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Factory original batteries

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Category: The Garage
Forum Name: Electrical - non engine
Forum Description: Charging systems, lights, non-ignition system, it goes here.
URL: https://theamcforum.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=25196
Printed Date: Mar/18/2024 at 11:39pm
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Topic: Factory original batteries
Posted By: amcrules00
Subject: Factory original batteries
Date Posted: Dec/18/2010 at 4:31pm
I'm looking for the correct battery that left the factory in my '73 Jav/AMX. Anyone know of a source for a correct reproduction?



Replies:
Posted By: amcrules00
Date Posted: Dec/18/2010 at 4:33pm
Forgot to mention, also looking for the factory correct flag style battery cables as well. Any leads greatly apprecitated.


Posted By: mramc
Date Posted: Dec/18/2010 at 4:54pm
You are in luck , within reason. There are two companies making reproduction period AMC batteries , that are as correct as your going to get. One Restoration Battery, web site here : http://www.restorationbattery.com/amcproducts.html . I've not had dealings with them , so I can't say any thing one way or the other about them. The other older company , that been doing AMC reproduction batteries for a while  now is Antique Auto battery, web site here :http://www.shoporium.com/shops/AntiqueAutoBattery/view_item.php3?id=72187
I had a couple of the Antique Auto batteries and there just like the factory batteries , 3 years and DONE. A battery tender may help , but I've yet to get more then 3 years out of one. I'm inclined to give Restoration Battery a shot next go around. Both batteries runs around the same price , about $200 each sans shipping. Note the 68 to 74 batteries are the same , per say. Antique is missing a couple years on there list I'm currently looking at ,but I'm thinking  the newer Restoration Battery MAY be the better battery. You pay your money and you take your choice. LRDaum


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LRDaum


Posted By: sidewinder
Date Posted: Dec/18/2010 at 5:55pm
If your not too much or a purest try AMARK for the reproduction battery top.  You mount it to a new battery and it looks exactly like it left the factory.   I went a step further and painted the new battery to look like the "clear" AM battery where you could see the liquid level.   It comes in the older script style and also the newer block logo and cost is 1/3 the cost of a repop battery.    Also the side post cable is available from Gordy Chilson ( dolz4 on ebay) ..... I got one from him but haven't installed it yet. 



-------------
Chuck Page ,AKA Sidewinder
1968 "BLACK CHERRY" Javelin
Previous owner of 2013 Heritage Cup winner 1970 BBO AMX




Posted By: cali201
Date Posted: Dec/18/2010 at 6:45pm
Here is the AMARK battery topper for the '70 and up cars


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Posted By: billd
Date Posted: Dec/18/2010 at 10:12pm
What about the EARLY 70s - that still used the script - I assume sidewinder's would be that 1970 style..........
Now the issue - how do those fit on "modern" batteries that are not exactly the same size as back then? They are usually just a bit different in one or more dimensions.........


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http://theamcpages.com" rel="nofollow - http://theamcpages.com

http://antique-engines.com" rel="nofollow - http://antique-engines.com


Posted By: amx39068
Date Posted: Dec/19/2010 at 6:54am
There is a company that makes all versions that the AMC vendors buy from but that you can buy from direrct as well.  The problem is they cost around $225 per battery.  As an alternative to you use a interstate batter with the white bottom and green top and just add AMarks topper and do it for half that price.

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Dan Curtis-Owner and CEO AZ AMC Restorations; Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/amcmusclecars/ & Curtis Real Estate Development


Posted By: whizkidder
Date Posted: Dec/19/2010 at 8:51am
Looked at Interstate battries last night at Summit -- they have the "Interstate" logo molded into the side of the white part of the case, so would stick out like a sore thumb -- also, they have the plug in caps sticking up, so you'd have to leave them open under the topper.
 
Think the best bet is to do like Cali and others and get a flat-top (recessed caps) and paint the case.


-------------
Ron Frost
marne1ancient @ gmail.com
910 nine two two 0563

"There is no limit to what a man can do, so long as he does not care a straw who gets credit for it. Charles Montague


Posted By: sidewinder
Date Posted: Dec/19/2010 at 11:41am
If you get a top from AMARK ( early or late style)  you can take it your local battery place and fit the correct size ( AMX and Javelin use a 24-60)  If the battery is black you paint it a cream or off white flat.  Then you tape off the top 1" or so and spray the bottom a medium flat gray. Very light coat so it doesn't really cover the off white completely.   It will look just like the original AMC clear power battery.   I had an original when I did mine and side by side you couldn't tell which was actually the "clear" one.   The best part is that when you have to replace the battery your not shelling out a few hundred for another repoped battery......they don't last forever ...........

Chuck Page 
 

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Chuck Page ,AKA Sidewinder
1968 "BLACK CHERRY" Javelin
Previous owner of 2013 Heritage Cup winner 1970 BBO AMX




Posted By: Burnished Brown
Date Posted: Dec/19/2010 at 12:42pm
I just went through this with Antique Auto Battery.  My last battery lasted only two years and it wouldn't hold a charge any more.
 
It was explained that the battery, once fully discharged does not know what the polarity should be and won't properly charge.  These batteries need to be on a 4/6/10 AMP trickle charger at least once a month while in storage.  8-12 hours should do it.   Batteries do self discharge, so proper maintenence is required.
 
The fix for a battery that won't charge is to get your car or another car started, remove the battery in that car and install the fully discharged battery for 10 minutes.  Do not add any acid.  This should tell the battery which is positive and which is negative.  Then use a battery charger to fully charge.
 
Any questions, call Dolores or Chris at Antique Auto Battery
 
1-330-425-4500
 
or contact them at
 
mailto:info@antiqueautobattery.com - info@antiqueautobattery.com  
 
They were very helpful.  They can explain the process a little better than I may have done.
 
I also had them fabricate a set of battery cables for my 1971 Javelin/AMX.  They turned out as close to the originals as I have seen.  Not a perfect reproduction, but close.  I can post pictures if anyone wants to see them.
 
The Interstate Battery solution with the AMARK topper wasn't going to work as stated.  We tried that on another AMC.  The concourse correct solution is the use of the reproduction batteries from Antique.


-------------
Terry

1971 Burnished Brown Javelin/AMX
1971 Mustard Yellow Javelin/AMX
1970 Bayshore Blue AMX
1970 Bittersweet Orange Rebel Machine
1969 Beale Street Blue Javelin SST



Posted By: amcrules00
Date Posted: Dec/19/2010 at 12:55pm
Excellent Terry, exactly what I was looking for. If you don't mind me asking what was the price of the battery cables? Were they custom made to your specs or from their catalog? If you would, post a couple of picts of the cables too please? Thanks so much.


Posted By: amx39068
Date Posted: Dec/19/2010 at 12:57pm
All depened on your budget and your tolerance for grief and aggravation.  For 99.99% of the people, the AMark topper will be just what they need.  I have picked up an original and unused battery and one of the repros over the past couple of years and both had cracks in them and were unusable.  I will not use them again.

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Dan Curtis-Owner and CEO AZ AMC Restorations; Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/amcmusclecars/ & Curtis Real Estate Development


Posted By: Burnished Brown
Date Posted: Dec/25/2010 at 8:14pm
Here are the pictures of the battery cables that Antique Auto Battery fabricated for me.  They are not in any catalog, so you need to tell them excatly what you are looking for.  These are for a 1971 Javelin/AMX.  Thank you to my friend Steve Guhanick for the pictures of the original battery cables from his '71 that I used to order my set.
 
The Positive Cable should be 8" of live length of wire.  Antique did make a mistake the first time around, so be sure you do not have them duplicate what they originally shipped to me.  The Negative Cable should be 26" of live length of wire.
 
You can see that the reproductions are pretty close but not exact.  They are still better than what I have on my car now and better than I have seen on most restorations.
 
The Positive Cable was supplied with a shorter shrink tube on the end that connects to the starter solenoid.  The Positive Cable terminal that connects to the starter solenoid and the Negative Cable terminal that connects to the alternator bracket as a ground differ slightly from the originals too.
 
I paid about $45.00 total for both plus shipping.  Turn around was within days.
 
Picture of an Original AMC Positive Battery Cable for 1971 Javelin/AMX
http://i517.photobucket.com/albums/u332/gtotech67/P1020621.jpg%5b/IMG%5d">
 
Picture of Original AMC Negative Battery Cable for 1971 Javelin/AMX
 
Picture of Original AMC Negative Battery Cable Connection for 1971 Javelin/AMX
 
Picture of Reproduction Battery Cables from Antique Auto Battery
 
Picture of Reproduction Battery Cable Connections Close Up
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 


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Terry

1971 Burnished Brown Javelin/AMX
1971 Mustard Yellow Javelin/AMX
1970 Bayshore Blue AMX
1970 Bittersweet Orange Rebel Machine
1969 Beale Street Blue Javelin SST



Posted By: amcrules00
Date Posted: Dec/26/2010 at 7:53am
Awesome tidbit of info right there Terry, I've seen a few of our vendors selling these cables in the past for well over two hundred a set(just plain nonsense)and they didn't even come close to anything as original looking as these are. I think you just let the cat outta the bag, they look like very nice reproductions to me. Thanks much for making this happen and of course, sharing the info here. You done good.


Posted By: scrambler1000
Date Posted: Jan/02/2011 at 8:12am
what model interstate batt did you use?


Posted By: amx39068
Date Posted: Jan/02/2011 at 10:44am
Just their regular old 24D series.  I put the Interstate logo up against the fender and painted the top black like an original battery and it looked great after installing the correct battery hold down for 69
 
 


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Dan Curtis-Owner and CEO AZ AMC Restorations; Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/amcmusclecars/ & Curtis Real Estate Development


Posted By: billd
Date Posted: Jan/02/2011 at 10:12pm
This post is now "stickied" - please "keep it clean" and post correct dimensions, photos, etc. on correct cables, batteries, etc. so it can be a nice clean accurate future reference.
This one comes up quite a bit............  good posts.


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http://theamcpages.com" rel="nofollow - http://theamcpages.com

http://antique-engines.com" rel="nofollow - http://antique-engines.com


Posted By: amx39068
Date Posted: Jan/02/2011 at 10:26pm
what does being stickied mean?

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Dan Curtis-Owner and CEO AZ AMC Restorations; Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/amcmusclecars/ & Curtis Real Estate Development


Posted By: bikerfox
Date Posted: Jun/15/2011 at 3:00pm
Originally posted by amx39068 amx39068 wrote:

what does being stickied mean?
 
Dan,
 
According to wikipidia.org, "A sticky post or sticky topic is a type of post or topic in an /wiki/Internet_forum - online forum that is "pinned" near the top of the forum index, enhancing its visibility and preventing it from being buried by newer posts."


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1969 Rebel SST (1970-1987)
1968 AMX (2005-2011)
1969 SC/Rambler (2011-2019)
1970 Javelin (2019 to ?)"Jane"


Posted By: sidewinder
Date Posted: Jun/15/2011 at 3:12pm
Well sticky me....learn something new every day!!....Big smile 

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Chuck Page ,AKA Sidewinder
1968 "BLACK CHERRY" Javelin
Previous owner of 2013 Heritage Cup winner 1970 BBO AMX




Posted By: Midnight Rambler
Date Posted: Jun/15/2011 at 3:15pm
Originally posted by billd billd wrote:

This post is now "stickied" - please "keep it clean" and post correct dimensions, photos, etc. on correct cables, batteries, etc. so it can be a nice clean accurate future reference.
This one comes up quite a bit............  good posts.


Bill,

You're going to need to consider putting "stickied" topics in a sub-forum of the proper forum pretty soon.  I know "Restoration" has so many stickies that a new post is at the bottom of the page.  A few more stickies and new posts will appear on page two of that forum. 

I agree with the principle of making topics a sticky, but if they aren't time sensitive and eventually will be "unstickied" they jam up a forum's front page.  Many of these threads are that valuable and referred to often enough to deserve a highly visible place to be easily found.  Perhaps a "Hall of Fame" subforum in each respective forum may be the answer in the future.

Sticky this for future reference.Wink

LOL


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'66 American 440 Convertible 290/M-40/AMC 20 3.15/PS/PB
'04 Jeep Wrangler X Rocky Mountain Edition 4.0 5sp


Posted By: farna
Date Posted: Jul/25/2012 at 11:32am
We're getting off topic but... wouldn't it be a good idea to move the "stickied" posts to the "Top Tech Articles" section? Give the original poster or main contributor to the article rights to edit it and add new info -- that is if the software allows giving such rights to an individual member for a specific thread. 

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Frank Swygert


Posted By: BBO390
Date Posted: Apr/13/2013 at 12:09pm
Battery topper is a good idea for the price.


Posted By: Red1975pacer
Date Posted: Jul/28/2013 at 11:37am
I had a couple of these repo batteries in my 68 GTO. I picked them up in person from the company in TWinsburg Ohio. Let me tell you, these batteries are very problematic if allowed to discharge. Went through two in three years at 225 apiece. Its not the kind of battery that you can put in a car and just forget about . PROPER maintainance is a must


Posted By: 401MATCOUPE
Date Posted: Sep/15/2013 at 5:56pm
They (ANTIQUE AUTO BATTERY) have recently changed the internals to maintenance free, no more adding acid.  I bought one for my Studebaker Avanti and it has a Optima inside....not sure if that is the way with the "new" AMC battery, but I just ordered one for a customer car and came the other day..aven't had time to investigate what is inside.  Either way, they should last a lot longer.

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Ross K. Peterson
68X,GoPac,343,AT,52A(1stCar)
68X,GoPac,390,4sp,52A
69X,GoPac,390,4sp,64A
70X,GoPac,390,4sp,87A,8
70X,GoPac,390,4sp,BBO,8
70 Jav SST,390,AT,BSO
74MatX,401,AT,Prototype
74MatX,401,AT


Posted By: mramc
Date Posted: Sep/16/2013 at 6:12pm
That would be good. I've have 3 of there AMC batteries for my 69 Javelin now. Five year warranty and none lasted past 3 years even with a battery  tender on the last one. Never got a bit of adjustment from them. So, basically they were exactly like AMC factory batteries , 3 years and dead. Happy to hear they went to an optima inside the case . I hope the price did not go higher, as they were already very pricy as it was. LRDaum 

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LRDaum


Posted By: Vezzzzzzz
Date Posted: Jul/18/2014 at 7:16pm
Batteries Plus can get any battery that is in production.

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Jeffry


Posted By: 70BBO360
Date Posted: Aug/25/2014 at 8:27pm
Think they can even get an AMC clear power battery.


Posted By: Lyle
Date Posted: Apr/07/2015 at 2:41pm
I would be careful about the reproduction if it is a Optima AGM. AGM batteries are real good but they cannot take the heat of an older engine bay. Best installed in the trunk or in the case of some new vehicles, are placed were they are cooled.
I have found even the "maintenance free" batteries still need distilled water if you want them to last and a good 3 or 4 stage trickle charger at least monthly in storage or not.
I have batteries lasting 8 years. They will wear out through cycling and decay regardless but a flooded lead acid battery likes to be kept charged and the electrolyte to the proper level.


Posted By: rockwreck
Date Posted: Jun/08/2015 at 7:06am
I work in a restoration shop and we have found that Restoration Batteries is buying their batteries from Antique batteries, so you know.


Posted By: uncljohn
Date Posted: Jun/08/2015 at 9:19am
Optima batteries are not failure mode proof because they are sealed or any other configuration referred to as not needing water added. They are good, don't take it wrong but they do have a failure mode due to age.
Internal resistance will build up as a function of time.
A reading of the battery will indicate fully charged, but when a heavy load such as trying to start the car is placed on them, the voltage at the terminals will drop well below the expected minimum of 8 volts used as a diagnostic for a good battery. When that happens ignition systems have a tendency to not work and the car won't start. It will crank fairly well but there is not enough voltage to run an electronic ignition. And unless you are measuring battery voltage at the time the cranking takes place, the battery will look as if there is not problem.
This type of battery is used in many mobility scooters simply because it does not out gas as a medical concern and that is the typical failure mode. But in a mobility scooter, as a prime source for power it is placed in a high current environment normally. I have only seen it a couple of times in automobiles as it only checks bad while trying to start the car.

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70 390 5spd Donohue
74 Hornet In restoration
76 Hornet, 5.7L Mercury Marine Power
80 Fuel Injected I6 Spirit
74 232 I-6, 4bbl, 270HL Isky Cam


Posted By: iraceitall
Date Posted: Apr/21/2016 at 9:20pm
Does anyone still sell the repro covers? I have a brand new battery, thought this would be a nice touch. I don't see them on AMARKs site...

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74 Matador X, P-code 4bbl 360


Posted By: ramblinrev
Date Posted: Apr/21/2016 at 9:54pm
Nobody sells them new anymore. I'm thinking it was the licensing issue?

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74 Hornet Hatchback X twins (since 1977)
62 American Convertible (still worth the $50 I spent in 1973!) AMCRC #513, AMO #384
70 AMX 360 4-speed (since 1981)


Posted By: sidewinder
Date Posted: Apr/21/2016 at 10:15pm
Battery toppers are no longer available as stated above.....you basically have two choices here. Buy a basic black battery and add the battery top stickers sold by APD or Kennedy American maybe other vendors also.  Or buy a reproduction battery which probably wouldn't be any more correct than the stickers because I don't think they repop  a 74 style  battery.

Chuck Page
 

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Chuck Page ,AKA Sidewinder
1968 "BLACK CHERRY" Javelin
Previous owner of 2013 Heritage Cup winner 1970 BBO AMX




Posted By: Jezebel
Date Posted: Dec/30/2021 at 9:57am
Hi I'm looking for a factory original battery for my 1965 Rambler American 440 in Canada. Does anyone have any suggestions on where to look?


Posted By: rockwreck
Date Posted: May/31/2022 at 1:56pm
Just had one of those ‘gel-cel’ recasted batteries go tits up on me.
Tried both Restoration Battery, and also Antique Auto Battery, and they are both among the missing.
Only one I found that is doing a replacement gel-cel wrapped in an old skin is ‘Turbo Start Collector Series
Batteries’
  Jegs and Summit also sell them.


Posted By: Trader
Date Posted: May/31/2022 at 2:23pm
Have you tried these people:
https://weskcar.com/product/american-motors-clear-power-group-24-1965-70-battery-topper/" rel="nofollow - https://weskcar.com/product/american-motors-clear-power-group-24-1965-70-battery-topper/


Posted By: rockwreck
Date Posted: Jun/06/2022 at 5:00pm
Just got battery.
Beautifully built case.
They don’t do AMC batteries,
So I got a correct sized for AMX
high amperage cranking power.
Not correct, but in 68/69 who cared?
If it fit and worked…..



Posted By: mbwicz
Date Posted: Jan/13/2023 at 3:44pm
I ordered a battery from Kennedy in September. We will see how this holds up. I don’t have the expertise to know how correct it is. 

Mike



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1970 AMX, one step forward, one step back. Both steps cost time and money.


Posted By: CamJam
Date Posted: Jan/13/2023 at 4:02pm
My understanding is that they started phasing in the new logo on 1/1/70.  Since 1970 was a transition year I think you can get away with it on your '70 AMX.

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'73 Javelin 360 (current project)
'72 Baja Bronze Javelin SST
'69 Big Bad Orange AMX (2018 Teague Heritage Award) SOLD



Posted By: JGRANTAMX
Date Posted: Jan/13/2023 at 4:56pm
 I don't believe I have read exactly when the battery logo's changed I would think it takes time to clear out all the inventory in the supply chain. Below is a 60 AH battery that's supposed to be dated 12/71, and a 70 AH from 69 note that neither have red lettering on top. As far as correct I have read shows don't doc points for restoration batteries others might know more. The reviews I have read about restoration batteries were not good mostly don't last very long and the last generation were some type of smaller gel-cell battery. I have a few show ready batteries.










Posted By: rockwreck
Date Posted: Jan/13/2023 at 5:50pm
I had one of these a few years ago.
It did the job, no problem, the stick-on labels lost their ‘sticky’ after a while.
I think in the bigger picture, gelcel vs acid fill, gelcel is worth the investment.
Just trickle charge them in the off season and/or all the time.


Posted By: ramblinrev
Date Posted: Jan/13/2023 at 6:00pm
Jay, I'm wondering if your original batteries are missing a metal 'tag' by the one terminal (negative? I can't recall), that would have date code stamped on it?
Or, did that start a little later in the '70s?
I have an old battery stuffed away in the garage....I'll have to take a peek at it.
Nice that you have those! And, can you show us what you believe to be the date code?

Paul


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74 Hornet Hatchback X twins (since 1977)
62 American Convertible (still worth the $50 I spent in 1973!) AMCRC #513, AMO #384
70 AMX 360 4-speed (since 1981)


Posted By: JGRANTAMX
Date Posted: Jan/13/2023 at 6:57pm
Originally posted by ramblinrev ramblinrev wrote:

Jay, I'm wondering if your original batteries are missing a metal 'tag' by the one terminal (negative? I can't recall), that would have date code stamped on it?
Or, did that start a little later in the '70s?
I have an old battery stuffed away in the garage....I'll have to take a peek at it.
Nice that you have those! And, can you show us what you believe to be the date code?

Paul

 The two batteries and the reworked topper in the bottom picture are what I have the other two original batteries are pictures I believe were from here. The Weskcar topper was poor quality looks like it was 3D
printed, reworking it with body filler and textured paint saved it from the not going to use it pile.



Posted By: CamJam
Date Posted: Jan/13/2023 at 7:03pm
Originally posted by JGRANTAMX JGRANTAMX wrote:

The reviews I have read about restoration batteries were not good mostly don't last very long and the last generation were some type of smaller gel-cell battery. I have a few show ready batteries.


The last restoration battery I bought (not sure which of the two main "repop" battery suppliers I used) had a standard ETX-30 AGM motorcycle battery epoxied inside the case.  I ruined it due to a bad voltage regulator.  It took a lot of work to get the old battery out of their case, but once I did I put a new ETX-30 back in it for 1/3 the cost of buying another repop battery.  Those batteries were about 350 CCA, as I recall, which is really too small for a 390 cubic inch engine.  I live in Arizona, so it did work for me, but not sure in a cold climate if it would fare so well.  For comparison, the WalMart battery I just bought for my Ford Focus is 600 CCA.


-------------
'73 Javelin 360 (current project)
'72 Baja Bronze Javelin SST
'69 Big Bad Orange AMX (2018 Teague Heritage Award) SOLD




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