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Can You ID This Manifold

Printed From: TheAMCForum.com
Category: The Garage
Forum Name: AMC V8 Engine Repair and Modifications
Forum Description: AMC-made V8 engine mechanical, ignition and fuel from basic repair to high-perf modifications
URL: https://theamcforum.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=25299
Printed Date: Mar/28/2024 at 11:30am
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Topic: Can You ID This Manifold
Posted By: Javelin_GT
Subject: Can You ID This Manifold
Date Posted: Dec/22/2010 at 6:41pm
Has an AMC factory part number!!!!!
 



Replies:
Posted By: fast401
Date Posted: Dec/22/2010 at 7:48pm
Tunnel ram?

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Disturbing the peace since 1970!!!   AMX 19245
Facebook page - AMC Nation
www.fast-401.4t.com


Posted By: PHAT69AMX
Date Posted: Dec/22/2010 at 8:42pm
Weiand ?

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Link to a http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MySiKQsmWxU" rel="nofollow - Short YouTube Burnout Video



Posted By: 401Ambo
Date Posted: Dec/22/2010 at 8:47pm
Looks like an individual-runner manifold for a pair of Dominators.
Maybe the forerunner to the UR-18.

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'72 401 Ambassador wagon
'69 pro-Street AMX
AMX/2 (starting soon)


Posted By: Javelin_GT
Date Posted: Dec/23/2010 at 4:03am

I only know rumors of the company that made them but they were an official American Motors part.

It was also used with the Dominators.  Here is about the only actual picture I have of one on the car.
 


Posted By: Aljav
Date Posted: Dec/24/2010 at 12:18am
I wonder what car that was on.  is that Even an AMC enine?  is the distributor straight up  ( ford)  or tilted?.

Is that part Number sound even correct?  did they have 448 part numbers in the 70's?  Where did that pic come from? Wish it was clearer, love to get a better view of the manifold.

Hope this get some thinking going on here.

Allan
Don't get me wrong, just trying to clarify what it all about. Cross rams used  68 or 69 in trans am,, Tunnel ram introduced in 71? from Edlebrock?


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69 AMX 9.86 132 mph 71 JAV/AMX and 69 Javelin, .. NAMDRA member #1106


Posted By: amx39068
Date Posted: Dec/24/2010 at 12:39am

Sure looks like Tony Sanchez's intake!



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Dan Curtis-Owner and CEO AZ AMC Restorations; Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/amcmusclecars/ & Curtis Real Estate Development


Posted By: PHAT69AMX
Date Posted: Dec/24/2010 at 3:06am
I do not own these pictures, saved off the web, unable to give picture credit to proper owner
since I did not save that information.  Thank You to owner of these pictures.
I will remove the pictures if original owner see fit that I do.
 
Appears to maybe be the same tunnel ram intake manifold in these pictures.
Top piece at least is obviously Weiand, a Dominator to Square Flange adapter maybe ?
Wonder since the top Adapter has "WEIAND" cast into it if the bottom is also Weiand ?
 


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Link to a http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MySiKQsmWxU" rel="nofollow - Short YouTube Burnout Video



Posted By: Javelin_GT
Date Posted: Dec/24/2010 at 9:12am
This was only a rumor until about a year ago when I met with John Martin from the T/A Javelin team in 68 and 69.
 
Through an inside connection AMC found out Ford was going to run two Dominator carbs for the 1969 Trans AM season.  So the Kaplan team which included John Martin drew up a manifold design and sent it to Edelbrock.  Edelbrock made the intakes but they were never an Edelbrock product.  All the intakes were sent to the Kaplan team.
 
The early 1969 Trans Am season saw this manifold with the two Dominators on the Javelins for at least the first race in Michigan and possibly the second race.  Then the SCCA outlawed them.
 
This is why the 1969 T/A Javelins have that huge bubble hood.  It was to clear this intake with the dominators.
 
My first picture is from a 1970 International FIA Homologation paper set on the 1970 Javelin.  My second picture is a still from a video of the Trans Am race at Michigan.
 
The 69 Trans Am engines also had a short deck and this is why Phat's pictures show a spacer on the intake.
 
I currently know two people who have one.  One guy I am not sure even knows what he has.


Posted By: Javelin_GT
Date Posted: Dec/24/2010 at 9:14am
If you want to really read a long thread about the AMC and Ford Dominators in Trans Am check this out.
 
http://www.boss302.com/smf/index.php?topic=46746.0 - http://www.boss302.com/smf/index.php?topic=46746.0
 
I am "adtarr" on this board.


Posted By: Hurst390
Date Posted: Dec/24/2010 at 9:27am
Adam a local guy had 2 or 3 "Kaplan AMC blocks" but sold them back in the 80's to a guy around kenosha..They were unmachined and he sold them cheap...The guy that bought them I don't think has them anymore..have you ever ran accross any of those or have any pics of the blocks?

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SC/Hurst Rambler

11.62 120

100% Street Legal


Posted By: Javelin_GT
Date Posted: Dec/24/2010 at 9:33am
There was a guy on either this or the other AMC forum a couple years back who had one.  He wasnt sure what he had.  Said it was a 401 block with a 290 bore, 4 bolt mains, and shorter deck.
 
The 69 T/A blocks had the short deck and 4 bolt mains.  They failed to homolgate them and the SCCA told Kaplan he couldnt run them after the first or second race.  After this they went back to the factory 290 blocks.
 
John Martin said all of their engine problems in 69 were because they couldnt run the 4 bolt main blocks.  But they did just fine in 68 with them so who really knows.
 
I have personllay never seen one of those Kaplan short deck blocks either in pictures or in person.
 
I do know of a guy who is currently working on building a period correct 69 T/A Javelin with the tunnel ram.  He is one of the guys I know who has one.  He also has the correct 69 Dominators for it and an NOS 69 390 block with a 343 bore.  Kind of like the 70 T/A block only its a 69.  He also has some odd NOS 3.00 stroke crank with BBC rod journals.


Posted By: 401Ambo
Date Posted: Dec/24/2010 at 10:29am
Is that a single-plane Traco intake on the Craig Jackson '69 Javelin from the Coronado speed fest ?
Any other pics of it?

It still looks to me that the IR intake was the basis for the Edelbrock UR-18. The holes in the gaskets in between the halves line up real nice with Dominators. And the runners look the same to me, just cut a bit off the top.




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'72 401 Ambassador wagon
'69 pro-Street AMX
AMX/2 (starting soon)


Posted By: Javelin_GT
Date Posted: Dec/24/2010 at 10:34am

The Craig Jackson car does have a single plane Traco intake.  I know of only one other guy who has one but have never seen it.  They have a removable top and I am pretty sure they were made in the 70's and not T/A pieces.

Also there was a guy running around with a dual carb Traco intake that had a removable top as well.
 
That intake may have been the basis for the UR-18 but I have no idea on that.


Posted By: tsanchez
Date Posted: Dec/24/2010 at 11:48am
It is not like my manifold but does look like the one pictured with the weiand top which may or may not have been originally on them. I recall an edelbrock UR11 manifold but have never seen one this may be it and the predecessor to the  UR18. I think offenhauser made one too

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http://s192.photobucket.com/user/antonsan/media/jav1_zps87a70dce.jpg.html" rel="nofollow">


Posted By: SC397
Date Posted: Dec/24/2010 at 12:37pm
It look like the same as mine. A UR11 plenum bolts up to it too.



(No clue why I can't post pictures any more. Hopefully, someone can fix it)


Posted By: bigbad69
Date Posted: Dec/24/2010 at 12:51pm




You were missing "http://theamcforum.com/forum/" at the start of the file locations in your IMG tags. Right click on the picture and select "view image info". It will show you the full file path.


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69 Javelin SST BBO 390 T10


Posted By: Javelin_GT
Date Posted: Dec/24/2010 at 1:13pm
SC397.......you were the second guy I knew who had one.


Posted By: 401Ambo
Date Posted: Dec/24/2010 at 2:40pm
Originally posted by Javelin_GT Javelin_GT wrote:

The Craig Jackson car does have a single plane Traco intake.  I know of only one other guy who has one but have never seen it.  They have a removable top and I am pretty sure they were made in the 70's and not T/A pieces.



Removable top?
Now that sounds (and looks) like the "new" Indy Mod Man intakes.


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'72 401 Ambassador wagon
'69 pro-Street AMX
AMX/2 (starting soon)


Posted By: Aljav
Date Posted: Dec/25/2010 at 10:47am
Ok I now I feel dumb..Hammer Head

Wow  .. this awesome... I never knew that they had those intake manifolds on an AMC in Trans AM. Awesome information.  I saw that intake on the video to but assumed it was Ford.

So I take it the real reason for the hood bulge is for that Intake?

Would love to see a side buy side of the two manifolds.

Allan

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69 AMX 9.86 132 mph 71 JAV/AMX and 69 Javelin, .. NAMDRA member #1106


Posted By: SC397
Date Posted: Dec/25/2010 at 4:25pm
"Would love to see a side buy side of the two manifolds."
Which ones?


Posted By: Javelin_GT
Date Posted: Dec/26/2010 at 9:22am
Here are pictures of the other one I know about.  It has been cut down by someone at some point.  The Dominators on it are period correct for it.
 
 
 


Posted By: Aljav
Date Posted: Dec/26/2010 at 10:05am
The Trans Am manifolds " tunnel ram" and the Edelbrock Tunnel ram UR 18 next to each others.. see how difference between the two.

Allan


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69 AMX 9.86 132 mph 71 JAV/AMX and 69 Javelin, .. NAMDRA member #1106


Posted By: SC397
Date Posted: Dec/27/2010 at 8:00pm
Here you go.. I guess that the Tunnel Ram was never intended to have a plenum but I found one off of ebay that fits on it ok. It has UR11 embossed on it just like the one that fits the UR18 manifold. As you can see by the pictures they have different mounting holes.






Posted By: Aljav
Date Posted: Dec/27/2010 at 9:05pm
Your pic postings don't work

Allan


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69 AMX 9.86 132 mph 71 JAV/AMX and 69 Javelin, .. NAMDRA member #1106


Posted By: poormansMACHINE
Date Posted: Dec/27/2010 at 9:10pm
Originally posted by SC397 SC397 wrote:

"Would love to see a side buy side of the two manifolds."
Which ones?


I don't think either would fit under my hood.


Posted By: SC397
Date Posted: Dec/27/2010 at 9:46pm
"I don't think either would fit under my hood"

Oh, sure they would. You will just have to lower your front cross member... like about 6-8 inches.


Posted By: poormansMACHINE
Date Posted: Dec/27/2010 at 9:50pm
Jigsaw to the spare hood it is then.LOL


Posted By: Javelin_GT
Date Posted: Dec/28/2010 at 9:19am
The T/A cars didnt have that piece between the intake and the carbs like SC397 has.  It was an IR type system with each barrel of the carb supplying fuel to a single cylinder.
 
Before Ford got Holley to make the Dominator they tried using Autolites.  This setup here was actually designed for T/A racing in 69' but the SCCA gave them a big NO so they designed the Dominator setup that AMC got wind of and built their own.
 
Ford T/A Autolite setup....
 
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Dual-Inline-Autolite-Carburetors-Manifold-Boss-302-/160523520914?pt=Race_Cars_Not_Street_Legal_&hash=item255ff28b92#v4-36 - http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Dual-Inline-Autolite-Carburetors-Manifold-Boss-302-/160523520914?pt=Race_Cars_Not_Street_Legal_&hash=item255ff28b92#v4-36
 
 


Posted By: Aljav
Date Posted: Dec/28/2010 at 12:28pm
Thanks Kirkwood for fixing the Pics.. Now I can see!!!

Yes, if you add a plenum to it you change the design because a runner has specific length due to harmonics. if you notice the Trans Am manifold and the UR18 are basically the same height without the added plenum.  Using one without a plenum its a whole new beast. I can only imagine what a 304 cubic inch engine runs like with a 2 dominator carbs on IR manifold..WOW

This is truly awesome. I can't believe there hasn't been more info about all this awesome stuff the RKR team developed. Garret Ghezzi, the owner of the SS/AMX with a 290 told me he just purchased some of the 290 blocks used in Trans AM racing.

Thanks for posting this info. I really enjoy learning.

Allan


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69 AMX 9.86 132 mph 71 JAV/AMX and 69 Javelin, .. NAMDRA member #1106


Posted By: klvn8r
Date Posted: Mar/10/2012 at 12:31pm
Can someone put Garret Ghezzi in contact with me?  I've got some questions for him.  Thanks!

klvn8r
ccamx73 AT airmail.net



Posted By: klvn8r
Date Posted: Mar/12/2012 at 7:03pm
anyone???



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