medical attention.

Located usually near Rochester, NY and sometimes central FL.


Posted By: 343sharpstick
Date Posted: Jul/17/2017 at 9:44am
Yes, I have several sets of the required steering knuckles available at $50 a set.


Posted By: shelbycoleman
Date Posted: Jul/17/2017 at 10:21am
Wow, this is great. Finally a affordable option to upgrading the first gen cars. Will you have these at Home coming this year? Shelby


Posted By: 343sharpstick
Date Posted: Jul/17/2017 at 11:00am
Yes, I'll be there Friday and Saturday.
I can answer any questions at that time, and I'll have a kit available to check out.
I have more kits started, but I'm looking to determine how much interest there is in such a kit.

I've had this on my car for a several months now and I love it. The results are even better than I'd expected, It's hard to describe how much better the car is to drive, but the cornering and ride quality are both improved.

When looking at cost, getting a performance oriented springs for a stock suspension from a place like EATON Detroit Spring will run $350-$650 per pair. I did that a few years back, and I felt there was much more potential with the car, Even with a larger diameter sway bar the cornering capability was not significantly improved.
I went about designing something better that would give more Caster, better camber curve, and better overall geometry while still having a reasonable cost.
Cheers
Mike


Posted By: CamJam
Date Posted: Jul/17/2017 at 12:46pm
Very impressive, Mike! 

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'73 Javelin 360 (current project)
'72 Baja Bronze Javelin SST
'69 Big Bad Orange AMX (2018 Teague Heritage Award) SOLD



Posted By: scott
Date Posted: Jul/17/2017 at 4:06pm
Any pics of how the coilover mounts to the lower control arm??

Any changes needed to the lower ball joint??

How are the welds on the upper arms done & tested??


Posted By: 343sharpstick
Date Posted: Jul/17/2017 at 6:44pm
Below Is the lower mount, it ties together with the control arm, strut rod and ball-joint attachment point.




You use your stock lower ball joint.

The A-arm is fully TIG-welded .095 wall DOM tubing and uses FK Rod ends (FKB-RSMX8T). It mimics the design and construction of several other arms available for other cars. Primarily the magnum force A-Body MFR161041-A arm.
I've had the arms on my car for several thousand miles, and have disassembled and inspected the assembly many times.


Posted By: 6t8amxetc
Date Posted: Jul/18/2017 at 10:46am
This looks very nice! I am interested in this for my 64' American. Have you test fit these items on an American? I cant remember if everything is exactly the same or not? When do you think you will be ready for shipping this stuff? Will you be making these in batches depending on how fast they sell? Or just pre-sell and make in batches etc?
Thanks...Ty


Posted By: 343sharpstick
Date Posted: Jul/18/2017 at 11:18am
Thank you, I'll be making them in batches, only unknown is how big the batches need to be.

I think it will fit a bunch of Pre-'67 cars, perhaps even big body cars too? I don't honestly know much about AMC/Rambler cars earlier than '67. Knowing how AMC resisted changing any platform designs, I suspect this would fit on several ramblers in addition to the AMX/Javelins/Remblers, but I can't say for certain.


Posted By: 6t8amxetc
Date Posted: Jul/18/2017 at 2:53pm
Do you have any finished product ready to ship? Are the finished ones powder coated? I have fabbed some brackets to use the 13" 2012 Mustang front brakes on my car. I can't imagine any reason they wouldn't still be able to be used when installing this set up? It just bolts on with the stock factory spindle etc.
Thanks...


Posted By: 343sharpstick
Date Posted: Jul/19/2017 at 4:26pm
I 'had' finished product that I've recently shipped. I kept one remaining set on-hand to show in Kenosha.

The arms are painted, not powder coated. Powder coating would add cost. It may be an option in the future, but I have my hands full for now.

The 4-bolt holes that attach the steering knuckle to the spindle are dimensionally the same, so your brackets should be fine.
I'll be starting the next batch in August.


Posted By: 6t8amxetc
Date Posted: Jul/19/2017 at 10:38pm
Ok, I am interested in a set. You can leave them un-coated and I will have them powder coated.
As long as we can verify that they will fit on my 64' American first. Put me on the list.
Thanks...Ty


Posted By: 343sharpstick
Date Posted: Jul/22/2017 at 9:50am
I had a question on the upper bracket. Here is a picture of the brackets installed in my car. The Brackets I have are pre-production parts, and a bit ugly. The actual brackets are laser cut, painted, and look much better than what I have.
The kit can also be welded in, but it's imperative it's tight to the chassis.
Inside the car 6 button head bolts are visible.

The design places spring load onto the same chassis structure as the stock spring.



Posted By: Jan Phersson
Date Posted: Jul/22/2017 at 1:12pm
Great stuff. Do you have an email address were we can discuss this?


Posted By: 343sharpstick
Date Posted: Jul/23/2017 at 4:02pm
Thanks, send any questions to mailto:dairylandfab@tds.net%20" rel="nofollow - dairylandfab@tds.net .
Mike


Posted By: Midnight Rambler
Date Posted: Jul/24/2017 at 7:39am
Very interested in these. I crushed another original bushing, it's time to replace them all...maybe with a better handling upgrade.

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'66 American 440 Convertible 290/M-40/AMC 20 3.15/PS/PB
'04 Jeep Wrangler X Rocky Mountain Edition 4.0 5sp


Posted By: 304-dude
Date Posted: Jul/24/2017 at 8:04am
Originally posted by Midnight Rambler Midnight Rambler wrote:

Very interested in these. I crushed another original bushing, it's time to replace them all...maybe with a better handling upgrade.



Even though a trunnion setup functions well when properly maintained, there is added benefit with better more modern caster with radials. As for your needs having adjustability beyond what the Rambler trunnion design is capable, without modifications, may not be fully utilised. Though practical for its cost.

It's a nice option for those finding trunnion a bit limiting for their particular needs.



-------------
71 Javelin SST body
390 69 crank, 70 block & heads
NASCAR SB2 rods & pistons
78 Jeep TH400 w/ 2.76 Low
50/50 Ford-AMC Suspension
79 F150 rear & 8.8 axles
Ford Racing 3.25 gears & 9" /w Detroit locker


Posted By: pat 69 javelin
Date Posted: Aug/20/2017 at 3:34pm
so it looks like you have to drill 8 holes in the shock tower ? Do you have any photos of what the button head bolts look like from the inside of engine compartment ? Very interested the parts you listed for summit all look quality made springs are even powder coated !!! you can reach me at pat@wholesaleautoinc.com


Posted By: 343sharpstick
Date Posted: Aug/21/2017 at 8:52am
I will email you as well.
yes, you need to drill 8 holes, but only 6 are visible. Shown are the visible fasteners inside the engine compartment.
This is my car, and I'll at a minimum paint them body color this winter.
The bracket could also be welded in, and in that case, there would be no visible evidence of the upgraded suspension.

If(Or realistically when) I pull the engine I'll weld the top bracket in and repaint the engine bay.



Posted By: 6t8amxetc
Date Posted: Aug/21/2017 at 10:15am
Have you gotten started on this next batch? Also which steering box are you running?
Thanks...


Posted By: 343sharpstick
Date Posted: Aug/21/2017 at 10:45am
Yes, next batch is moving along. I have a batch of 6 kits currently in process.
Top brackets, and bottom brackets are all completed, and I have all the bent DOM tubing and hardware for the upper control arms, and I'll get those finished up in the next few weeks.
I'll be sending an email as kits become available.
Stay tuned.

I'm using the stock '69 SST steering box. I'm actually looking at upgrading to a quicker ratio box, so if anyone has a recommendation on which one to get please let me know.

Thanks
Mike


Posted By: 6t8amxetc
Date Posted: Aug/21/2017 at 11:15am
Sounds great!


Posted By: pat 69 javelin
Date Posted: Aug/22/2017 at 9:12pm
just ordered a set of dougs d104 headers for my 69 javelin. was wondering if any one had photos of engine mount modifacations they had to make. right now my engine and tranny 727 are out of the car and will probably do the suspension work first just wondering what im in for.
thanks Pat


Posted By: akimmet
Date Posted: Aug/23/2017 at 10:32am
I am definitely interested in this suspension kit for my 1968 AMX. It looks almost exactly like what i was looking for.
Is there any chance in making a lower control arm as well?

PM sent.


Posted By: akimmet
Date Posted: Aug/23/2017 at 10:36am
Originally posted by pat 69 javelin pat 69 javelin wrote:

just ordered a set of dougs d104 headers for my 69 javelin. was wondering if any one had photos of engine mount modifacations they had to make. right now my engine and tranny 727 are out of the car and will probably do the suspension work first just wondering what im in for.
thanks Pat


http://theamcforum.com/forum/dougs-headers-pictures_topic40234_page3.html" rel="nofollow - http://theamcforum.com/forum/dougs-headers-pictures_topic40234_page3.html

Here is a link to some good pictures showing what needs to be done for d103 headers. The D104 headers might be similar. You can always mock your headers and engine mounts up on the engine stand to check engine mount clearance.




Posted By: 343sharpstick
Date Posted: Aug/23/2017 at 2:40pm
Originally posted by akimmet akimmet wrote:

I am definitely interested in this suspension kit for my 1968 AMX. It looks almost exactly like what i was looking for.
Is there any chance in making a lower control arm as well?

PM sent.


I got your PM, thank you!
Yes, I'm definitely looking into a lower control arm option as a "Stage2" offering. I have several ideas, but I need to first catch up  orders for this kit before I can allow myself to be distracted with the next thing.




Posted By: pat 69 javelin
Date Posted: Aug/23/2017 at 8:03pm
thanks akimmet for the link on headers I was able to stop my order for now. it looks like maybe I should get the d103 instead of the d104 my moter is going to be a 420 stroker but even with the smaller 103 mods are necessary and 104s hang lower I guess
thanks Pat


Posted By: Aljav
Date Posted: Aug/23/2017 at 8:56pm
Did you measure how much more of a tire can fit now? 

Gotta save a few bucks but I can see that this in my future.

Allan


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69 AMX 9.86 132 mph 71 JAV/AMX and 69 Javelin, .. NAMDRA member #1106


Posted By: Brootal
Date Posted: Sep/13/2017 at 8:25pm
This is brilliant. Thanks for taking the time and making the effort.


Posted By: amxautox
Date Posted: Sep/15/2017 at 7:55pm
Originally posted by 343sharpstick 343sharpstick wrote:

Yes, next batch is moving along. I have a batch of 6 kits currently in process.
Top brackets, and bottom brackets are all completed, and I have all the bent DOM tubing and hardware for the upper control arms, and I'll get those finished up in the next few weeks.
I'll be sending an email as kits become available.
Stay tuned.

I'm using the stock '69 SST steering box. I'm actually looking at upgrading to a quicker ratio box, so if anyone has a recommendation on which one to get please let me know.

Thanks
Mike


I'm using a pump and box from the Jeep place in Texas, it would take me hours to find the name of the place. It's a later tear dop shaped pump. High pressure, and 12:1 ratio, works great on the autocross course, but a bit quick on the street, but ok. Yes I've had an emergency manuvour thanks to a dumb chevy suv driver halfway into my lane on a mountain curve.

Does your setup lower the car at all? I've already lowered my '69 AMX 1" front and rear, and don't want to change that.


Posted By: 343sharpstick
Date Posted: Sep/18/2017 at 11:17am
Originally posted by Aljav Aljav wrote:

Did you measure how much more of a tire can fit now? 

Gotta save a few bucks but I can see that this in my future.

Allan


You can fit a 4.5-inch backspace wheel with this. And there are no longer limitations with tire clearance on that wheel.

With the stock suspension the limit was a 4 inch backspace wheel and you were limited to the tire size too. If the tire was too large it would rub on the trunnion and/or spring. I was able to go from a 215/45-17 to a 245/45-17 on a 17x8-inch wheel.

On the outside I don't have my wheel lip modified, but even with that I could do a 9-inch wide wheel, as long as it has 4.5 inches of backspace and move to a 255/40-17.
You may be able to do a 275/40-17 with a custom 9.5-inch wide wheel. But you would definitely need to do some work to the outer wheel lip.


Posted By: 343sharpstick
Date Posted: Sep/18/2017 at 11:27am
Originally posted by amxautox amxautox wrote:


Originally posted by 343sharpstick 343sharpstick wrote:


Yes, next batch is moving along. I have a batch of 6 kits currently in process.
Top brackets, and bottom brackets are all completed, and I have all the bent DOM tubing and hardware for the upper control arms, and I'll get those finished up in the next few weeks.
I'll be sending an email as kits become available.
Stay tuned.

I'm using the stock '69 SST steering box. I'm actually looking at upgrading to a quicker ratio box, so if anyone has a recommendation on which one to get please let me know.

Thanks
Mike


I'm using a pump and box from the Jeep place in Texas, it would take me hours to find the name of the place. It's a later tear dop shaped pump. High pressure, and 12:1 ratio, works great on the autocross course, but a bit quick on the street, but ok. Yes I've had an emergency manuvour thanks to a dumb chevy suv driver halfway into my lane on a mountain curve.

Does your setup lower the car at all? I've already lowered my '69 AMX 1" front and rear, and don't want to change that.


Thanks for the info on the steering box ratio your using.
The ride height is adjustable with spring preload. Ideally you set up the car so the lower control arm pivot points are horizontal, however depending on where you drive or how low your headers hang down, etc... that may not be practical.


Posted By: amxautox
Date Posted: Sep/18/2017 at 4:10pm
Originally posted by 343sharpstick 343sharpstick wrote:

Originally posted by amxautox amxautox wrote:


Originally posted by 343sharpstick 343sharpstick wrote:


Yes, next batch is moving along. I have a batch of 6 kits currently in process.
Top brackets, and bottom brackets are all completed, and I have all the bent DOM tubing and hardware for the upper control arms, and I'll get those finished up in the next few weeks.
I'll be sending an email as kits become available.
Stay tuned.

I'm using the stock '69 SST steering box. I'm actually looking at upgrading to a quicker ratio box, so if anyone has a recommendation on which one to get please let me know.

Thanks
Mike


I'm using a pump and box from the Jeep place in Texas, it would take me hours to find the name of the place. It's a later tear dop shaped pump. High pressure, and 12:1 ratio, works great on the autocross course, but a bit quick on the street, but ok. Yes I've had an emergency manuvour thanks to a dumb chevy suv driver halfway into my lane on a mountain curve.

Does your setup lower the car at all? I've already lowered my '69 AMX 1" front and rear, and don't want to change that.


Thanks for the info on the steering box ratio your using.
The ride height is adjustable with spring preload. Ideally you set up the car so the lower control arm pivot points are horizontal, however depending on where you drive or how low your headers hang down, etc... that may not be practical.
Actually I'm not using headers, I'm using the high flow manifolds. My engine is set up for autocross, so it doesn't need the capacity of headers. And thanks for the info.


Posted By: 343sharpstick
Date Posted: Sep/19/2017 at 8:35am
I get to do some more "testing" this weekend
It's the last Autocross of the year.
Another customer will be there too, so we will have 2 AMC's represented!


Posted By: XRX744
Date Posted: Sep/19/2017 at 9:15am
Good luck and be sure to take pics this weekend! 

I'll let you know about the 275 fitment once I get the kit installed on the AMX!


-------------
69 AMX, pro touring /track car, TEAM tribute, aka: "The Kenosha Corncob"


Posted By: Aljav
Date Posted: Sep/19/2017 at 11:23am
Where do you "test". What group are you associated with?

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69 AMX 9.86 132 mph 71 JAV/AMX and 69 Javelin, .. NAMDRA member #1106


Posted By: 343sharpstick
Date Posted: Sep/19/2017 at 2:40pm
We'll be at the Motorplex inside the Road America facility.
This is put on by the Fox Valley Sports Car Club (FVSCC).
The event on Sunday is a joint event with the Madison Sports Car Club (MSCC).
They use the same rules and classes as SCCA, but the organization is a bit more chill than the SCCA.

It's $45 for the day, might be the most fun you can have for that much expense. Spectators are free admission, you should come join us

Here is a wide-shot showing the track a bit, lots of elevation, more of a small road course than a typical parking-lot Autocross. It puts the suspension through a good test. Funnest R&D ever!



Posted By: Aljav
Date Posted: Sep/19/2017 at 9:49pm
What times will you be testing on Sunday. Thinking of coming up. Drag strip on Saturday, Elkhart Lake on Sunday... sounds good to me..LOL.

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69 AMX 9.86 132 mph 71 JAV/AMX and 69 Javelin, .. NAMDRA member #1106


Posted By: 343sharpstick
Date Posted: Sep/20/2017 at 7:40am
That would be cool! First cars on track at 10:00, and things wrap up around 3:00. Enter Gate 4.
http://www.roadamerica.com/media/wysiwyg/maps/TrackMap_wScreens_2017.pdf" rel="nofollow - http://www.roadamerica.com/media/wysiwyg/maps/TrackMap_wScreens_2017.pdf

They split the cars into 2 groups, and each group gets to run 2 of the 4 sessions. It's a well oiled machine most of the time.
Each driver gets 3/4 runs per session.


Posted By: 6t8amxetc
Date Posted: Sep/20/2017 at 10:32am
Sounds like a rough job testing these components out! LOL
Any idea on the ETA for this next batch?


Posted By: 343sharpstick
Date Posted: Sep/20/2017 at 11:32am
Just a couple weeks, I have a batch of top and bottom brackets done, and I have all the material to fabricate the upper control arms ready to fab up.
Truth is I should probably spend Sunday fabricating those upper arms so I can get some more kits out the door.


Posted By: Aljav
Date Posted: Sep/22/2017 at 9:16pm
Me and the wife will be there for sure. Great Lakes Dragaway on Saturday and Elkhart Lake sunday. Got on a room in Sheboygan!!! Looking forward to meeting you, looking at the car and seeing you race the car!!!

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69 AMX 9.86 132 mph 71 JAV/AMX and 69 Javelin, .. NAMDRA member #1106


Posted By: 343sharpstick
Date Posted: Sep/23/2017 at 6:21pm
That's great, see you in the AM,


Posted By: Aljav
Date Posted: Sep/24/2017 at 9:05pm
On Sunday the  wife and I made the stop at Road America and found our way to the Motorplex area. I stopped and met Mike and lookedat  his car. I really liked his car because it's just like I wanna do and its nothing that any average AMCer couldn't do. Its a street car that he wants to have some more fun with. 

While I am not a road racer ( more of a drag racer)I have some general knowledge of what a car should look like when trying to drive thru a course like he was. I have to say hands down it was very impressive. While there were many types of vehicles driving thru the course I have to suspect many had some type of modification to the suspension. Quite of few of the cars have that drop on one side and raise on the other side in the front end while trying navigate a corner. I can say I was impressed that Mikes Javelin looked great on the track as his stayed flat lot more than many of the cars there. If I can see how much better his Javelin looked compared too many of the cars that says a lot. And Remember many of these I would suspect have sort of modification to the suspension or are much more modern cars. 

I was impressed how the car almost looked glued to the track. 

Then Mike took me for a "ride " thru the pits. Next to nothing for ride noise. It felt great. Very impressive. I will be buying the parts from Mike soon. 

Great that someone has taken the time to make a affordable upgrade to the Trunnion suspension. 



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69 AMX 9.86 132 mph 71 JAV/AMX and 69 Javelin, .. NAMDRA member #1106


Posted By: Aljav
Date Posted: Sep/24/2017 at 9:08pm


-------------
69 AMX 9.86 132 mph 71 JAV/AMX and 69 Javelin, .. NAMDRA member #1106


Posted By: 6t8amxetc
Date Posted: Sep/24/2017 at 9:49pm
That is nice to see and hear! I am very excited to get my setup from him also!


Posted By: 343sharpstick
Date Posted: Sep/25/2017 at 8:30am
It was great meeting Al and his wife. I'd love to see your Drag car in action one of these days too!
One of my customers was there with his Rambler too. There were 10 Cars in CAM-T, Dairyland Fabrication equipped cars took 3rd and 5th!


Even more impressive is that when I combine the times with CAM-C (newer American rear-drive cars) we are still in the top half of the standings!


For those waiting on the next batch, I appreciate your patience while I'm out "testing".
On a serious note, It's important to me that I'm making a product that performs. Better cornering/ride quality on the street, and the look of the lower ride height is great. But having the opportunity with these events to really hammer on the components is important to me.
Now... I really need to buckle down and get a pile of these out the door!


Posted By: amxautox
Date Posted: Sep/25/2017 at 10:27am
Good going. Clap

Do you have a picture of the upper mount without the spring in place? The a-arm can be there, but I need to see past the spring. Maybe a close up.


Posted By: Red20
Date Posted: Sep/27/2017 at 10:06am
I'm drooling on myself here...

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1969 Javelin SST "Screamin' Banana" - Totaled Feb 2018
1973 Hornet Sportabout X "yellajack" - 360/727/TracLoc DAILY DRIVER


Posted By: XRX744
Date Posted: Sep/27/2017 at 11:36am
Impressive results, congrats! 

-------------
69 AMX, pro touring /track car, TEAM tribute, aka: "The Kenosha Corncob"


Posted By: Red20
Date Posted: Sep/27/2017 at 5:54pm
Question:
I have a 1969 Javelin with Scarebird front disc brake kit. Other than 70 and up knuckles, what would I need spindle-wise? Brakes?

-------------
1969 Javelin SST "Screamin' Banana" - Totaled Feb 2018
1973 Hornet Sportabout X "yellajack" - 360/727/TracLoc DAILY DRIVER


Posted By: 232jav3sp
Date Posted: Sep/27/2017 at 8:13pm
If the the '69 Rambler does not sell before I move to Texas, I would love to do this!


Posted By: 343sharpstick
Date Posted: Sep/28/2017 at 8:16am
Originally posted by Red20 Red20 wrote:

Question:
I have a 1969 Javelin with Scarebird front disc brake kit. Other than 70 and up knuckles, what would I need spindle-wise? Brakes?

Thanks for the kudos, I've been walkin' around with a smile all week.

I have several of the needed knuckles available.

All the AMC spindles have the same 4-bolt pattern where it mounts to the knuckle. So the trunnion knuckle and the two variants of 70 and up steering knuckles also have the same bolt pattern. You can use any spindle on any steering knuckle. So no need to make any changes to your brake setup.



Posted By: Rogue401
Date Posted: Oct/31/2017 at 10:37pm
Thanks for developing this kit. I've been experimenting with modifying the trunion front end for a while too. Overall I think it works great for spirited street use and mine rides great and sits nice. It's stock 67 Rogue except for shorter custom springs from Coil Spring Specialties. I tried three sets before I was happy. The biggest issue is lack of caster and steering centering/feel. Plus the inherent bind in the lower control arm/strut rod pivot points.

What do you do to increase caster? Have you moved the upper ball joint to the rear with the new upper control arms?
How much wheel travel is there and what is the spring rate?

How does it do on the street with pot holes and the heim joints instead of the rubber bushings?

I'm very interested.

Thanks!




Posted By: 343sharpstick
Date Posted: Nov/03/2017 at 6:23pm
I agree with your assessment of the stock setup.
I do increase caster by moving the top of the steering knuckle back slightly. However, it has enough adjustment at the upper control arm available to set up the suspension just about any way you would like. I have 7 degrees of Caster now with my car, I started with 4 and moved around just to find what I liked.

I'm using a 12-Inch 400 lb Spring. I worked with QA1 to determine the appropriate spring rate for street/AutoX combination. It's been working out very well.

I don't have the wheel travel dimensions here now, but I designed it with as much wheel travel as possible without the wheel contacting the inner trough inside the fender under full compression. The ride quality is actually better than it was stock, as there is no more bind and 'stiction' in the suspension, and it reacts quicker to the road. You can turn the adjustable shocks to full-soft and it's very smooth, but I prefer a bit more damping, and I just leave it at the AutoX adjustments.
Adjusting front shock damping is a very nice option to have too :)


Posted By: Rogue401
Date Posted: Nov/03/2017 at 8:03pm
Thanks for your comments. The more I look at it the more I like it.

By-the-way, I love your car. The dark green, vinyl top, stance and wheels are perfect!


Posted By: snakeeyes
Date Posted: Nov/04/2017 at 3:44pm
Any update on when you might have some kits ready?


Posted By: 343sharpstick
Date Posted: Nov/05/2017 at 12:24pm
Several kits have gone out, Kit's are built and shipped in the order I've been contacted at dairylandfab@tds.net and I'm still catching up on that list, unfortunately it's not going nearly as quickly as I'd like.
One of my first customers was at the AutoX with me a few weeks back with the '65 American, he was enjoying it very much ;)

Working to increase my output capability currently. Each kit is hand fit and assembled in my shop, finish welding is done using local talent, however my small jobs often get pushed back on the priority list. That's understandable, but still frustrating.

Rogue401 - Thanks, I like my understated look on this car. Also, the suspension has 9-inches of travel. Obviously the lower the car is, the less up-travel that's available.


Posted By: amxess
Date Posted: Nov/07/2017 at 2:00pm
Finally got the time to install this kit. Will be taking trunnions and springs off tomorrow. Looking forward to improved handling. Great looking kit!


Posted By: Cricket
Date Posted: Nov/07/2017 at 8:24pm
This would be awesome if it fit my 1966 Rambler Classic. Has anyone been able to see if it fits the big bodies? I would very likely be in the market, if it does.
Thanks.
Cricket


Posted By: XRX744
Date Posted: Nov/08/2017 at 10:53pm
I plan on documenting my install when I get my kit and look forward to the results of it. I may weld mine in though depending on how I could tie into some front down bars. Once its paired up with the 3 link rear set up, it should handle pretty well.

-------------
69 AMX, pro touring /track car, TEAM tribute, aka: "The Kenosha Corncob"


Posted By: Red20
Date Posted: Jan/30/2018 at 3:34pm
343sharpstick, any updates on how business is going with the suspension setups? Anymore customer feedback? When I'm able to afford it, I sure hope you're still doing these. I'd love to have your setup on the front of my car one day. Then I have to decide on either a link setup for the rear or stick to straight line with Caltracs split mono leafs and bars. Of course a daily driver that is fun at the autocross and will also run low 12s down the 1/4 mile would be super duper.

-------------
1969 Javelin SST "Screamin' Banana" - Totaled Feb 2018
1973 Hornet Sportabout X "yellajack" - 360/727/TracLoc DAILY DRIVER


Posted By: akimmet
Date Posted: Feb/01/2018 at 1:04pm
I received my kit early this month, but I was on the waiting list for approximately 5 months.

I believe the kits are still being made, just be prepared to wait before a kit is ready to buy.


Posted By: 343sharpstick
Date Posted: Feb/01/2018 at 5:18pm
I'm still behind, but getting kits out.
I'm currently in the process of building a better fixture to punch out upper control arms quicker. When that's done It will speed things up.

I've had to travel for work a fair amount as well, which doesn't help, interesting I'm typing this while at a hotel in Shanghai.


Posted By: 232jav3sp
Date Posted: Feb/12/2018 at 8:10pm
I hope to be buying one of these within the next year.


Posted By: Gigantor64
Date Posted: Jul/09/2018 at 7:41pm
Hello,I'm Pete I own a 64 Rambler American 220 wagon. I'm very interested in getting rid of my trunnions too!. I have spent the last year looking for a affordable front suspension That I can replace 
the factory trunnions with. I came across your AMCform post last night by accident while, I was once again looking for a replacement front suspension. Or maybe it was fate I found you. At any rate, will this front suspension your selling fit in my wagon (please please please) Its rough out there finding parts for a 54 y/o wagon. I did notice in the picture you provided of the drivers side of your green javelin, the shock tower is the same as my Rambler.  Is there some way I can contact you I would greatly appreciate hearing back from you.
Thank you for your time, Pete


Posted By: 343sharpstick
Date Posted: Jul/10/2018 at 9:35am
Pete, welcome to the world of AMC. My suspension will work on a 64 rambler, however from 1964 to mid-1966 a smaller diamiter lower ball joint was used. You will need to install a 1970 or later lower ball joint. This will require some drilling of that lower ball joint mounting plate.
I have 3 customers that have installed this on the early cars. I am still working through my wait-list as I unforutanetly havent gotten these out the door as quick as I would like. My new "JD-squared Beast" tube notcher was just delivered this week. This is a game-changer on getting these kits done quicker!
Contact me at Dairylandfab@tds.net to get on the list for kits, or get additional detail. No deposit is needed so if the time comes when your kit is ready and you decide you no longer need it, no problem.

For all interested customers I just recieved my last batch of NOS steering knuckles. For those on the wait-list, I have knuckles for you should you need them.
When the NOS knuckles are sold I'll try and get them used and clean them up to re-sell, or customrs can get them from salvage yards.
That said, if anyone has used 1970 or later steering kunckles lets make a deal.


Posted By: RTTComanche17
Date Posted: Jul/10/2018 at 12:53pm
Just came across this thread, these look awesome! Actually this is the exact same thing I was thinking about trying to figure out myself for my '67 American one day, and I assume the amount of work and "testing" you have in your kit would take me many more years before I arrived comparable solution.

Just out of curiosity does anyone have a ballpark cost of what it would be to rebuild a trunnion suspension? I will need to either rebuild mine or go aftermarket, the closer the costs, the easier the decision gets. I'm pretty sure the main driving cost of the trunnion rebuild will be whether the trunnions are in good condition, but still curious.

If I went with this kit, I'd need everything, so ~$1500 for kit, shocks, springs, ball joints, spindles, bushings, shipping etc. Where would the ballpark on a trunnion that needed all of the above fall? $250? $500? $1000? more?

The closer to $1500, the easier suspension decision becomes bearing in mind that I'm hoping to keep my restoration budget minded. I want to do it right and have no doubts this upgrade would be really nice, but if I can rebuild my trunnions for $250-$500, the other $1000+ may be better spent elsewhere.

Decisions, decisions, decisions.....


-------------
1967 Rambler American #1 - junkyard rescue parts car
1967 Rambler American #2 - project car, but it runs!...for now...


Posted By: 343sharpstick
Date Posted: Jul/10/2018 at 1:48pm
Your assessment of cost is valid, the most expensive part about setting up a rebuilt trunnion comes in if you desire a lower ride-height. I'm no longer sure what the cost is for custom coil springs, but when I purchased my springs it was around $400. I could be wrong, that was probably 10 years ago.

The issues that I struggled with, which brought about the kit were many, including; limited tire size, limited caster capability, adjustments in shock damping, adjustable ride height, and that's before I measured the suspension geometry which was not so good.

I pulled apart my stock front suspension to fix a squeaky, tight poly bushing in the front suspension and a worn out bearing, and couldn't get myself to put the stock stuff back on it.


Posted By: 6t8amxetc
Date Posted: Jul/10/2018 at 5:29pm
Originally posted by 343sharpstick 343sharpstick wrote:

Your assessment of cost is valid, the most expensive part about setting up a rebuilt trunnion comes in if you desire a lower ride-height. I'm no longer sure what the cost is for custom coil springs, but when I purchased my springs it was around $400. I could be wrong, that was probably 10 years ago.

The issues that I struggled with, which brought about the kit were many, including; limited tire size, limited caster capability, adjustments in shock damping, adjustable ride height, and that's before I measured the suspension geometry which was not so good.

I pulled apart my stock front suspension to fix a squeaky, tight poly bushing in the front suspension and a worn out bearing, and couldn't get myself to put the stock stuff back on it.


With all the commotion on this thread I thought you were on here to announce that you had the lower control arm all R&D'ed! Wacko


Posted By: 343sharpstick
Date Posted: Aug/03/2018 at 10:32am
Originally posted by 6t8amxetc 6t8amxetc wrote:



With all the commotion on this thread I thought you were on here to announce that you had the lower control arm all R&D'ed! Wacko


Well I'll be ordering some material to finally begin on the lower control arm/strut rod designs (Stage 2), FINALLY.

If anyone has a lower control arm and strut rod assembly for a 1970 or later AMX/Javelin/Gremlin/Spirit laying around I would like to work out a way to get it. please shoot me an email at dairylandfab@tds.net.
I want the new lower control arm design to fit both the pre-1970 cars, and later cars as well.

Also be aware I've had to raise the price a bit to $925 for the upper control arm Stage 1 kit.


Posted By: SANCAPJJ
Date Posted: Aug/03/2018 at 12:44pm
Are you looking for lower control arms/strut rods/strut rod brackets? Both sides? - JJ


Posted By: 343sharpstick
Date Posted: Aug/03/2018 at 2:03pm
I just need the lower Control arm and strut rod, those are both different from the early (Pre-70) parts. Just one side would do. I have piles of pre-70 parts, but no later stuff.
No rush either, First I'll need to get the fixture built around what I have.


Posted By: american hellbilly
Date Posted: Sep/01/2018 at 9:34am
Is there a website? This is exactly what I have been looking for.


Posted By: Aljav
Date Posted: Sep/02/2018 at 10:07pm
No website. Mike is a stand up Guy, makes a great product. I meet him at Road America saw his car in action and even got quick ride in it. I have my set on order. It may take some time to get them, but we don't own a late model Mustang. Small market, but we own AMCs not just another brand X. 

My 2 cents for the day.


-------------
69 AMX 9.86 132 mph 71 JAV/AMX and 69 Javelin, .. NAMDRA member #1106


Posted By: 343sharpstick
Date Posted: Sep/04/2018 at 8:17am
Thanks Al, looking forward to another Road America AutoX next month again.

No Web-site yet, Please contact me at Dairylandfab@tds.net and we can cover any questions you may have.
Al, I'll have your kit ready this month ;) and I'll have a few extra kits ready to ship by next October.
Quick note that my stash of 1970 and later steering knuckles is getting low.


Posted By: AM93
Date Posted: Sep/13/2018 at 12:56pm
I'm interested in a set of these!!! I tried emailing you twice!


Posted By: 343sharpstick
Date Posted: Sep/13/2018 at 5:54pm
Just replied. If you have any questions let me know, I have my phone number in the email.
You mentioned you have a 1965 Rambler, I wanted to let you know on the forum that If you have a 1964 thru mid-year 1966 the lower ball joint is smaller, so you will need to pick up some 1970 or later lower ball joints and re-dril one of the holes. Several customers have done this with no real complications.

Check out this awesome Rambler!

https://www.pro-touring.com/threads/103598-1965-amc-rambler-american-220-2dr/page2" rel="nofollow - Awesome Rambler


Posted By: dpimm
Date Posted: Sep/24/2018 at 10:17am
Originally posted by 343sharpstick 343sharpstick wrote:

I just need the lower Control arm and strut rod, those are both different from the early (Pre-70) parts. Just one side would do. I have piles of pre-70 parts, but no later stuff.
No rush either, First I'll need to get the fixture built around what I have.

I feel confident that I have spares of both that I could loan you. I know I have a lower control arm in my garage.. I was planning to box a pair of LCAs to strengthen them on my 68 AMX, but need to check my storage unit for the strut rods.

-Dennis


Posted By: 343sharpstick
Date Posted: Sep/24/2018 at 6:16pm
Dennis, That's fantastic! Would you like me to shoot you my address in a PM so we can work out shipping? I just need some 70 or later arms to be sure the tubular lowers can work for both pre-70 cars, and 1970 and later.

Also, I caught up with the original wait list, and was hoping to get ahead a little. Now I have a wait list again. Embarrassed
Thanks everyone for your patients. Family activities have consumed most of September, but I'll be back to normal in a couple weeks. There are some great AMC's getting built out there!!

I probably should have been building parts, but I did do some more successful product testing this past weekend.LOL




Posted By: XRX744
Date Posted: Nov/26/2018 at 10:24pm
Does that mean theres going to be some lower control arms in the future????

-------------
69 AMX, pro touring /track car, TEAM tribute, aka: "The Kenosha Corncob"


Posted By: jtsllc1
Date Posted: Nov/27/2018 at 5:31am
Do you offer a complete kit now including the lower control arm and a new style strut rod? If so I am putting it on my list of up grades for the AMX.

I was also wondering is anyone producing the hood you have on your car with the blister?


-------------
JTSLLC1


Posted By: 343sharpstick
Date Posted: Nov/27/2018 at 10:31am
I have some prototype lowers that I'll be testing in the spring. The trick is getting the lowers to work with my kit, AND any 1970 or later AMC.
I've had to stop with that development of that to get some upper Stage1 kits out the door.

As a side note, I'm nearly out of NOS 1970 or later steering knuckles. So future customers may need to acquire that part separately.

I've discussed with a local CNC shop the possibility of making a custom steering knuckle, my thought was that it would have provisions to bolt the spindle in 2 positions (stock and 1-inch lower) These would not be cheap, so I'm not sure there would be much interest.
The up-side would be that they could be used on any AMC with my kit or any 1970 or later AMC, so it's a slightly larger market. That should be another thread.

Anyway, JTSLLC1 I see your in Orfordville, WI your only about 2-1/2 hours south-west of me. So When the lowers are ready I can let you know and assist with the install, and check out your engine program I've been reading about.
Thanks


Posted By: jpulse
Date Posted: Dec/28/2018 at 8:39am
Hey Mike, sent an email in regards to getting on the wait list.   Looks like a killer setup!  


Posted By: Aljav
Date Posted: Dec/28/2018 at 9:51am
I have yet to put it on my car, but I received the parts a couple of week ago from Mike. They look great and they come with VERY detailed instructions. I don't think anyone will be disappointed. Thumbs Up

Allan


-------------
69 AMX 9.86 132 mph 71 JAV/AMX and 69 Javelin, .. NAMDRA member #1106


Posted By: dpimm
Date Posted: Dec/30/2018 at 5:30pm
Originally posted by 343sharpstick 343sharpstick wrote:

Dennis, That's fantastic! Would you like me to shoot you my address in a PM so we can work out shipping? I just need some 70 or later arms to be sure the tubular lowers can work for both pre-70 cars, and 1970 and later.

Also, I caught up with the original wait list, and was hoping to get ahead a little. Now I have a wait list again. Embarrassed
Thanks everyone for your patients. Family activities have consumed most of September, but I'll be back to normal in a couple weeks. There are some great AMC's getting built out there!!

I probably should have been building parts, but I did do some more successful product testing this past weekend.LOL



Sorry Mike... I just saw this; house remodel, work and 2 AMX restorations have me pretty much swamped. I definitely have the LCA in my garage. Will look for the strut rod in my storage unit this week. Email me your mailing address, my email is DPimm@MRG-Inc.net.

-Dennis


Posted By: wcamp70
Date Posted: Jan/11/2019 at 12:07pm
If you ever offer this setup for 70 and up I would be in for one for my AMX. Thanks.


-------------
70 AMX 360 5speed
68 American 401 200r4 auto
AMO #5013


Posted By: Jan Phersson
Date Posted: Jan/14/2019 at 5:31am
The Kit for my 69 arrived today, top notch!
Didn't expect it, but it was even a installation manual included.


Posted By: 343sharpstick
Date Posted: Jan/14/2019 at 8:04am
Hey, it made it all the way to Sweden, glad to hear!
Thank you.
Michael


Posted By: Jerm1969
Date Posted: Jan/18/2019 at 9:56am
I am intrested in the suspension kit you have fabricated and would like to know more about it.


Posted By: BBO Steve
Date Posted: Jan/18/2019 at 8:23pm
Sorry I didn't see this post before I bought everything to redo mine stock.


Posted By: thefdoo
Date Posted: Apr/01/2019 at 7:10pm
Definitely looking to get one of these kits for my new project.  Hopefully there are still kits being made.


Posted By: 343sharpstick
Date Posted: Apr/02/2019 at 11:02am
I'm still plugging away on kits, I was all caught up in January, for a few days. Now I'm behind again. Embarrassed

Getting 4 kits out this week, and just working down my wait-list.
I'm doing most of the work on these so I can to keep cost down, but I do have limited time, so my apologies for those waiting.
Response has been very strong, so thanks to everyone who has ordered a kit.
Cheers!
Michael S.

Below is a car that's going over to the U.K. with my suspension on it and lots of other updates too. Nothing better than a car after some serious testing!




Posted By: thefdoo
Date Posted: Apr/02/2019 at 7:18pm
Updates....LOL



Posted By: 70 Donohue 390
Date Posted: May/22/2019 at 12:17pm
Originally posted by wcamp70 wcamp70 wrote:

If you ever offer this setup for 70 and up I would be in for one for my AMX. Thanks.


I be in for one for my 70 Donohue. Thanks



-------------
67 Rogue 290 Convert

70 BBO 390 5 Speed Javelin-under construction


Posted By: phatthawg
Date Posted: Aug/02/2019 at 12:28pm
Restoring a 68 AMX now and have an interest in a new front suspension. Didn't have time to read the whole thread. Do you have a website or can you send me information? 



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