AMX Rally Car
Printed From: TheAMCForum.com
Category: Competition
Forum Name: Autocross, circle track
Forum Description: Ralleys, autocross, non-drag racing events and conversations
URL: https://theamcforum.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=78040
Printed Date: Apr/16/2024 at 5:11am
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 12.03 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: AMX Rally Car
Posted By: Javelin_GT
Subject: AMX Rally Car
Date Posted: Mar/18/2016 at 8:53pm
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First off I have no idea how to build a rally car. I just took the car
to a guy I trust with a truck load of parts Ive been packing around for
years. The idea is to run the car on tarmac and forest roads....uh I mean asphalt and dirt. Where I started.  So here are the first pics I got today from the shop. Starting up front and working backwards. Fender troughs off and new front support with the radiator mounted.   |
Replies:
Posted By: amcenthusiast
Date Posted: Mar/19/2016 at 8:15am
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This car was given "Best Engineered Car of the Year" award by Society of Automotive Engineers two years in a row; 1969 & 1970. *That's a BIG DEAL* Think about it; ... B E S T E N G I N E E R E D C A R ... in the world... WOW = REALLY WOW NO; not Mercedes, not BMW, not Porsche... YES; AMC's AMX got the award instead. = just put back into stock condition and you'll have an excellent car. (ever driven a 'nice' AMX? why screw it up?) ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Why not make a 'beater' using a junkyard sourced Matador fastback with an Olds Toronado transaxle/AMC V8 bell adapter to make it a mid-engined experimental? (like making your own AMX/3?) ...think it would 'jump good'? rear weight biased? YEE HAW JETHRO! Hey... ever heard of a Jeep XJ?... Why not start out with a Eagle SX4? -having quadratrac with 7" front & 9" rear wheel travel isn't good enough? Or why not start with VW bug chassis and make a 'dune buggy'? (wouldn't that be more fun for whatcha wanna do?) --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- "Heaven on earth is where the French are cooks, the Brits are police officers, the Greeks are the lovers and the Swiss are the bankers. heck on earth is where the Brits are the cooks, the Germans are the police officers, the Greeks are the bankers and the Swiss are the lovers." |
Posted By: Javelin_GT
Date Posted: Mar/19/2016 at 9:05am
| I have no response to this post. |
Posted By: ambassador401
Date Posted: Mar/19/2016 at 9:17am
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Really cool! What kind of rally class you are building this for? Is it going to be amc powered? Cant wait to see the progress Teemu |
Posted By: Javelin_GT
Date Posted: Mar/19/2016 at 9:28am
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Teemu Basically I had this shell with no vin/title and a bunch of parts I had from an abandoned project. So I met a real good fabricator with real good rates and decided to put the car together. I have another "tarmac" car planned and was always a fan of rally racing so I decided to build it to NASA Rally standards which will also allow it to race in other groups but not vintage. I will probably do some hill climbs with it but tearing up old logging roads sounds so much better. I am going to do allot of the stuff we talked about in the past. In fact the sway bar set going in is based on yours!! Thanks for the idea. |
Posted By: FuzzFace2
Date Posted: Mar/19/2016 at 11:58am
Besides if you have a car with out a title other than cut it up or crush it I think this is the next best thing. Also every one will now know what an AMC AMX is. Dave ---- ------------- TSM = Technical Service Manual 75 Gremlin X v8 for sale 70 Javelin 360/auto drag car 70 Javelin 360/T5 Street car |
amcenthusiast wrote:Posted By: Javelin_GT
Date Posted: Mar/19/2016 at 12:06pm
| Dave....I like your style. Still wish your 70 would have worked out but I am happy to get this AMX going. |
Posted By: Javelin_GT
Date Posted: Mar/19/2016 at 12:36pm
Fresh pics of Schroeder sway bar going in.  |
Posted By: GreggR
Date Posted: Mar/19/2016 at 6:16pm
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Don't know squat about building rally cars... but I sure do want to see "sideways" pics when you get on the loose stuff... ------------- No matter where you go, there you are... Buckaroo Banzai.'75 Hornet Hatchback |
Posted By: ambassador401
Date Posted: Mar/20/2016 at 2:00am
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Nice! I dont know about rallying in US but in Finland we have these so called Sprint Rallys that are easy way to start rallying. There is just one special stage that is driven two times and you can go check it trough before by foot or bicycle. You dont need a co driver or notes. There are both gravel an tarmac. I quess your hill climb races are a bit like that |
Posted By: Javelin_GT
Date Posted: Mar/20/2016 at 6:56am
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We also have something called RallyCross which is kind of entry level rallying. Its on dirt and timed but no co-driver. Fairly cheap to run. http://www.coloradorallycross.org/" rel="nofollow - http://www.coloradorallycross.org/ There is a pretty good place for it not far from me. http://www.coloradooffroadextreme.com/home.html" rel="nofollow - http://www.coloradooffroadextreme.com/home.html |
Posted By: Hurst390
Date Posted: Mar/20/2016 at 7:32am
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Cool looks like fun I should bring my Javelin out sometime and rally it lol ------------- SC/Hurst Rambler 11.62 120 100% Street Legal |
Posted By: Javelin_GT
Date Posted: Mar/20/2016 at 8:53am
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I am going to meet up with these guys soon. http://blackflag.jalopnik.com/the-amazing-muscle-cars-of-colorado-hill-climbs-1745500141?utm_expid=66866090-68.hhyw_lmCRuCTCg0I2RHHtw.0&utm_campaign=socialflow_jalopnik_facebook&utm_source=jalopnik_facebook&utm_medium=socialflow" rel="nofollow - http://blackflag.jalopnik.com/the-amazing-muscle-cars-of-colorado-hill-climbs-1745500141?utm_expid=66866090-68.hhyw_lmCRuCTCg0I2RHHtw.0&utm_campaign=socialflow_jalopnik_facebook&utm_source=jalopnik_facebook&utm_medium=socialflow |
Posted By: iraceitall
Date Posted: Mar/20/2016 at 9:28am
| I am totally digging this. |
Posted By: 70 Donohue 390
Date Posted: Mar/20/2016 at 12:58pm
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Are we seeing Pikes Peak in your future Adam? This popped up somewhere last week. A little inspiration!? http://www.p2pamx.com/" rel="nofollow - http://www.p2pamx.com/  ------------- 67 Rogue 290 Convert 70 BBO 390 5 Speed Javelin-under construction |
Posted By: Javelin_GT
Date Posted: Mar/20/2016 at 1:52pm
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Ron....that car is definitely an inspiration. Those guys really think outside the box which I like. |
Posted By: Javelin_GT
Date Posted: Mar/21/2016 at 2:39pm
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Here is the 2016 Colorado Hill Climb promo video. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lOFtomc-0uQ&list=PLqwqwFnczb1SUyJ4tjDArtqvMRcdJqSvS" rel="nofollow - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lOFtomc-0uQ&list=PLqwqwFnczb1SUyJ4tjDArtqvMRcdJqSvS |
Posted By: Slate
Date Posted: Mar/21/2016 at 10:47pm
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Sounds like a bittchen project. I thought about the Brit dude doing the P to P when you mentioned doing this thing. Hope you see it all the way to completion. Stev
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Posted By: P2P AMX
Date Posted: Mar/22/2016 at 2:18am
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Huzzah for the Brit Dude Best of luck with your build, you might find some useful stuff in the build section at the end of the website: www.p2pamx.com Jim Valentine Dare to be Diffident ------------- Jim Dare to be diffident |
Posted By: nickleone
Date Posted: Mar/22/2016 at 12:04pm
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To do rallys that involve public roads you need a title and license plates. Plus insurance. Nick X pro rally driver navigator ------------- nick 401 71 Gremlin pro rally car sold 390 V8 SX/4 pro rally car sold 1962 Classic SW T5 4 wheel disc brakes |
Posted By: Javelin_GT
Date Posted: Mar/22/2016 at 5:07pm
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Nick Probably going to stick to rallycross and hill climbs for a while. Also probably try HPDE with it. |
Posted By: Javelin_GT
Date Posted: Apr/04/2016 at 7:35pm
Had the lower control arms worked up. Will have to see how well they work. Chrysler lower ball joint and a spherical bearing end.   |
Posted By: Javelin_GT
Date Posted: Apr/05/2016 at 4:09pm
Upper control arms being fitted.   |
Posted By: White70JavelinSST
Date Posted: Apr/07/2016 at 3:49pm
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Nice project, I like the idea. I have a suggestion for you, those upper control arm inner rod ends are nearly at the end of their sideways deflection travel.  Would benefit from being a straighter shot at the pivot points, like these control arms are.  When the rod end is nearly perpendicular to it's rotational axis the spherical bearing lives a lot longer. Learned this from Carrol Smith's book "Build To Win" ------------- 70 Javelin SST, second owner, purchased 1972 |
Posted By: Javelin_GT
Date Posted: Apr/09/2016 at 10:41am
| I am with you on the deflection but that's how its going in for now. Will have to look at something more custom down the road. |
Posted By: Javelin_GT
Date Posted: Apr/24/2016 at 7:39am
Strut arms are in and the steering linkage is almost done.  |
Posted By: Red Devil
Date Posted: Apr/26/2016 at 12:03pm
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Appears you have spherical joints at both ends if the strut rod, at the lower arm pivot at the engine crossmember and a ball joint for the knuckle. What prevents the lower arm from twisting? Is the line of action through the strut rod always coincident with the centre of rotation of the lower ball joint? If not, there is a moment that will want to twist the lower arm. Since it has a spherical joint at the crossmember, not sure what prevents the twist? I see too many degrees of freedom for the lower arm arrangement. With a spherical joint at the chassis pivot for the strut rod and one at the arm pivot at the crossmember, the lower arm should act like an A-arm (similar to your upper arm with only 2 sphericals), so should be more stable with the strut rod rigidly attached at the lower arm than with a spherical joint. Do the lugs for the strut rod heim at the arm limit it's movement,i.e. just there to allow easy adjustment of strut rod length, or something else limiting? Thanks, RD. |
Posted By: nickleone
Date Posted: Apr/26/2016 at 1:29pm
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Javelin_GT, Stock strut arms bend when you fly the car and land hard(I bent the ones on my Pro Rally Gremlin). By the way the Pro Rally Gremlin with the 401 is on Denvers Craigs list. Search Gremlin and a RED one will appear. The engine is shown in one of the pictures. It has red/white/blue valve covers. The red car is NOT my old Pro Rally car. Nick ------------- nick 401 71 Gremlin pro rally car sold 390 V8 SX/4 pro rally car sold 1962 Classic SW T5 4 wheel disc brakes |
Posted By: amcenthusiast
Date Posted: Apr/27/2016 at 8:36am
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Shouldn't this thread go in the 'member projects' or 'Frankenrambler' section? I guess Evil Knevil would have enjoyed the Astro-Spiral Javelin? |
Posted By: 304-dude
Date Posted: Apr/27/2016 at 9:32am
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Everyone has brought up good points to look in to. There are many ways one can redo a suspension. Donno, but IMO rally cross setup may benifit more with a CF suspension. Sure it is costly but it brings a bit of benifit. Though with every setup, small modifications here and there make customization almost a one of in design. I shortened the location of the control arms so that they are closer to the frame. Having a thinner tower actually strengthens and helps remove some twist. The biggest improvement is using the upper control arm to actuate the front sway bar. As it fights against the strut bar's action. Your lower arm looks good, but not sure why you kept stock length. I extended mine 1 inch at the strut bar mounting area. By doing so you increase track for bigger tires, better cornering, and more camber than what can be done stock. Here is a picture of mine... it will be boxed and a few finishing touches done.  ------------- 71 Javelin SST body 390 69 crank, 70 block & heads NASCAR SB2 rods & pistons 78 Jeep TH400 w/ 2.76 Low 50/50 Ford-AMC Suspension 79 F150 rear & 8.8 axles Ford Racing 3.25 gears & 9" /w Detroit locker |
Posted By: nickleone
Date Posted: Apr/27/2016 at 5:00pm
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304 dude, Wide track and fat tires are not needed for a rally or rally cross car. Most events in the USA are run on dirt and a fat tire will float and not turn well on dirt. A rally/rally cross car has to be built UNSTABLE for want of better word. You need to throw it in the opposite direction at a moments notice. Many of the 4wd cars are built with some toe out front and rear, One other point the rallys you see on TV are European and run on paved roads where large track and fat tires work. Nick Ex Regional Pro Rally driver(it got too expensive) ------------- nick 401 71 Gremlin pro rally car sold 390 V8 SX/4 pro rally car sold 1962 Classic SW T5 4 wheel disc brakes |
Posted By: 304-dude
Date Posted: Apr/27/2016 at 7:01pm
Ah, was thinking them Euro on and off road tracks. Though I am keeping my tack no wider than 65" would have thought them Baja trucks were about the same. I on and off followed Robby Gordons move in to Baja racing seems fun and a bit wild, as you cant tame the coarse, just respect it. ------------- 71 Javelin SST body 390 69 crank, 70 block & heads NASCAR SB2 rods & pistons 78 Jeep TH400 w/ 2.76 Low 50/50 Ford-AMC Suspension 79 F150 rear & 8.8 axles Ford Racing 3.25 gears & 9" /w Detroit locker |
Posted By: Javelin_GT
Date Posted: Apr/30/2016 at 3:44pm
Re-worked the upper control arm mounting angle and got the coil overs on.  |
Posted By: XRX744
Date Posted: May/06/2016 at 9:22pm
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Great build! Keep up the progress, can't wait to see it finished!!!!
------------- 69 AMX, pro touring /track car, TEAM tribute, aka: "The Kenosha Corncob" |
Posted By: Javelin_GT
Date Posted: Jul/16/2016 at 6:40am
Some update photos.   |
Posted By: shootist
Date Posted: Jul/16/2016 at 9:19am
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Very cool project. Can't wait to see it finished.
------------- 
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Posted By: 343sharpstick
Date Posted: Aug/01/2016 at 1:01pm
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Thanks for sharing, looks like things are coming together nicely. I thought I'd post a quick picture of what I'm working on here. Same concept with slightly different execution. I'm also using the 70 and up suspension uprights, and replacing the upper trunion with a mopar style ball joint. I'm using the longer QA-1 version to get more camber gain. The QA-1 units are rebuildable and you can swap out a few different stud lengths to change the angle of the upper A-arm. I've yet to figure out exactly where I'm going to mount the coil-over, but I have the upper arms ready for final welding! 
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Posted By: Javelin_GT
Date Posted: Jan/06/2017 at 10:07am
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Posted By: Javelin_GT
Date Posted: Jan/06/2017 at 10:20am
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Here is a walk around video of the car. Not the best but you can get a better idea of everything. |
Posted By: Rampar
Date Posted: Jan/07/2017 at 1:43pm
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I see your running sliders on the rear of your car... how exactly do you go about setting those up? Excuse my ignorance about them but do the leafs have to be parallel for them to work right? ------------- 1966 Rampar American |
Posted By: Javelin_GT
Date Posted: Jan/07/2017 at 2:41pm
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Rampar.....the sliders allow flexing in the leafs as far as I know. My fabricator told me to run either front leaf spring pivot bushings or the sliders. You cant run both I guess. So I went with the sliders since I am using Chrysler leaf springs from Speedway and the AFCO leaf spring pivot bushings wont fit in them. You have to have the AFCO leafs for their pivot bushings to work. This is also some trial and error. The car is built or dirt and asphalt rally and hill climbs so there is allot of things to work out. Going with a best guess and will adjust as necessary. |
Posted By: jebidia24
Date Posted: Oct/10/2017 at 7:45am
| I am undertaking a similar build and I am curious as to what coilover you are running? |
Posted By: Javelin_GT
Date Posted: Oct/10/2017 at 7:58am
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I have QA1 Double Adjustable Shocks. https://www.qa1.net/suspension/street-performance-racing-shocks-struts-and-pro-coil-systems/custom-mount-shocks/proma-star/proma-star-double-adjustable" rel="nofollow - https://www.qa1.net/suspension/street-performance-racing-shocks-struts-and-pro-coil-systems/custom-mount-shocks/proma-star/proma-star-double-adjustable |
Posted By: jebidia24
Date Posted: Oct/10/2017 at 11:42am
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Jevelin_GT Much appreciated. You are way ahead of where I am on my build and I am curious to see how well they hold up to the rigors of gravel rally. Depending on the outcome this may be a direction I go also.
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Posted By: iapexl8r
Date Posted: Oct/12/2017 at 2:18pm
| just finished installing the affco pivot bushings ( P/N 20229P) It says they are for Chrysler type springs but fit in my custom (built off originals) springs. just a few mods to the fwd mounts to work. Havn't tested with them yet but looking forward to it |
Posted By: barriegolfer
Date Posted: Feb/26/2018 at 9:24pm
| Which radiator did you install? |
Posted By: White70JavelinSST
Date Posted: Feb/27/2018 at 8:34am
First page, first post, there's a pic of the radiator. Has C & R logo on it https://www.crracing.com/" rel="nofollow - https://www.crracing.com/ ------------- 70 Javelin SST, second owner, purchased 1972 |
Posted By: Javelin_GT
Date Posted: Feb/27/2018 at 1:38pm
| It's a C&R NASCAR style radiator. What else do you need to know about it? |
Posted By: Javelin_GT
Date Posted: Feb/27/2018 at 1:49pm
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https://www.crracing.com/radiator_universal_heat_exchanger_closed_30_x_19_1_34_high_outlet_ford" rel="nofollow - https://www.crracing.com/radiator_universal_heat_exchanger_closed_30_x_19_1_34_high_outlet_ford SKU: 806-30194 Title: Radiator Universal Heat Exchanger Closed 30'' x 19 inch 1-3/4'' High Outlet (Ford) Radiator Style: Crossflow Brand: CR Racing |