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SC/Rambler Restoration #8 Chronicle.

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Topic: SC/Rambler Restoration #8 Chronicle.
Posted By: amx39068
Subject: SC/Rambler Restoration #8 Chronicle.
Date Posted: Jun/15/2010 at 11:50pm

Thought I would start chronicling the latest SC/Rambler (#8) restoration project.  We picked up this car over the weekend of June 12/13 from Tim Klinefelter in San Diego who is a really good guy with a treasure trove of AMC parts and knowledge.  Although the car curently has a 290 2bbl engine Tim was able to pull together the numbers matching 390 setup that ensured this SC/Rambler will be bone stock original drivetrain like all the other SC/Ramblers I have restored. 

About as geeky looking as you can get.  Heading out from San Diego on the morning after loading the car the night before.
 
https://picasaweb.google.com/amx39068/June2010SCRambler8Trip?feat=directlink - https://picasaweb.google.com/amx39068/June2010SCRambler8Trip?feat=directlink


 
 
This car may be the best yet due to only having a very minor amount of rust, perfect rockers, floors and frame rails and amazingly good intior panel parts. Heck, it even came with its original and correct tach that works! 
 
The reason for its exceptional condiition is that it lived its entire life in the San Diego area and was litterally stuck in a storage garage for around 20 years since the late 80s or early 90s. Looking foward to start the tear down on this upcoming weekend.  We will get to work on it good and hard while the humpster is off getting its minor metal repair work done.
 
 
Original door tag
 
 
 
 
minor rear bumper pushed in area somewhere in its earlier years
 
 
 
 
 
 typical mouse motel
 
 
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/_I45Ga-WAhqI/TRTMy4Ylx8I/AAAAAAAAAYg/jj7jcJc9bm4/s640/recent%2012%2028%2009%20387.jpg">  
 
The real deal original decals from the factory and before the windshield molding was installed.
 
amazingly good decals for a 40+ year old car
 
pretty nasty trunk floor that obviously had some trunk seal leakage over the years
 
great headliner
 
 
 
 
 
 


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Dan Curtis-Owner and CEO AZ AMC Restorations; Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/amcmusclecars/ & Curtis Real Estate Development



Replies:
Posted By: ramblinrev
Date Posted: Jun/16/2010 at 9:15am
Sweet! My AMX shares a barn in the winter with a SC/Rambler that's been stored for probably 20 years and in need of restoration. I've tried to track down the owner, but haven't got enough to go on yet. 

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74 Hornet Hatchback X twins (since 1977)
62 American Convertible (still worth the $50 I spent in 1973!) AMCRC #513, AMO #384
70 AMX 360 4-speed (since 1981)


Posted By: amx39068
Date Posted: Jun/16/2010 at 10:03am

Ramblinrev,

If you can PM, me the VIN . I have contacts that can help track down the owner. 
 
I hate to see these great cars sit for years resulting in their deterioration like the one I just picked up this weekend.


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Dan Curtis-Owner and CEO AZ AMC Restorations; Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/amcmusclecars/ & Curtis Real Estate Development


Posted By: steeters
Date Posted: Jun/16/2010 at 12:30pm
Looks like a nice car Dan.  If it was in maybe 20% better condition I'd be tempted to encourage someone to just get it mechanically sorted and let it be.  But, it probably needs some correcting so that it doesn't get itself in more trouble.  But of course, it's not my car :) so I'll just enjoy following along.
Do you already have a buyer?
 
Steve


Posted By: amx39068
Date Posted: Jun/16/2010 at 12:39pm
Originally posted by steeters steeters wrote:

Looks like a nice car Dan.  If it was in maybe 20% better condition I'd be tempted to encourage someone to just get it mechanically sorted and let it be.  But, it probably needs some correcting so that it doesn't get itself in more trouble.  But of course, it's not my car :) so I'll just enjoy following along.
Do you already have a buyer?
 
Steve
 
Steve,
I don't usually have a buyer until the cars are well underway and these latest two are so nice to start with that I wouldn't mind keeping either when the time comes.  I am also planning to pull the engine on the Johnny Lightning SC/Rambler and refinish the engine bay before putting the engine Forest is building into it so I can go kick some serious butt and have some fun. 
 
 
The fun aside benefit is that I will aslo in the process shut up the racing crowd peanut gallery once and for all.  I do still want to do a chassis dyno pull on the Johnny Lighting car before I pull the engine so I can see what the mildly upgraded 390 puts down for power before putting in the killer engine.
  
 
 
I expect both of these latest SC/Rambler restorations to be every bit as good as anything I have done to date or even a tad better based on the excellent condition of the bodies from where we started...fun stuff!
 
BTW, I am pretty sure I was in your neighborhood last Friday evening when I got lost looking for a hotel to stay.  We endeup up staying in the rathole Motel 6 right next to the I-5 freeway halfway between UC Davis and Scramento but before we backtracked to the hotel we ended up in a neighborhood that looked very much like yours!


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Dan Curtis-Owner and CEO AZ AMC Restorations; Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/amcmusclecars/ & Curtis Real Estate Development


Posted By: TorqueyAMX
Date Posted: Jun/16/2010 at 5:39pm
Originally posted by amx39068 amx39068 wrote:

  
The fun aside benefit is that I will aslo in the process shut up the racing crowd peanut gallery once and for all.  I do still want to do a chassis dyno pull on the Johnny Lighting car before I pull the engine so I can see what the mildly upgraded 390 puts down for power before putting in the killer engine.
 
 
Chassis Dyno??? Chassis Dyno???  What's a Chassis Dyno?LOL
 
Tell me it's true!
 
"Peanuts Here! Get yer Peanuts Here"! "Bag 'O Nuts Here"!LOL


Posted By: amx39068
Date Posted: Jun/16/2010 at 8:09pm
Originally posted by TorqueyAMX TorqueyAMX wrote:

Chassis Dyno??? Chassis Dyno???  What's a Chassis Dyno?LOL
 
Tell me it's true!
 
"Peanuts Here! Get yer Peanuts Here"! "Bag 'O Nuts Here"!LOL
 
Yep, almost there.  I am not home much these days and we have all these new projects getting underway so there isn't much time available to work on my own cars as evidenced by my dark green 68 AMX just only having been started for the first time two weekends ago but not touched since. 
 
This working for living thing really takes time away from my hobbies!UnhappyUnhappyUnhappy


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Dan Curtis-Owner and CEO AZ AMC Restorations; Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/amcmusclecars/ & Curtis Real Estate Development


Posted By: raysinvegas
Date Posted: Jun/16/2010 at 8:30pm
Hey Dan, I noticed that the sunvisors on this SC are white. My understanding is that they were charcoal. Whats your experience? Confused

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Andy Ray
64 440H
64 440 Convertible
68 Javelin SST 343
69 Javelin SST 343
69 SC/Rambler


Posted By: Blue Stinger
Date Posted: Jun/16/2010 at 8:41pm
I was reading the Hemmings.com blog the other day and there was a post dated June 7th about a bunch of restorable and parts cars in Woodstock, CT.  Two cars that looked very restorable were an SC/Rambler and a Rebel Machine.  Woodstock, CT is not exactly around the corner from Phoenix but it might be worth looking in to especially if it means saving these two cars.

-------------
Mark Ogulnick
Boulder City, NV
'71 Hornet SC 360


Posted By: amx39068
Date Posted: Jun/16/2010 at 8:49pm
Originally posted by raysinvegas raysinvegas wrote:

Hey Dan, I noticed that the sunvisors on this SC are white. My understanding is that they were charcoal. Whats your experience? Confused
 
Andy,
All the SC/Ramblers use white sun visors against the white headliner.  I suspect they'd look out of place if they were charcoal.  On the other hand, all the trim metal around both the front and back windshields are charcoal which blends very well with the windshield gaskets.


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Dan Curtis-Owner and CEO AZ AMC Restorations; Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/amcmusclecars/ & Curtis Real Estate Development


Posted By: amx39068
Date Posted: Jun/16/2010 at 8:52pm
Originally posted by Blue Stinger Blue Stinger wrote:

I was reading the Hemmings.com blog the other day and there was a post dated June 7th about a bunch of restorable and parts cars in Woodstock, CT.  Two cars that looked very restorable were an SC/Rambler and a Rebel Machine.  Woodstock, CT is not exactly around the corner from Phoenix but it might be worth looking in to especially if it means saving these two cars.
Mark,
 
I believe that is Wooten's Red Line Classic cars.  He grabs all the SC/Ramblers and unusual AMCs he can get and turns them over for a tidy profit.  I am headed to Hartford Sunday night for a meeting with one of the big insurance companies so maybe I can see if there is time to check it out and see if it who I think it is.
 
I am looking for a Machine chassis with a factory 4 speed setup so if anyone knows of one in decent shape I would be interested in hearing about it.


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Dan Curtis-Owner and CEO AZ AMC Restorations; Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/amcmusclecars/ & Curtis Real Estate Development


Posted By: pauly33
Date Posted: Jun/17/2010 at 1:25am
Far out! Are you keeping it after restoration or thinking of selling it?

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73 Javelin AMX 401 4 Spd
82 Jeep Wagoneer Limited


Posted By: amx39068
Date Posted: Jun/17/2010 at 1:43am

I have another one underway as well so at least one of them will be for sale for sure.

I also have the Johnny Lightning B scheme referenced a few posts back which might be for sale if either of the two restorations turn out to be too good to let go and I have one more crossram so I could possibly use it on either of the A schemes and sell the other one as a stocker and also sell the JL B scheme.  I only need and want one of these cars and will possibly keep the "Machine"/Rebel convertible I am putting together.


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Dan Curtis-Owner and CEO AZ AMC Restorations; Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/amcmusclecars/ & Curtis Real Estate Development


Posted By: SEdmonds
Date Posted: Jun/17/2010 at 10:10am
Glad to see you're staying busy down there - and out of trouble.
So...which of these beauties are you thinking of bringing to Flag in Sept????
 
 


Posted By: amx39068
Date Posted: Jun/17/2010 at 11:50am
Well I am keeping very busy but me staying out of trouble?  I don't think that is possible any more since the hounds started nipping at me heels and I decided to stop and turn around to kick them in the head.
 
I hope to bring the Johnny Lighting car and the Breedlove tribute up to your show.  Are you going to Mike Moonie's Blue Moon Saloon event in October in Sedona?  I may only be able to do one or the other depending on work schedules.  That is usually my time for a trip abroad.


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Dan Curtis-Owner and CEO AZ AMC Restorations; Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/amcmusclecars/ & Curtis Real Estate Development


Posted By: SEdmonds
Date Posted: Jun/18/2010 at 3:07pm
Not sure what October will bring.  It's possible the Rambler will be running, but at this rate, I doubt if it will be painted.  We are juggling a number of things right now.  Our engine guy is backed up and is losing his shop help, so that slows down the mechanical end of things.  He doesn't have room to store the car, so we'll trailer it to him, get the engine/tran put in, bring it home so we can finish the wiring, install the radiator, AC condensor, etc., then take it back so he can do his engine things, then bring it back to paint it.  The seats are at the upholsterers, we are installion ourselves, and if we don't get it painted this summer, it will be too cold to do it ourselves...so....
 
I don't know if I'll be in Sedona in October. (Long way around a short anwser).


Posted By: amx39068
Date Posted: Jul/01/2010 at 1:16pm

We started the tear down on SC/Rambler #8

Parts removal before the engine comes out...note the incorrect fan which you can get away with in the cool San Diego climate where the car came from.  Thansk goodness I have a mountain of spare parts!
 
 
Pulled out the incorrect 290.
 
 
Scary stuff
 
40+ years of dust and crud
 
One of the grundgy and greasiest engine bays I have seen on these cars.
 
The center tunnel had been cut out to allow space for the scatter shield and attached with what looked like fricken hinges and tack weld but you could still see light along where it was initially cut!  That definitely needs to be fixed properly. Note the original e-brake handle is still in tact. That is a rarity as well due to the offset angle of the pull handle putting too much stain on the plastic causing it to break it off.
 
 
 


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Dan Curtis-Owner and CEO AZ AMC Restorations; Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/amcmusclecars/ & Curtis Real Estate Development


Posted By: amx39068
Date Posted: Jul/10/2010 at 7:20pm

Took quite a few more pictures of SC/Rambler restoration #8 today to capture the "before" state of the car's body just before heading over to the metal guy.  Overall a pretty darn good and solid car. 

You can see that there was a litte rust or ding repair on the passenger's side of the trunk and end of the quarter.  One of my prior SC/Rambler restorations had issues in the exact same area so I guess the drain hole in the lip of the trunk didn't drain very well.
 
Here's a former patch panel that was done reasonably well but not well enough to keep so it will be replaced.
 
This area is wherer they all rot out and is where the rear window support brace was welded to the inside of the rear quarter from the factory.  Apparantly AMC neglected to treat the metal after they welded the two parts together and because it is right below the window fuzzies water would get on the untreated metal and eventually rot the quarter panel on both sides.
 
Other than a couple of dimples that you can't actually see in this pictures, the passenger's front fender is in excellent and never been damaged condition.
 
Although the front structure and engine bay look like heck, they are in otherwise exceptional and straigh (and again never been hit) condition.
 
 
excellent panel alignment on the driver's side.
 
Just starting to rot where the rear winow support brace is connected to the quarter on both sides.  They all rotted here and 8 our of 8 restoration have required repairs.
 
 
 
Incorrect repair work to the driver's side trunk will be fixed and aligned properly.  Right now the deck lid sticks out too far beyond the edge of the quarter.
 
exceptionally nice floors and rockers.  You hardly ever find one of these cars in original condition like this one was with good floors and rockers.  99% of these carss rotted on the lower left front corner of the drivers floor pan right below the windshield squirter foot pump leading me to believe that they must have leaked.  Also the inner rockers are almost alway bad particularly in damp climate regions.
 
 
another view of the center hump cluster @#$%
 
 


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Dan Curtis-Owner and CEO AZ AMC Restorations; Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/amcmusclecars/ & Curtis Real Estate Development


Posted By: amcrules00
Date Posted: Jul/10/2010 at 7:55pm
Awesome beforehand documentation Dan, usually an afterthougt for most. Approve Usually it's the part that is missed the most...after the fact.


Posted By: amx39068
Date Posted: Jul/10/2010 at 11:08pm
Someone else is going to own at least one, if not both, of those SC/Ramblers as I only need and want one of them and I already have the B scheme with the A Scheme decals layout as my personal car so it's always best to fully document everything from the start. Obviously a car that is solid to start off with will be far more interesting to a potential buyer than a former rust bucket so before and after pictures are always good.
 


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Dan Curtis-Owner and CEO AZ AMC Restorations; Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/amcmusclecars/ & Curtis Real Estate Development


Posted By: fast401
Date Posted: Jul/16/2010 at 9:23pm
Looks like a really solid car to me.  We can only dream of finding cars like yours in North West Ohio.

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Disturbing the peace since 1970!!!   AMX 19245
Facebook page - AMC Nation
www.fast-401.4t.com


Posted By: amx39068
Date Posted: Jul/17/2010 at 10:25am
Here are some of the latest pictures of the minor metal work that is being done to the car.  The two areas that needed a fair amount of work were the lower rear trunk floor which must have held water due to the rear deck lid having a dingleberry and some rot in it with only a fair repair job with a poor final fitment done.  All else was the normal AMC areas that rot like the lower quarters due to the car living in the salty air in San Diego.
 
Driver's lower quarter before
 
 
During repair
 
Finished repair.
 
Hard to see but some lacey area in trunk floor right where it meet the rear tail light panel rise.
 
Bad area cut out shown from underneath
 
shown from inside the trunk
 
new hand fabricated repair piece
 
welded in and ground down for perfect fit underneath view
 
Inside the trunk view
 
Tranny hump area that was hacked out with what looks like an air chisel to raise clearnace for the scatter shield bell housing.
 
The removed hump.  When finished it will look perfect from underneath with a thin layer of reinforcement around the welded area under the carpet to ensure that the welds do no break.  This was the only bonehead thing done to the car which is a minor miracle considering it was a former racer. 
 
The "door hinge" looking brackets removed and extra metal lap band added to recreate the center humps original strenght.  Additional weld was added on both sides of the band after it was installed.
 
 
 
This is the area in front of the rear wheels where all SC/Ramblers rot due to metal against metal that is not treated correctly and due to being directly below the rear window sweep where water runs down the inner brace and settles on the pocket where the metal to metal contact exists.
 
The outer quarter panel metal was removed and the inner metal from the rear window brace was blasted and then doused in POR rust preventer and then sealed with water proof primer so it will never be a problem again.
 
 
Previous passenger's rear quarter lower patch panel to be removed. Uneven lines on the old panel and the fact that the weld bead is still clearly visible and how the seams are not as flush as they should be as well as the old patch was installed over bad metal.
 
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/_I45Ga-WAhqI/TRTNV_2lXnI/AAAAAAAAAaM/ZCBV9vBDNZg/1.jpg -  
 
 
Setting up the quarter to build a fiberglass hammer bolt that will be used to hand shape the patch
panel 
 
 
 
 
Next batch of pictures will show the correct way to do the patch panel so that is is darn near perfect.
 


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Dan Curtis-Owner and CEO AZ AMC Restorations; Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/amcmusclecars/ & Curtis Real Estate Development


Posted By: amx39068
Date Posted: Jul/20/2010 at 9:32pm
The latest pictures - you just never know what evil lurks behind someone else's patch panel!
 
 
 
Old inner and outer metal trimmed out (sorry for the small pictures, the bigger version is gone from MS pictures
 
New innner panel installed and then Covered with POR
 
   
 
New metal held in place and ready for welding
 
 
 
Note we welded the new piece in place low enough so that the factory and telltale rolled SC/Rambler wheel opening lip is retained
 
 
 
Looking better already!
 
 


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Dan Curtis-Owner and CEO AZ AMC Restorations; Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/amcmusclecars/ & Curtis Real Estate Development


Posted By: amx39068
Date Posted: Jul/24/2010 at 7:12am
pictures lost when changing account name


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Dan Curtis-Owner and CEO AZ AMC Restorations; Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/amcmusclecars/ & Curtis Real Estate Development


Posted By: amx39068
Date Posted: Jul/25/2010 at 7:20pm
A lucky break is the area below the battery tray only had minor etching which is a real plus.  The tray is junk but the brakets and frame rail and panel area below the tray were in excellent condition.  These are the places that you don't normally think about when buying a car that can be a major PITA if rotted away
 
As mentioned in the humpster chronicle thread, restorations are extremely expensive and actually more expensive on an AMC than on the big three due to the very limited availability of quality and useable AMC parts.  I stated on the other thread that it is very difficult to get a full restoration done for under $20K plus the price of the car but on this car that was a near rust free Southern California car, the restoration cost will end up being in the $25-$30K range plus the original purchase price of the car.  It add up very quickly.
 
I am considering keeping this restoration project for myself and putting a 450 - 500hp 390 engine in it and doing it up just like the Johnny Lightning B scheme SC/Rambler that I currently have only using Phoenix Graphics to make the B Scheme decals so if I or anyone else ever wants to revert the car back to its original A Scheme paint all that will need to be done is to remove the lower decals from the B scheme kit and paint the correct red on the sides.
 
Regardless, this car will more than likely get my last cross ram intake unless another collector contacts me and wants a pure stock restoration. Either way, this is a very fun hobby to be able to do and I feel blessed that I am fortunate enough to be able to do this stuff at this point in my life.


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Dan Curtis-Owner and CEO AZ AMC Restorations; Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/amcmusclecars/ & Curtis Real Estate Development


Posted By: amx39068
Date Posted: Jul/30/2010 at 12:26am
Got some really cool new work in progress pictures from the metal guy for the trunk deck lid that had previously been repaired.  This guy continues to amaze me in how he uses a mold to fit his hand formed pieces of metal to.  It cost a quite a bit more to repair than just getting a new deck lid but the lids are date coded so if we want the car to be date code accurate, fixing the original one is the only real option available.
 
original and badly done patches for both sides which distorted the deck lid's lower edge shape
 
 
 
Cut out the old and create new pieces to replace both end edges with
 
New piece welded in place and ground down now with original contour.  1000 times better than the old piece of trashy metal repair that was previously in there
 
 
 
 The inner back side of the outer corner of the driver's side of the deck lid needed to be recreated
 
This type of hand shaping a piece of metal is an incredibly difficult task and takes talent and experience that is way beyond anything that I would ever attempt to tackle myself on this type of high value car. Maybe someday but not today.
 
Old bad metal cut out and new hand shaped metal piece put in its place.  The outer edge of the deck lid will be reshaped to be realigned with the quarter panel end cap prior to any welding of the new piece of metal.  Pretty fascinating process from my perspective. 
 
 
 


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Dan Curtis-Owner and CEO AZ AMC Restorations; Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/amcmusclecars/ & Curtis Real Estate Development


Posted By: amcrules00
Date Posted: Jul/30/2010 at 5:29am
Pure artwork.


Posted By: 67RogueX-Code
Date Posted: Jul/30/2010 at 8:41am
Very nice work... I bet it's fun just watching this kind of talent.
 
But I do have to ask... wouldn't it have been easier to just cut out the date-code-stamping and weld it into the replacement lid?  Big smile


-------------
Bob Wilcox

67RogueX-Code


Posted By: amx39068
Date Posted: Jul/30/2010 at 8:47am
Unfortunately I only get to see the results of his work in the pictures he sends. I am mostly a road warrior in my current job and often only get to see the end result in person.

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Dan Curtis-Owner and CEO AZ AMC Restorations; Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/amcmusclecars/ & Curtis Real Estate Development


Posted By: AmeriMan
Date Posted: Jul/30/2010 at 10:25am
Beautiful repair work.

Regarding which car to keep, it's hard to argue with a car as (nearly) rust free as this one and I don't know the condition of the body on the B-scheme car but I've always preferred the look of the B-scheme cars.

Back in the early '80s a friend of mine had two B-scheme cars.  I was fortunate enough to get to drive both of them.  I've never had any more fun driving any other type of car.

It's a sad story but both of those cars ended up getting scrapped.

Here's a photo of one of them.  This was at the Chicago World Of Wheels show in 1980




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larue390@comcast.net


Posted By: amx39068
Date Posted: Jul/30/2010 at 5:15pm
Originally posted by 67RogueX-Code 67RogueX-Code wrote:

Very nice work... I bet it's fun just watching this kind of talent.
 
But I do have to ask... wouldn't it have been easier to just cut out the date-code-stamping and weld it into the replacement lid?  Big smile
 
Probably so although it would still be a 40 year old deck lid that would likely need some work so what the hell might as well just use the original lid and be done with it.


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Dan Curtis-Owner and CEO AZ AMC Restorations; Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/amcmusclecars/ & Curtis Real Estate Development


Posted By: amx39068
Date Posted: Jul/30/2010 at 11:44pm

Pictures moved to prior post which included trunk deck lid



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Dan Curtis-Owner and CEO AZ AMC Restorations; Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/amcmusclecars/ & Curtis Real Estate Development


Posted By: amx39068
Date Posted: Jul/31/2010 at 8:16pm
Pictures moved to earlier post in this thread.


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Dan Curtis-Owner and CEO AZ AMC Restorations; Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/amcmusclecars/ & Curtis Real Estate Development


Posted By: amx39068
Date Posted: Aug/04/2010 at 12:31pm
Look what we found!!!!
 
This is an incredible find and in amazing condition!  It was tucked up in an opening in the passenger's footwell.  Very cool!
 


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Dan Curtis-Owner and CEO AZ AMC Restorations; Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/amcmusclecars/ & Curtis Real Estate Development


Posted By: Rebel Vic
Date Posted: Aug/04/2010 at 12:38pm
What an awesome find, for such a rare car!!  I wish i had mine for my Rebel.......


Posted By: scrambler1000
Date Posted: Aug/04/2010 at 1:47pm
34 numbers away from my VIN.


Posted By: amx39068
Date Posted: Aug/04/2010 at 2:19pm
Originally posted by scrambler1000 scrambler1000 wrote:

34 numbers away from my VIN.
So that means they must have been seperated at birth!LOLLOLLOLLOL

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Dan Curtis-Owner and CEO AZ AMC Restorations; Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/amcmusclecars/ & Curtis Real Estate Development


Posted By: 17tamx
Date Posted: Aug/08/2010 at 1:53am
Very cool Dan! This car should be your keeper SC/Rambler. Maybe Matt will want his car back?

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Kirk P. Fletcher
70 AMX BBG w/Shadow 390 4sp
71 SC360 Wild Plum Ram Air 4sp
67 Rogue Convert 343 4sp
66 Rogue Hardtop 290 Auto
66 440 Convert 232 Auto


Posted By: amx39068
Date Posted: Aug/08/2010 at 4:46pm

Already spoke with Matt and he is really enjoying his motorcycle in the great AZ weather where you can ride nearly year round plus he is looking to get into a new location so the SC/Rambler is not in his future plans.  He had it for 10 years, made it into what it currently is along with driving the attention to SC/Ramblers to a new all time high plus he enjoyed the heck out of it during his stewardship. 

He's still the same old Matt and enjoying the heck out of life out here in the West so all is good but no new old SC/Rambler in his future.
 


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Dan Curtis-Owner and CEO AZ AMC Restorations; Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/amcmusclecars/ & Curtis Real Estate Development


Posted By: hurst390sc
Date Posted: Aug/08/2010 at 4:54pm
Hhmm, bout ready to send my A scheme out to arizona for resto.lol,,just not enough time in the day along with work to get anything done anymore.

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70'amx 390 4 spd.

69'sc rambler 390 4spd.



Posted By: amx39068
Date Posted: Aug/08/2010 at 10:21pm
Send it on out.  We will make it all nice and pretty and into a show winner like #3 that recently took best in show just outside of NYC at a major car show where people spent orders of magnitude more than the "little ol' Rambler" cost the new owner yet it still took first place.  
 
Pretty amusing that the ball buster contingent on the forums persist in telling me all the things that I allegedly do wrong on my restorations yet #3 still took best in show despite their imaginary faults.  I do all of thest cars to my personal standards and apparantly according to Muslce Car Enthusiast, which featured #4 and 5 in the June issue, and now #3 winnig best in show the way I do them is more than good enough!Thumbs Up


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Dan Curtis-Owner and CEO AZ AMC Restorations; Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/amcmusclecars/ & Curtis Real Estate Development


Posted By: amx39068
Date Posted: Aug/16/2010 at 11:43pm

Got some new pictures from today's work on the car.  Sorry for the smudge on the camera lens. I am betting it was a big old greasy finger print.

pretty scundgy under the hood and in the engine bay
 
 
 
The repaired center tunel piece that was cut out. It will be finished off with seam sealer to look back to factory original.  You just neer know what you are going to find was done to these older race cars before you got hold of them.
 
this car burned and leaked so much oil the entire underside was covered with sludge and the worst was on the tranny cross member where the sludge is caked on.
 
even the front end parts were covered in the glop from the very tired 390 that was a true fill the oil and check the gas engine that smoked like a detroit diesel going up a hill
  


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Dan Curtis-Owner and CEO AZ AMC Restorations; Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/amcmusclecars/ & Curtis Real Estate Development


Posted By: amx39068
Date Posted: Sep/01/2010 at 12:09am
Got some new pics of the tear down on SC/R #8 this time of the interior and pulling the dash to be refinished. 
 
The finish body work was completed this week and it will be sealer primered over the next couple of days and then blocked early next week.  Rick is pretty much working on this car and the Javelin AMX full time and both will hopefully get their final paint jobs started next week with the Javelin AMX going first.  It's been too darn hot in Phoenix to do the full body paint job and there has been plenty of other work to do so now that it is starting to cool down a bit both cars can be painted.  
 
 
Lower winshield frame area with zero rust.  Notice the paint on the doors.  These cars were painted white and you can see where the inteior trim color was painted over the original white paint overspray on the door using a quick template that was not even close to being precise.  To do a proper restoration, you need to recreate that look even though everything is hidden.
 
 
Driver's side cowl area.  Clean and rust free.
 
Passenger's side cowl area with just a smidgen of refinish work under where the windshield gasket goes.
 
Top driver's side area under windshield gasket.  Note just light surface rust which is how most southwestern and west coastal area cars are.  When I lived in the Northeast, even 10 year old cars were worse than this.
 
 
Dash removal after the windshield was popped out.  Pretty nasty under there.
 
Defroster duct and glove box liner.  Notice rust free floors and rockers.
 
 
scary snake pit.  This is a good example of how filthy everything gets when you strip and refinish a car.  Note the factory insulation.  Everything has to be hosed down and blown out before the car can be reassembled.
http://lh5.ggpht.com/_I45Ga-WAhqI/TT8QlA7ZGqI/AAAAAAAAB7E/cXhNrcZFsOc/s640/new%20javelin%20020.jpg">  
 
The windshield.  RIP.  It was already cracked so we did not make any attempts to try to save it.
 


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Dan Curtis-Owner and CEO AZ AMC Restorations; Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/amcmusclecars/ & Curtis Real Estate Development


Posted By: amx39068
Date Posted: Oct/07/2010 at 11:31pm
finally got around to asking the seller of this SC/Rambler if he had any pending or tentative deal going with anyone else as suggested by some of the more unsavory members of the forum for how and when I bought it who suggested that someone else was trying to buy it before me: 
 
 
Hey Dan, Good to here you are making progess. That Racingjunk ad netted me two or four inquiries only. One guy called from New york or Jersey but made no offers whatsoever, just questions. And I never heard back from any of them. This would explain why you have the car in your possesion, eh!! Tell the ba$tard that's spouting off about getting screwed to call me & settle his bit(hing with the "actual" guy he supposedly had a deal with or shut the heck up!!!
 
Tim



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Dan Curtis-Owner and CEO AZ AMC Restorations; Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/amcmusclecars/ & Curtis Real Estate Development


Posted By: amx39068
Date Posted: Jan/30/2011 at 10:31pm
finally got some new pictures of SC/Rambler #8 on its way to being done.  The humpster Jav/AMX will be hopefully coming to my garage next weekend for the final finishing touches and engine installation.
 
Here are some hot off the presses pictures of #8.  I will go back and reload the earlier pictures of its full restoration process that disappeared when I changed my Picasa ID to my AMX39068 ID.
 
I plan to do this car in the same B Scheme paint and A scheme graphics as the Johnny Lightning SC/Rambler and will hopefully be able to convince Phoenix Graphics to reproduce B Scheme lower body decals so future B Scheme restos do not need to have the lower color patterns painted on.
 
front and rear door jams with front fender removed:
 
 
floors after the removable center hump was welded back into place
 
 
Purdy looking trunk
 
 
undside of rear deck lid
 
engine bay


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Dan Curtis-Owner and CEO AZ AMC Restorations; Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/amcmusclecars/ & Curtis Real Estate Development


Posted By: amx39068
Date Posted: Feb/17/2011 at 7:50pm
Posted some hot new news int the Restoration section regarding B Scheme decal kits becoming available from Phoenix Graphics.....check it out!
 
http://theamcforum.com/forum/topic26825_post246818.html#246818 - http://theamcforum.com/forum/topic26825_post246818.html#246818


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Dan Curtis-Owner and CEO AZ AMC Restorations; Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/amcmusclecars/ & Curtis Real Estate Development


Posted By: amx39068
Date Posted: Feb/19/2011 at 10:20am
Seeing JJ's post of his beautiful B Scheme SC/Ramber inspired me to repopulate all the original pictures that were lost when I switched Picasa IDs.  I can only hope this car comes out remotely close to as nice as his.
 
Here is the link with all the pictures of the car from start to its current state.  The body has its first light coat of paint and I will get some new photos next weekend with a full body paint job.
 
https://picasaweb.google.com/amx39068/June2010SCRambler8Trip?feat=directlink - https://picasaweb.google.com/amx39068/June2010SCRambler8Trip?feat=directlink


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Dan Curtis-Owner and CEO AZ AMC Restorations; Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/amcmusclecars/ & Curtis Real Estate Development


Posted By: rickamx
Date Posted: Oct/03/2011 at 7:40pm
I've been doing the restoration work on Dan other SC/Rambler.  Here are some pictures from today getting it ready to bring to his shop to finish up
 


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1969 amx 390 4 speed. If you build it you should drive it!


Posted By: amxdreamer
Date Posted: Oct/03/2011 at 11:03pm
What part of the resto do you do Rick? Too bad Dan decided to paint over all the undercoating instead of stripping it all off and doing it right.

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Tony
Vancouver, BC
1970 AMX
1972 Badassador
AMO#10333


Posted By: rickamx
Date Posted: Oct/03/2011 at 11:27pm
I stripped off all of the under coat. Than painted the areas that you see and than sprayed under coat where it was originally applied by the factory or dealer. Dan is very particular about that. Dan's aim is to restore these cars correctly. And from the cars that I have seen that he has done he seems to be doing a great job.   

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1969 amx 390 4 speed. If you build it you should drive it!


Posted By: amxdreamer
Date Posted: Oct/03/2011 at 11:36pm
Um, I was born at night, not last night...
 
So Dan gets you to scrape off all the undercoating, paint it, reapply undercoating EXACTLY the same and then paint it white again? You did a great job of replicated the factory flaking as well.
 
Dan has told me before he doesn`t do the undersides of his cars. Too much time and money on a car he is just selling.


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Tony
Vancouver, BC
1970 AMX
1972 Badassador
AMO#10333


Posted By: rickamx
Date Posted: Oct/03/2011 at 11:44pm
Amxd do have any pics of cars you have restore?

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1969 amx 390 4 speed. If you build it you should drive it!


Posted By: 17tamx
Date Posted: Oct/03/2011 at 11:53pm
Hi Rick,
Yes, Tony does have pictures of his 70 AMX that he has restored. They are posted here in the members project section. The quality of Tony's work is Top Notch. I checked out his car 8/27/11 at the AMCRC show in Washington this summer.
 
The pictures you posted show the factory undercoating painted white while the factory had the uni-body painted white with the black undercoating over the top.
 
When I did my AMX I cleaned the factory undercoating and then used POR-15 over the top to seal the underside of the uni-body before installing my brake lines, fuel line, susp and other pieces.
 
Tony removed all of the factory undercoating, painted the underside of the uni-body and then used a tinted truck bed liner type of product to duplicate the factory undercoating.
 
Everyone has a little different take on the best way to do the bottom of these cars.


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Kirk P. Fletcher
70 AMX BBG w/Shadow 390 4sp
71 SC360 Wild Plum Ram Air 4sp
67 Rogue Convert 343 4sp
66 Rogue Hardtop 290 Auto
66 440 Convert 232 Auto


Posted By: amxdreamer
Date Posted: Oct/04/2011 at 12:00am
More than willing to proudly show off my ride...
 
 
This is the first and only car I have ever built.
 


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Tony
Vancouver, BC
1970 AMX
1972 Badassador
AMO#10333


Posted By: nda racer
Date Posted: Oct/04/2011 at 12:11am
I like this shot of under your hood too.
 
http://theamcforum.com/forum/70-amx-detail-questions_topic27764_page1.html - http://theamcforum.com/forum/70-amx-detail-questions_topic27764_page1.html
 
 


Posted By: rickamx
Date Posted: Oct/04/2011 at 12:11am
Are you one of these guys that goes around causing arguments and spreading negativity where it is not necessary. Why not spread good will by being positive. I used a product called rapter it is a bed liner that is sprayed on and can be painted. I will not continue this discussion  after this have a good night.

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1969 amx 390 4 speed. If you build it you should drive it!


Posted By: amxdreamer
Date Posted: Oct/04/2011 at 12:17am
You sound a lot like your friend Dan.
 
You come up with a story, oh like removing all the undercoating as that's what Dan wants...when you get questioned you go defensive, throw a jab, hide in the corner and go to bed. hmmmmmmm


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Tony
Vancouver, BC
1970 AMX
1972 Badassador
AMO#10333


Posted By: amxdreamer
Date Posted: Oct/04/2011 at 12:18am
Originally posted by rickamx rickamx wrote:

I stripped off all of the under coat. Than painted the areas that you see and than sprayed under coat where it was originally applied by the factory or dealer. Dan is very particular about that. Dan's aim is to restore these cars correctly. And from the cars that I have seen that he has done he seems to be doing a great job.   
 
That is what you typed isn't it?


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Tony
Vancouver, BC
1970 AMX
1972 Badassador
AMO#10333


Posted By: amxdreamer
Date Posted: Oct/04/2011 at 12:20am
Originally posted by rickamx rickamx wrote:

That is great work replicating where the bumper brackets were! Just tired of people spewing udder garbage and expecting people to believe it. To say this is a stripped and 100% restored car minimizes what others here have done. There are cars here like Colorado's that put mine to shame.

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Tony
Vancouver, BC
1970 AMX
1972 Badassador
AMO#10333


Posted By: amxdreamer
Date Posted: Oct/04/2011 at 12:24am
Originally posted by rickamx rickamx wrote:

Are you one of these guys that goes around causing arguments and spreading negativity where it is not necessary. Why not spread good will by being positive. I used a product called rapter it is a bed liner that is sprayed on and can be painted. I will not continue this discussion  after this have a good night.
What's funny is I am a VERY positive person and love the AMC hobby.

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Tony
Vancouver, BC
1970 AMX
1972 Badassador
AMO#10333


Posted By: amxmachine
Date Posted: Oct/04/2011 at 1:40am
Very impressed with the hurst restoration.


Posted By: stickshifter
Date Posted: Oct/04/2011 at 6:48am
It looks like there are quite a few new parts on the front suspension but the outer tie rod ends sure look suspect.

I think what dreamer was referring to is the undercoating that is on the outside of the front frame rail that is painted white.  I don't believe that is normal.  However, I fully understand why it wouldn't be stripped first, what a pain.  One more reason I never really tried to fully "restore" a car, too much tedious work.


Posted By: rickamx
Date Posted: Oct/04/2011 at 10:26am
Dreamer, I want to clarify. I stripped the under side of the car completely and sprayed new under coat between the frame rails. As for the wheel wells they were cleaned and painted over factory or dealer sprayed under coat. That is how Dan wanted it. As this gives the a car a very clean look. I do not want to argue about what is correct, as it is not for me to decide. I believe Dan does not want to over restore his cars. I for one think we should  applaud any one who makes the effort to restore a car that would otherwise go to the crusher. It is not my place to tell anyone how to restore their car.   



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1969 amx 390 4 speed. If you build it you should drive it!


Posted By: fast401
Date Posted: Oct/04/2011 at 10:28am
I agree!

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Disturbing the peace since 1970!!!   AMX 19245
Facebook page - AMC Nation
www.fast-401.4t.com


Posted By: 17tamx
Date Posted: Oct/04/2011 at 10:58am

I have spoken with Dan many times on his philosophy on restoring cars. Where damaged, or caked with lots of grease and dirt, like on this car, he strips the under coating down to the raw metal. Rick did remove most of the factory undercoating on the center transmission hump on this car because it was oil soaked and there was metal work and welding required at the firewall and trans tunnel. After the metal repairs were completed Rick then reapplied and painted over in chassis black inside the center hump. It is the way Dan wanted it to be done. On the other hand he rarely if ever removes the undercoating on the outer areas and wheel wells. It is so hard to duplicate the correct look of the factory undercoating and the products that we have to use are really not the same. The inside of the fenders are purposely not stripped.

 

By no means is this car in its final assembly process.

Dan emailed me and said the front end parts are just loosely installed and they are not tightened yet. Just the minimum parts were reinstalled in order to trailer the car from Rick’s house in Scottsdale to Dan’s shop in Peoria. Some parts like the tie rod ends haven’t been replaced yet and the lower A arms still need to be removed to install the new ball joints. You will also see the inner snubbers are not installed either. So the front end parts will be removed and old parts replaced once he has it up on his two post lift in the new shop he bought. Rick is now relocating all of his tools from his home garage to Dan’s shop where Rick will be working his business full time. I plan on having Rick do all my metal work and paint on my 67 Rogue convertible once I have the car completely stripped down and ready to go to the body shop.


Dan has his cars done the way he wants them to be done and likes the way they look without trying to over restored them. I think that we each do our cars a little different because we all have our own individual tastes. I would love to do my 67 Rogue convert the exact way the factory would have built a 343 4 spd 67 Rogue Convert but I don’t think that I will be able to get it 100% correct. I will try the best I can based on how much I can afford.

 

This weekend Dan agreed to buy my brother Mark's beautiful 69 BBO Javelin and will no doubt finish it the same way as his other cars.  The body and paint is already done. The interior is already done but the front suspension and under carriage still need to be done. To my brother this was a very good driver but not a full restoration. To Dan it is not good enough yet but it will be after he has Rick take care of the bottom of the car.

 

To each his own, it’s really all about money and time, and they are equal. Dan has been doing a lot of cars lately because he has the resources that allow him to take on so many projects. He does some of the work himself and he sublets a lot of the work out to others. You know how it is, if you pay someone else to do some of the work the quality my not be as high a quality as you would do yourself but on the other hand, things may be of a higher quality by having a professional do the work for you.

 

Bottom line is, if you don’t plan on keeping the car forever and you plan on selling the car so you can roll the money into the next project you have to look at the car’s ultimate value without emotions. Hours = $$$$ and he tries to make nice cars that can be sold at reasonable prices. He now has 9 cars underway or awaiting restoration and most of us would think that this is a good thing for our hobby.

 

We don’t need to pick apart the work that someone else is doing on their car just because it doesn’t meet our own personal standards. If everyone was equally good or bad in our abilities and skills all of our cars would look the same. No particular car would stand out from the rest.

Personally, I want a car that stands out from the rest, but my cars are keepers and I have some emotional attachments to most of my cars.



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Kirk P. Fletcher
70 AMX BBG w/Shadow 390 4sp
71 SC360 Wild Plum Ram Air 4sp
67 Rogue Convert 343 4sp
66 Rogue Hardtop 290 Auto
66 440 Convert 232 Auto


Posted By: stickshifter
Date Posted: Oct/04/2011 at 11:05am
Originally posted by rickamx rickamx wrote:

Dreamer, I want to clarify. I stripped the under side of the car completely and sprayed new under coat between the frame rails. As for the wheel wells they were cleaned and painted over factory or dealer sprayed under coat. That is how Dan wanted it. As this gives the a car a very clean look. I do not want to argue about what is correct, as it is not for me to decide. I believe Dan does not want to over restore his cars. I for one think we should  applaud any one who makes the effort to restore a car that would otherwise go to the crusher. It is not my place to tell anyone how to restore their car.   


I agree too.
And that was a much more informative answer, thank you.

I think it comes down to the terms used like "restoration".  How that is defined and presented seems to cause some issues.  Dreamers car is an awesome example of a completely restored car.  The scrambler appears to be more of a nicely rehabilitated car or somewhere in between.  Nothing wrong with either in my opinion.  But they are not done to the same level so they can't really be compared.


Posted By: amxdreamer
Date Posted: Oct/04/2011 at 11:58am
Kirk, I'm sure Dans cars look good as you have stated. I just commented that it was too bad the undercoat was painted over and not stripped and done right. The comments back about it being stripped and duplicated just got me going.

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Tony
Vancouver, BC
1970 AMX
1972 Badassador
AMO#10333


Posted By: amc67rogue
Date Posted: Oct/04/2011 at 12:16pm

whos to say what is restored correct and what is not.  I see radial tires, an exhaust crossover pipe, undercoating nowhere on the bottom of the car or strut rods, wrong steering wheel and other things that are wrong so is that green AMX poorly restored or just a restomod? who cares it is a really nice car no matter what you want to call it.

I see dans cars up on the liftsat his shop.  he paints them all over factory undercoating on the outside rails inside fenders and floor pans because he thinks it looks better.  he paints the tunnel and above the tank black if factory undcoating is good cause it look better than the junk available now. he likes urethane bushings over factory bushings too but most everything else is just like the way it came from AMC.  why do people always pick other peoples cars apart


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Keith Coggins 67Rogue X code


Posted By: amc67rogue
Date Posted: Oct/04/2011 at 12:19pm

is yours done wrong because undercoating is missing where it was from the factory?  Ask 10 people how to do it right and you will get 10 different answers



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Keith Coggins 67Rogue X code


Posted By: amxdreamer
Date Posted: Oct/04/2011 at 2:39pm
Originally posted by amc67rogue amc67rogue wrote:

whos to say what is restored correct and what is not.  I see radial tires, an exhaust crossover pipe, undercoating nowhere on the bottom of the car or strut rods, wrong steering wheel and other things that are wrong so is that green AMX poorly restored or just a restomod? who cares it is a really nice car no matter what you want to call it.

I see dans cars up on the liftsat his shop.  he paints them all over factory undercoating on the outside rails inside fenders and floor pans because he thinks it looks better.  he paints the tunnel and above the tank black if factory undcoating is good cause it look better than the junk available now. he likes urethane bushings over factory bushings too but most everything else is just like the way it came from AMC.  why do people always pick other peoples cars apart
 
Actually the trans tunnel, wheel wells etc on my car are undercoated as the factory did it on all AMX's (for road noise). From what I understood undercoating covers the floor pans. This is how my car came and how I documented and completed it. When funds allow it I will buy reproduction tires and get my rimblow restored, it's already on my plan.
 
Sorry if I came across the wrong way. I AM NOT SAYING THAT ALL CARS NEED TO BE DETAILED ON THE BOTTOM! Just don't call it a FULL restoration it's a restification or whatever people call it. A full restoration IN MY OPINION means that the entire car was taken apart and every part was restored and assembled again. When I see splash shields left in place and painted white etc. That's not a full resto, what's behind those splash shields, why not spend 20 bucks on new ones and install them so they are soft and fit well? When I see wiring and door pin switches painted or hood snubbers masked off instead of just removed for painting I call it what it is a NICE driver/local car show quality car. THERE IS NOTHING WRONG WITH THAT! When Dan builds a car he is building them to sell and has to cut some stuff out of the mix or he won't be able to get back his money. We all know that. I am not calling out Dan and his cars, he is actually getting AMC's back on the road that have sat for a long time. If it means the bottom has a 1/2" thick coat of undercoating it doesn't matter!
 
I took my car to 5 shows this summer, I wonder if anyone actually stopped to look under the car to see how it looked? People sure liked the top side though...maybe my next car will just get the top 5 sides done... :P
 
 


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Tony
Vancouver, BC
1970 AMX
1972 Badassador
AMO#10333


Posted By: amc67rogue
Date Posted: Oct/04/2011 at 5:00pm
they are all different cause they were done by hand.  your strut rods have no undercoating on them and all my rogues and americans had undercoating on the strut rod and strut rod washers so is yours wrong.  you have a later steering wheel so is your car a restification because you cut corners and used the wrong wheel.  the local rimblow guys in Phoenix only cost a couple of hundred to redo a wheel so why not do it right like Dan does with his cars that all get a new restored wheel.
 
because it doesn't matter.  you did your car your way and he does his cars his way.  why pick a part a car that is not close to finished without asking the person who is doing the car what he plans to do when finishing it. 


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Keith Coggins 67Rogue X code


Posted By: amxdreamer
Date Posted: Oct/04/2011 at 5:20pm

Thanks for the tip tips. Last time I checked they didn't make Rogues or Americans in 1970, maybe something changed. Looks to me like it was painted and bare steel...funny how someone has lots of pictures when they do a full restoration. Notice how there is no wiring, brakelines or masking tape? the suspension all came off after the media blaster stripped it to bare steel.

 
It's hard to talk to Dan, he's currently in time out. When he was here we discussed each others level of cars. He knows what I put into mine and understand the level he does on his cars. He builds his to sell I built mine to keep. It's good both ways, I commented after someone said they replicated the undercoating. I guess I took that as the wheel wells...you know the stuff in the pictures.
 
Dan, I'm sure you're reading this, sorry I cluttered up your thread. You build good cruiser cars.
 


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Tony
Vancouver, BC
1970 AMX
1972 Badassador
AMO#10333


Posted By: amc67rogue
Date Posted: Oct/04/2011 at 5:34pm
what does 1970 have to do with this.  it is about a SC/Rambler restoration
 


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Keith Coggins 67Rogue X code


Posted By: kirkwood
Date Posted: Oct/04/2011 at 6:20pm
because you said his 70 was wrong since your american had undercoating on the strut rods!

Regardless, is it really this difficult to understand Tony's point in all of this? Typically high level restored cars, stock or custom, don't have parts taped off or painted over undercoating. This Sc/rambler has pics of painted over undercoating and the restorer said he had scraped it all off. How do these things get so confusing?

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AMO Newsletter Editor


Posted By: amxdreamer
Date Posted: Oct/04/2011 at 7:00pm
Thanks Kirkwood...

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Tony
Vancouver, BC
1970 AMX
1972 Badassador
AMO#10333


Posted By: bigbad69
Date Posted: Oct/04/2011 at 7:55pm
If there's undercoating on suspension parts, it's because it was applied after the car was built. This was likely done by the dealer, an aftermarket shop, or a previous owner, not the factory.

Here is the factory sound deadening on my car. It was documented before the tub was stripped, then re-applied after paint. It may not be correct for all 69 Javelins, but it is pretty darn close on MY 69 Javelin. Can't see it in the picture, but there was no undercoating on the front rails.

The diff was also restored back to the way it was. I saw one in a B scheme SC/Rambler which looked almost identical after this was done.




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69 Javelin SST BBO 390 T10


Posted By: amxdreamer
Date Posted: Oct/04/2011 at 8:45pm
Looks great BigBad69 that looks like a very nice RESTORATION!

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Tony
Vancouver, BC
1970 AMX
1972 Badassador
AMO#10333


Posted By: amc67rogue
Date Posted: Oct/04/2011 at 9:19pm
sorry did not use punctation to make a ?. was just saying that many cars are done different even on the same line and who knows how different they were on another line so used the things on your car to show that even really nice restored cars are not always perfect. my cars have undercoating everywhere and yours does not so which one is right?  did the factory do it or the dealer? I was not there so we will never really know who did what.
 
but who really cares.  the owner of the car gets to do it the way he wants cause it is his car.  my question is why pick a part someone else's car without even asking him if he was going to replace the door light switches, tie rod ends or anything else.  if the people who buy the cars are happy with them or if he is happy with the ones he keeps why should anyone else care how its done unless they want to buy it.


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Keith Coggins 67Rogue X code


Posted By: bigbad69
Date Posted: Oct/04/2011 at 9:59pm
It doesn't matter what the owner wants to do with his (or her) car. What does matter is a statement rickamx made 3 pages back "...Dan is very particular about that. Dan's aim is to restore these cars correctly..." Dreamer picked up on this and pointed out what was not correct and a couple of people have been riding his a$$ about it ever since.

Many people read this forum, so passing off incorrect restorations as correct does a disservice to the community as a whole and helps spread bad information. Honestly, do the car whatever way makes you and/or Dan happy, but please do try to pass it off as a correct restoration when it isn't.

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69 Javelin SST BBO 390 T10


Posted By: amxdreamer
Date Posted: Oct/04/2011 at 10:33pm
Originally posted by bigbad69 bigbad69 wrote:

It doesn't matter what the owner wants to do with his (or her) car. What does matter is a statement rickamx made 3 pages back "...Dan is very particular about that. Dan's aim is to restore these cars correctly..." Dreamer picked up on this and pointed out what was not correct and a couple of people have been riding his a$$ about it ever since.

Many people read this forum, so passing off incorrect restorations as correct does a disservice to the community as a whole and helps spread bad information. Honestly, do the car whatever way makes you and/or Dan happy, but please do try to pass it off as a correct restoration when it isn't.
Amen!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Tony
Vancouver, BC
1970 AMX
1972 Badassador
AMO#10333


Posted By: 17tamx
Date Posted: Oct/04/2011 at 11:26pm
Keep in mind, just like there are different skill levels when building and restoring cars, there are also different skill levels in using a keyboard. Not everyone is equal in getting their thoughts across and many may be unable to really express their views in the tone they really mean.
 
As my brother Mark always says, "There is no breathalyzer attached the keyboard".


-------------
Kirk P. Fletcher
70 AMX BBG w/Shadow 390 4sp
71 SC360 Wild Plum Ram Air 4sp
67 Rogue Convert 343 4sp
66 Rogue Hardtop 290 Auto
66 440 Convert 232 Auto


Posted By: amc67rogue
Date Posted: Oct/05/2011 at 2:36am

show me where he said he was trying to do a perfect factory correct restoration. rick is not dan



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Keith Coggins 67Rogue X code


Posted By: bigbad69
Date Posted: Oct/05/2011 at 7:11am
Originally posted by amc67rogue amc67rogue wrote:

show me where he said he was trying to do a perfect factory correct restoration. rick is not dan



As I already said, it's on page 5 of this thread where it is claimed that this is a correct restoration:

Originally posted by rickamx rickamx wrote:

I stripped off all of the under coat. Than painted the areas that you see and than sprayed under coat where it was originally applied by the factory or dealer. Dan is very particular about that. Dan's aim is to restore these cars correctly. And from the cars that I have seen that he has done he seems to be doing a great job.   


Rick is not Dan, but he is apparently working on this car for Dan. It doesn't really matter who is who, as it is the statement in red above that I have the problem with. It is misleading, and somewhere, sombody will treat these pictures as gospel and do their car wrong.

Anyway, we're off topic. I would rather see more pictures of the SC/Rambler #8 project as it progresses. Just don't claim it's a correct restoration when it isn't.


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69 Javelin SST BBO 390 T10


Posted By: billd
Date Posted: Oct/05/2011 at 7:14am
Originally posted by bigbad69 bigbad69 wrote:

If there's undercoating on suspension parts, it's because it was applied after the car was built. This was likely done by the dealer, an aftermarket shop, or a previous owner, not the factory.

Here is the factory sound deadening on my car. It was documented before the tub was stripped, then re-applied after paint. It may not be correct for all 69 Javelins, but it is pretty darn close on MY 69 Javelin. Can't see it in the picture, but there was no undercoating on the front rails.

The diff was also restored back to the way it was. I saw one in a B scheme SC/Rambler which looked almost identical after this was done.




I know Steve_P has harped on this until his fingers were sore........ but there's differences in sound deadening like the factory used, and undercoating, factory or otherwise.

Also - although there were guidelines, since it was PEOPLE applying the stuff - either factory or dealer or otherwise, it's going to vary a bit, but the basics would be the same.
AMC had a technical service bulletin out about where the factory applied sound deadening - with diagrams, they were quite specific. Will it always be within a 1/2" on every car? I won't answer that - just think about it since it's not machine applied, just like the blackout behind the grill.......
(the TSB I found in my stuff showed 1971, I might have it for other years) Point is, AMC had a plan, it was specific about the sound deadening (which is not undercoating), HOWEVER, people applied it so expect it to be off an inch here and there, and vary slightly from car to car. bigbad dun good by documenting it for HIS car............bet some others vary just a bit, but still should fall within the factory templates published by AMC. He's got a nice example, I'd like to see it some day.

My car had undercoating, it's on the invoice.
Suspension parts such as the spring were coated, so much so that I was able to determine the original spring color and finish after removing the undercoating - it also covered the factory part number tags, so I knew what part number my springs were. The drive shaft was covered - preserving some of the paint marks on it. It was on the strut rods and nuts, and the plastic rings on the strut rods.

I'm going to chime in about not always TYPING what our brain knows. There's reasons for that that range from a bit of drink, to not enough sleep, to stress, to trying to go too fast, to the condition I suffer from.
I know it, I know it right. It's just that there's a disconnect between the information and knowledge that's in the back part of the brain, and the frontal area - the links don't work right. One can HAVE THE ABILITY or potential to be a straight A+ student with a perfect 4.0 GPA ABILITY, and still fail a class, or answer in such a way that others "don't get it".
Me, classic example. My math abilities are "superior" as some recent tests showed - and I barely made Cs in advanced algebra classes, and phat's calculations blow me away. It should be the other way around....... but some of us can't connect between what we know and the keyboard.
How about some slack now and then? We're all only human. It's cats that are gods. Folks make mistakes, or "speak out too quickly" or later change their minds, coming back and thinking to themselves" gee, they were right, guess I spoke too soon".

Very funny, kirk - good thing there isn't, a lot of folks here might be arrested for drunk typing. Do we have a forum limit on blood alcohol content while typing? MM - wanna add that?

For undercoating vs sound deadening vs what the factory did vs dealers, etc. - see Steve_P's old posts on the topic. I can't sort it correctly to get it to my fingers. I know what's right, just can't describe it well here. He already did, so I needn't try.



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Posted By: kirkwood
Date Posted: Oct/05/2011 at 9:49am
http://theamcforum.com/forum/1968-amx-under-body_topic2927_post23991.html?KW=sound+deadening#23991

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AMO Newsletter Editor


Posted By: gtoman_us
Date Posted: Oct/05/2011 at 9:58am
So now we have folks arguing over a black tar rubbery undercoating compound applied by probably a first day new hire at the factory because the job was bottom on the seniority stack?
 
Oh and if anyone wants to know on my 64 Ambo from the factory had some painted body color undercoating.  Since we owned from new and we know the history I assume it might have had to go back thru the line for some repaint issues.  How many times did an SC have to go back thru the line?
 
I really glad I favor wagons cause guess what?  Nobody cares. 
 
Hopefully we can see more #8 pics on the progress.
 
Cheers


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Moderator - Emeritus

Used to collect trophies, now I collect gas receipts and put on miles

1964 Rambler Ambassador Cross Country Wagon
1965 GTO
1931 Model A original survivor
"Flat Roofs are Cool"


Posted By: amxdreamer
Date Posted: Oct/05/2011 at 11:58am
I can't imagine a car going back through the line, I'm not saying it didn't happen as I wasn't there, I just have a hard time imagining it. Maybe it went to a bodyshop after delivery due to repairs?
 
I'm not arguing about how or where it was applied, just that when someone states that the cars are done "right" and are fully restored to a very high standard and they clearly show incorrect things or not quite top end work it lowers the bar for what people expect as being correct. One of the reasons the top cars from other manufacturers are worth as much as they are is the restorations are taken to the next level (in this case a few levels above). If the owner of a $350,000 Shelby or a $2,000,000 Hemi car looked at this SC do you really think he would pay big money to get it into his collection? Not likely, when I hear the term "collector quality restorations" it had better be stripped to bare steel and every part restored. If not, in my opinion, all your selling are used cars.
 
Why do you think the Trans-Am Javelin sold for record money? Sure the name went with it and it's racing pedigree but the restoration was also very good.
 
Remember, there is a big difference between "collector quality restorations" and used cars.


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Tony
Vancouver, BC
1970 AMX
1972 Badassador
AMO#10333


Posted By: billd
Date Posted: Oct/05/2011 at 12:02pm
Mine is most definitely in the "used car" class. Not even a "restoration".

Thanks, kirkwood - stuff happens when I try to do too much at once.
I know Steve was very specific (and very correct) and I dind't want us falling into "undercoating vs sound deadener" debate when the answers are already there, and even documented by AMC themselves. Maybe it wasn't going to - but my eyes saw us on the edge.

For repaints - not going to comment on that car, or AMCs, or whatever, but in OTHER industries, things did happen if the inspector rejected something - my father having been a chief inspector for a number of years in a factory. What's that got to do with this? Probably nothing, but hey, it's my lunch break.


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Posted By: 67RogueX-Code
Date Posted: Oct/05/2011 at 12:03pm
...you keep repeating yourself...  we get your point, time to move on.

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Bob Wilcox

67RogueX-Code


Posted By: 17tamx
Date Posted: Oct/05/2011 at 3:28pm

This was an e-mail Dan Curtis sent to me today.

Details moved to the thread about Dan's shop. 2/29/12 5:54 pm AZ time.


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Kirk P. Fletcher
70 AMX BBG w/Shadow 390 4sp
71 SC360 Wild Plum Ram Air 4sp
67 Rogue Convert 343 4sp
66 Rogue Hardtop 290 Auto
66 440 Convert 232 Auto


Posted By: 68BlazerBlue
Date Posted: Oct/05/2011 at 4:29pm

WOW!!



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1968 Blazer Blue AMX, 390,4-spd. 1971 Javelin SST 360 Auto


Posted By: amxdreamer
Date Posted: Oct/05/2011 at 4:55pm
Well it was a long response...then again we all expect that from Dan! LOL
 
 


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Tony
Vancouver, BC
1970 AMX
1972 Badassador
AMO#10333


Posted By: Wildfire
Date Posted: Feb/26/2012 at 6:43pm
Speechless


Posted By: 17tamx
Date Posted: Feb/26/2012 at 8:02pm
Wow, five months hibernating over winter and it just now sprouted wings.
 
Time for some more pictures of Number 8.


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Kirk P. Fletcher
70 AMX BBG w/Shadow 390 4sp
71 SC360 Wild Plum Ram Air 4sp
67 Rogue Convert 343 4sp
66 Rogue Hardtop 290 Auto
66 440 Convert 232 Auto


Posted By: amx39068
Date Posted: Feb/26/2012 at 8:42pm
Been awhile since an update on this car. We have been doing lots of finishing touches on the paint and interior painted parts plus reassembling interior things like the windows but only as filler in between other restorations that have a more pressing timeline.

Will get some new pictures over the next week or two when the interior is done and installed and when the new Phoenix Graphics B Scheme decals are put on the car.

The engine and tranny are done as are the rear suspension, brake and fuel lines but have not intalled the new front end parts yet like ball joints or tie rod ends and still need to correctly refinish the front fender to body seals.   

The exterior paint has been wet sanded, cut and buffing is nearly completed. Upholstery is all redone and the engine is built with modified TRW forged flat tops for a stock 16cc dish including the remainder of the original flat top valve reliefs to retain a "flat top" style quench. The rotating assembly is fully balanced and the heads are port matched. Will most likely be using a NOS Crane "306" cam which will give it that great old school sound and lots extra power up to 6500 RMP.

Intake will most likely be an R4B or AirGap and the carb will be a new Holley 750 DP. For street engines, I mostly use the easy and straight forward Mallory Unilite self contained dizzy and will probably do the same with this car. Will also probably do set of headers over log manifolds if the square port headers are still available (haven't bought a set in nearly two years so not sure on that one).

Still need to finish off the underside paint to be the way I like it with body color paint up to the bottom of the frame rails with chassis black in between the rails on the center tunnel.

Should be a really nice car when done over the next couple of months.

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Dan Curtis-Owner and CEO AZ AMC Restorations; Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/amcmusclecars/ & Curtis Real Estate Development


Posted By: amcgilly
Date Posted: Mar/04/2012 at 3:38pm
Can't wait to see some new pics on this resto. Keep up the great work.



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