My 65 440H first build
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URL: https://theamcforum.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=83760
Printed Date: Apr/16/2024 at 1:54pm
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Topic: My 65 440H first build
Posted By: AZ65440H
Subject: My 65 440H first build
Date Posted: Nov/07/2016 at 11:32am
   I picked her up in California several months back. 196 six with air, power steering, and power brakes. I was told the motor had been rebuilt but I cruised it to work about 5 times. I work about 20 miles from home. One day on my way home she lost almost all power with a top speed of about 20 mph. After checking the fuel lines, filter, and pump I decided to pull the valve cover to find 4 push rods had dropped. Needless to say I was pissed. Now I've pulled the drivetrain. Motor, trans, and rear axle. Replacing it with a 401, M7003Z T-5, and a explore disc brake 8.8 rear axle. I know NOTHING about the AMC cars and I'm mechanically inclined but I'm so master mechanic so I'll need help and will probably ask some what might be dumb questions to you but again I'm going to be doing some things with this car I've never done before. ------------- HOT IN AZ |
Replies:
Posted By: rocklandrambler
Date Posted: Nov/07/2016 at 11:55am
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Nice looking car. Welcome from one '65 440-H to another. Best of luck with your proposed mods. Keep them photos coming. ------------- Past AMC's 1974 Hornet X (new) 1975 Gremlin X (new) 1964 Classic 660 Cross Country 1965 American 440-H |
Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Nov/07/2016 at 12:26pm
  Thanks to Typhooneri was able to acquire a V8 crossmember and clutch pedal assembly. ------------- HOT IN AZ |
Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Nov/07/2016 at 12:29pm
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I had bought a set of Bulltear six to V8 motor mounts for another 65 440H I have with a 232 six in it and quickly learned I couldn't use them on the 196 crossmember. ------------- HOT IN AZ |
Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Nov/07/2016 at 1:55pm
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Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Nov/07/2016 at 2:25pm
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Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Nov/07/2016 at 2:26pm
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I'm mocking up the car first ------------- HOT IN AZ |
Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Nov/07/2016 at 2:36pm
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Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Nov/07/2016 at 2:41pm
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Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Nov/07/2016 at 2:44pm
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Crossmember is in. Motor and trans in. Caltracs on relocated perches in. Sub frame connectors in. ------------- HOT IN AZ |
Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Nov/07/2016 at 2:52pm
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The rear leaf is on sliders but the photos are too large to post. I'll post later. ------------- HOT IN AZ |
Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Nov/07/2016 at 2:56pm
 The rear 15x8 Rocket Igniter rims showed up today..     245/60/15 under the back tight. Shooting for this ride height in the rear.
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Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Nov/07/2016 at 2:59pm
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Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Nov/07/2016 at 3:03pm
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Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Nov/07/2016 at 3:04pm
Seems my photos are coming out too large now. I had to center the tank moving the filler neck over a few inches.  Here's the filler neck coming back through the original hole after that small adjustment. Didn't wanna use a fuel cell. ------------- HOT IN AZ |
Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Nov/07/2016 at 3:11pm
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Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Nov/07/2016 at 3:19pm
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Shortened the axle with 9" ends to eliminate the c-clips. Should have it on the ground this week. After the drive lines made I'll pull the trans to get all the clutch, hydraulic through out, n pedals all hooked up. If anyone knows what headers should go in without having to rework them and not hang to low, I'd appreciate all suggestions. ------------- HOT IN AZ |
Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Nov/10/2016 at 10:50am
    
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Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Nov/10/2016 at 11:49am
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This is my first effort at an amc modification so please let me know if you see anything that I'm doing that should be addressed before I get too far to avoid problems down the line. Ride height is a little higher then I desired on the rear but I'll leave it until I see where the front will sit once I get to it. ------------- HOT IN AZ |
Posted By: mitchs66
Date Posted: Nov/11/2016 at 11:51am
| Looks really nice. I'm doing mine about the same. Nice work, I'll keep watching. |
Posted By: SeanHatfield
Date Posted: Nov/11/2016 at 12:04pm
| Wow. This is coming out really nicely! What kind of wheels are those? They look really neat. |
Posted By: 232jav3sp
Date Posted: Nov/11/2016 at 6:41pm
| Hooked on this thread! |
Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Nov/12/2016 at 1:06pm
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Thanks guys. The wheels are Rocket Igniter's ------------- HOT IN AZ |
Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Nov/12/2016 at 1:18pm
Had to make a little spacer for the parking brake dust plates ------------- HOT IN AZ |
Posted By: Ollie
Date Posted: Nov/12/2016 at 5:29pm
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Like it. Good work. You are having AMC Fun. Happy AMC'ing, Ollie |
Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Nov/13/2016 at 3:45pm
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The most mind twisting fun I've have in a while. ------------- HOT IN AZ |
Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Nov/16/2016 at 5:55pm
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Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Nov/16/2016 at 6:01pm
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Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Nov/16/2016 at 6:13pm
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Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Nov/16/2016 at 6:35pm
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So she sits and wait for parts to plumb the rear brakes, hook up parking brakes, driveline material, and the scarebird front disc kit. ------------- HOT IN AZ |
Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Dec/05/2016 at 6:55pm
Scarebird front disc brake kit arrived today. I'll try n get this done by the weekend. ------------- HOT IN AZ |
Posted By: mitchs66
Date Posted: Dec/05/2016 at 8:46pm
| Your kit looks a little different than mine was, but it went on and worked great. I think you'll like it. |
Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Dec/07/2016 at 8:12am
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This one uses the 98-02 Ranger 4WD rotors, 88-91 GMC 1500 reg cab calipers, and Eldorado brake lines. I saw where someone used some banjo fittings on their calipers allowing them to use their original hoses. If my hoses look good I'll go that route. ------------- HOT IN AZ |
Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Dec/15/2016 at 10:48am
Picked up the rotors and calipers for the Scarebird front disc kit. Now I need to find those banjo fittings I saw here on the forum.  ------------- HOT IN AZ |
Posted By: mitchs66
Date Posted: Dec/15/2016 at 4:03pm
| I believe you are looking for NAPA weatherhead part number 7709. Bolt hole diameter or the banjo, is 19/32 and inverted seat or flare for a 1/4 line. |
Posted By: mitchs66
Date Posted: Dec/15/2016 at 4:13pm
| My kit was different and used the Celebrity calipers with '80 Camaro front hoses. NAPA hose number 36845. They have the banjo on one end, fit the car bracket, and the steel line fit. This may still work with the truck caliper? Just a thought...Good luck! |
Posted By: Zioamc
Date Posted: Dec/15/2016 at 6:27pm
| looking good |
Posted By: Rampar
Date Posted: Dec/15/2016 at 9:32pm
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Might i Ask Why you only pie cut you wheel tubs? I'm about to do mine just wondering if there's an advantage to that... also whats your rear end shortened to? ------------- 1966 Rampar American |
Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Dec/17/2016 at 12:13pm
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Mitchs66 thanks for the info. Scarebird suggest a 80's Eldorado brake line for this kit but my hoses are good so the banjo fitting should do the job. Rampar I didn't need much room for the tire to have plenty room so didn't make sense to me to cut the whole tub out. The top of the tub has all the room I needed. The bottom of the tub is factory tapered inward so I decided to just pull the bottom out against the frame, pretty much the same width top n bottom now. A lot less work. I'm running a 245/60/15 on a 8" wide rim. I could probably go to a 10" wide wheel now but Rocket don't make this wheel in a 15x10. I'll have to double check my notes but I believe the axle measurement is 50.5" Flang to Flang. I'm at work now so I'd have to check my notes to be sure. ------------- HOT IN AZ |
Posted By: farna
Date Posted: Dec/20/2016 at 6:40am
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IF the hoses have never been replaced I suggest you go ahead and replace them. Looking good isn't an indicator of internal condition. Hoses aren't expensive... and easy to change since you already have the brakes off. Better safe than sorry! Scarebird has had three different AMC setups. The first used Ranger rotors, then Celebrity, and finally Toyota Previa. Calipers have always been GM, but bracket design has changed. The changes in bracket design have driven rotor choice. They have tweaked their bracket designs to make them safer and/or easier to install over the years for all their products. I've never heard of an AMC bracket failing, but the welded bracket has cracked in larger, heavier, more powerful cars. They just took the safer way out and redesigned all the brackets. The original setup with Ranger rotors would only work with drum brake spindles, and then only one height (the narrow drums, IIRC). Spacers can be used if I'm wrong and it was the taller wide drums, the spindle would have to be cut down otherwise. So they redesigned the bracket to mount on top of the spindle, since the stub that holds the bearings is the same height on all (including disc brakes). ------------- Frank Swygert |
Posted By: amcglass
Date Posted: Dec/24/2016 at 10:12pm
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looking Great Keep it up ------------- Javmanpres BBG Mark Donohue 401 74 Jav/AMX 71 Matador 2dr sedan delivery wagon 1902 Rambler Runabout 70 T/A Javelin |
Posted By: blackbetty
Date Posted: Jan/23/2017 at 1:20am
| Does look great. Love the fabricating. |
Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Feb/01/2017 at 4:48pm
Rampar, I'm sorry about the slow response. Here's the rear axle measurement.
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Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Feb/01/2017 at 4:56pm
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Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Feb/01/2017 at 5:02pm
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Using the factor Explorer parking brake cables we need to make a spacer for the drive side cable to even the ends out, pulling it back a bit.  Ended up having the cable shortened. ------------- HOT IN AZ |
Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Feb/01/2017 at 5:09pm
I think I figured out how to straighten out my sideways pictures. Screenshot them first and they don't turn. My daughter's so smart.  ------------- HOT IN AZ |
Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Feb/01/2017 at 5:13pm
 Drive line done and in with matching 1350 U-joints.   ------------- HOT IN AZ |
Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Feb/04/2017 at 10:35am
Started the scarebird front disc brake install. To be continued.  ------------- HOT IN AZ |
Posted By: kenoshakicker
Date Posted: Feb/04/2017 at 12:05pm
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Great job! I am subscribed. |
Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Feb/07/2017 at 12:12pm
    Front Scarebird disc brake kit on. ------------- HOT IN AZ |
Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Feb/07/2017 at 12:13pm
 Better picture of the tank relocated to center. ------------- HOT IN AZ |
Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Feb/07/2017 at 12:15pm
 Had to reset the sliders. ------------- HOT IN AZ |
Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Feb/07/2017 at 12:16pm
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Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Feb/16/2017 at 5:59pm
Allen at AZ Kustom Koncepts has done an awesome job finishing the fabrication work so it's time to pick her up and her do a few things under the hood before sending her out for headers and exhaust.     ------------- HOT IN AZ |
Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Feb/16/2017 at 6:03pm
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I'm really liking how she's looking. ------------- HOT IN AZ |
Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Feb/16/2017 at 9:28pm
 That's just sexy to me. ------------- HOT IN AZ |
Posted By: farna
Date Posted: Feb/17/2017 at 7:14am
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The four link with relocated leafs looks really good! Had to go back through the photos again. Excellent job "mini tubbing" too. Just all around great work! The sliders may be a bit noisy though. I see you used bearing sliders instead of the nylon block type. They might not be as bad. I didn't know they were somewhat noisy until it was pointed out by the guy building a Spirit GRM car (in projects or Frnakenrambler.... using a Ford 5.0L for power). He's using the nylon block type. I guess on open hot rods or loud exhaust muscle cars it doesn't matter, but on something quieter it might. Other than rubber mounting the sliders not much you can do. Puck type motor mounts would work, but would raise the slider up about an inch. Something like this, but they are 1.5" tall at the pad. You've already done a lot of mods... could recess the area where the slide is... The front mount for a 58-63 American has a single stud and a flat plate on the bottom, not sure what they go for now. They are about 1" thick, maybe as little as 3/4"... Of course there are many motor mounts that would work with some fabrication work on the slide frame and/or sill on the car ("frame" rail), doesn't have to have a stud on top... ------------- Frank Swygert |
Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Feb/17/2017 at 10:41am
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Thanks Farna. I didn't know they had different sliders. This is what Calverts sent with the rest of the Caltrac leaf spring kit I ordered. I didn't think about noise either. I hope they won't be to noisy. Thanks for the info. Could come in handy if they're to noisy as well as my next build.
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Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Feb/17/2017 at 10:46am
Allen used these nice braided brake line hoses when doing the new lines on the rear. Parking brake working great too.      ------------- HOT IN AZ |
Posted By: mitchs66
Date Posted: Feb/17/2017 at 11:21am
Very nice work 
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Posted By: jsprengeler
Date Posted: Feb/17/2017 at 1:32pm
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Thumbs up! Neat car! ------------- |
Posted By: mitchs66
Date Posted: Apr/07/2017 at 9:33pm
| Did you get your exhaust system on? |
Posted By: AMoCoLite
Date Posted: Apr/08/2017 at 12:31am
Clean looking ride! 
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Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Nov/14/2017 at 9:56am
    It's been way too long that I've worked on my car. Hoping to get back on her soon. Had a blast at my first amc car show and got a lot of positive feedback on the car. Enjoyed talking with Dan from AMC Musclecars. Look fwd to working with him soon. ------------- HOT IN AZ |
Posted By: mitchs66
Date Posted: Nov/14/2017 at 5:14pm
| Car looks great, glad you had a good time. |
Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Oct/24/2018 at 3:53pm
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Had a great time. I won best under construction but Dan ended up with the trophy being I didn't register it into the show. They told me where to park it and the people voted me best even up against that beautiful Marlin AZ AMC Restoration entered in the under construction group. I just wanted to park it where people could see it. First time ever taking a car to a show and the people really liked the car. ------------- HOT IN AZ |
Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Oct/24/2018 at 4:19pm
No. I'll be getting it done after the final install of the engine. ------------- HOT IN AZ |
mitchs66 wrote:Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Oct/24/2018 at 4:54pm
Time to get back to work on the Rambler.
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Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Oct/30/2018 at 8:13pm
Dropped her off to have the engine compartment blasted  ------------- HOT IN AZ |
Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Nov/02/2018 at 2:31pm
  Media blasting done.   ------------- HOT IN AZ |
Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Dec/08/2018 at 11:57am
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Got some paint on the engine compartment. ------------- HOT IN AZ |
Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Dec/08/2018 at 12:01pm
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Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Dec/08/2018 at 12:02pm
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Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Dec/08/2018 at 12:04pm
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Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Dec/08/2018 at 12:06pm
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Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Dec/08/2018 at 12:21pm
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Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Dec/27/2018 at 4:12pm
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This cars a factory power brake car I thought I could keep the power booster and factory master cylinder with the front and rear disc brakes. I've read a lot about manual master cylinders with disc brakes but haven't found anything on the factory power brake setup with disc brake conversions. Will this work or what if anything will I need to do to make this work?? I'd like to get it all in before my motors done and ready to installed. ------------- HOT IN AZ |
Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Dec/27/2018 at 4:23pm
It's to high up. Mounting holes line up but the mounting bracket is hitting up front stopping it from going down where it needs to be. Looking at it, it looks like I can trim a little out the radiator brackets on the front side so it can drop down lining up with the lower set of mounting holes but I'm definitely going to need to make some spacers on those bolts. First thought was cut both the mounts off the sides of the radiator, rework them and reattach them but that's a little bit much. ------------- HOT IN AZ |
Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Dec/27/2018 at 4:28pm
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Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Dec/27/2018 at 4:31pm
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Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Dec/27/2018 at 4:36pm
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Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Dec/27/2018 at 4:37pm
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Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Dec/27/2018 at 4:38pm
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Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Dec/27/2018 at 4:41pm
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Posted By: Ollie
Date Posted: Dec/28/2018 at 6:53am
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Looking good !! Looks as if you used a single stage paint? Having AMC Fun, Ollie ------------- 1966 American Convertible -- "The Rambler"..SOLD 1974 Postal Jeep -- "Rapid Delivery"...SOLD 1969 Rambler 220 post car--"Road Warrior" 1989 Jeep Comanche Pioneer, 4.0L, auto, 2wd |
Posted By: farna
Date Posted: Dec/28/2018 at 7:52am
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You can use the power brake master cylinder. Just remove the RPV from both outlets. I used one for a bit until the booster went on my 63 Classic with disks on both ends. Modified a Ford Ranger booster and master to replace it. ------------- Frank Swygert |
Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Dec/28/2018 at 9:54am
I was told it's PPG's base coat clear coat. My buddy that painted it said I didn't want single stage.
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Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Dec/28/2018 at 10:02am
Thank you Farna. Any special tool needed for this? ------------- HOT IN AZ |
Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Mar/11/2019 at 7:23pm
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Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Mar/11/2019 at 7:25pm
Had time to try my hand at making an engine storage cart. I hope it works as well as planned. 
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Posted By: farna
Date Posted: Mar/12/2019 at 5:53am
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I like it! If you have an extra crossmember that's a perfect idea! If not, notching the 2x8s (or whatever) for the trans and oil pan would be fine, maybe a wood support on each side to prop against the engine mount, manifold, or whatever, to keep it from tilting. ------------- Frank Swygert |
Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Jun/08/2019 at 9:59am
Over $7000 and a year later. Who takes a year to build a motor? A 3 year old could've done a better paint job but I can move forward with my car.  ------------- HOT IN AZ |
Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Jun/08/2019 at 10:01am
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Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Jun/08/2019 at 10:02am
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Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Jun/08/2019 at 10:04am
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Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Jun/08/2019 at 10:06am
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Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Jun/08/2019 at 10:07am
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Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Jun/08/2019 at 10:10am
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Posted By: AZ65440H
Date Posted: Jun/23/2019 at 8:23pm
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Posted By: mixed up
Date Posted: Jun/24/2019 at 12:40am
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very well done I like what you done now come the hard part shoe horning the 401 in the engine bay it fits but I had issues with radiator clearance on my 65 220 fan was real close to the radiator but I moved that in front of the core support but I used a factory 3 core radiator I see you have a aftermarket did you have the engine mocked up in here before ------------- 69 amx 290 auto 65 220 290 4spd 80 ford fairmont |