Mike

I have a Legend Gear SS700 in my Rambler.  It uses the stock flywheel and pressure plate.  You do need a 26 spline pressure plate (GM).  It requires a QuickTime bellhousing and uses a GM throwout arm and throwout bearing, but the rest of the AMC clutch linkage still works.  The shifter position is the same side/side and about 1" more to the rear than the T-10.  I was able to adjust the shifter cover enough to make things work.  I did have to modify the Rambler crossmember quite a bit, but a AMX/Jav crossmember might work.  The nice thing about it is it's tall and narrow, so it fits in the factory trans tunnel with no mods.

I've heard a Ford T-5 will fit using a Jeep shallow bellhousing and some mods to the throwout bearing retainer.  You would have to modify at least the shifter position, and possibly widen the trans tunnel to tit the very boxy trans.

Bob

tufcj

The speedo cable should work fine though, and you could use your stock pedals and z-bar, with maybe minor mods to the rod from the z-bar to throwout arm.

Probably have to fab a little for the mount at the crossmember. 

T56 is probably going to be easier to source from a junkyard than the TKO, but then you need a fancy bell housing.

As far as I can tell the Tremec 150-T 3 speeds and T176 4 speeds were Ford pattern, and the 150-T was the short bellhousing. I think it was reasonably common through the 70's into the early 80's. I have easily picked up bellhousing that fit in junk yards, but not sure exactly from what; one was a 304 engine/tranny sitting there. I do believe the later short bell housings were drilled with both patterns, the Ford and the BW SR4/T4/T5, or at least have the casting provision so you can drill and thread the holes yourself.

Maybe I’ll just look around for a low first T10... I can live without an overdrive but I’d really like a lower first gear..

You can use the GM version with the new Quicktime bellhousing and adapt clutch linkage, or the Ford version if you have the factory bellhousing and linkage.

Bandana, what engine do you have, & how do you intend to drive it??

A T5 swap can be done for a reasonable price, & will hold up, unless you have a modified engine, sticky tires, & will be racing it weekly. The nice thing about the T5 swap is so much of the existing 4 speed parts can be retained; driveshaft, clutch linkage, speedo cable, transmission crossmember.

If you use a new T5 Z you could probably get the swap done for $2500-2750. Use a rebuilt T5 & save $500 or more.

I did a T5 Z swap in my 70 Rebel 10 years ago & love it. Best modification I have ever done to a car. Do it, you'll love it.

I can tell you that a Ford Tremec TKO 3550 is too long for a Quiktime bell. We had to switch directions and we are now going with a TKO 500. I'll be posting the trans for sale. It will be in S. Oregon late next week

445 HP & 450 Ft LB may be asking a lot of a T5 Z. But, it depends on how you drive (like an old man), how sticky your tires are, & how well you can handle a manual transmission. And an AMX isn't 5000 pounds. Normal driving around, with the occasional run thru the gears, I think it might hold up. For the price of one of the SST Tremec's, you could buy 2 T5 Z's & have one as a spare.

Here's how I price it out, you could get a rebuilt T5 with the T5 Z parts for less. Or get a stronger G Force T5 for more.

New T5 Z $2000

AMC "short" bellhousing $125

Front bearing retainer, or machine existing one $50

Ford T5 transmission yoke $50

Conversion U joint to connect yoke to T10 drive shaft $25

Ford style trans mount $20

Synthetic ATF $30

Shifter handle $10-100, depends on your taste

Pilot bearing PB76-HD $10

Clutch $200-500 depending on what you feel you need. With your power level I'd spend more $$ on the clutch, don't cheap out. You may be able to get by with just a new disc.

With some careful shopping you can probably find some parts for less than in my price list.

A new T5 Z comes with a new generic shifter. Mine worked fine, but I did upgrade it to a Hurst Billet Plus shifter when I got a great deal on one. I've gone thru a lot of handles, balls, & boots to get the look & feel I want. I find them at swap meets & sell what I don't like on eBay & come out ahead.

I used an automatic console in my car with the T5, it finished things off well. 68-70 consoles are plentiful at the AMC swap meets & can be had for not much $$ if you decide to go that route.

When I did my swap, getting overdrive was my goal. But, after doing it, & driving it for 10+ years, the low 2.95 first gear is just as nice as the OD. There are lots of hills where I live, & the low first make the car so much nicer to drive.

T5Z: 330 ft-lb

TKO-500: 500 ft-lb

TKO-600: 600 ft-lb

The difference in the 500 and 600 is the low gear ratio. The 500 has 3.27:1 and the 600 has 2.87:1.

The T5Z has 2.95:1 as scott mentioned which is part of the reason it's stronger than the standard Ford version WC T5 with 3.35:1 first.

I got my new T5 Z from Summit. At the time they matched the best price I could find, & shipped it for free. Summit currently lists two T5 Z, one thru Ford Motorsports, the other American Drivetrain. From what I see, they are the same transmission, but the American Drivetrain is $100 less. Summit currently has a $100 off deal if you buy online & spend $1200 or more.

I sourced a used bellhousing. The trans mount & yoke I got new.

LGT 700 looks like 700 ft/lbs torque. Wide ratio version has a 2.97 first gear, so it should be workable.

http://www.5speeds.com/legend/LGT-Brochure.pdf" rel="nofollow - https://www.5speeds.com/legend/LGT-Brochure.pdf

The only site I found mentioning a price said "$3500-5000". That's a big range! I suspect the $5K is for a full kit with clutch and bell housing, $3500 trans only.

Here's a good break-down of available five speeds, and where I got the pricing on the LGT 700. It's dated April 2016 though...

http://www.powerperformancenews.com/tech/the-world-in-5/" rel="nofollow - https://www.powerperformancenews.com/tech/the-world-in-5/

Steel flywheel?

Scattersheild?

Matching blockplate?

What clutch?

What clutch linkage?

High rpm shifting upgrade?

What input shaft?

What yolk?

Upgraded driveshaft?

What shift lever?

Just cruising most of this stuff can be basic or use stock.

I went with a proper scattershield and matching blockplate, steel flywheel, Liberty shifting upgrade, Mcleod "Street Extreme" 10.95" clutch, short Ford input, 1330 yolk, then went to a complete new 3" driveshaft with a 1350 billet rear axle yoke, and a short shift lever. But this car has decent power on goes to the track on occasion.

No wonder there can be a range in price.

I have the T5 with the G-Force case and other upgrades. I have had it for several years and I autocross a few times each year in addition to driving like a hooligan way too often.

There may be other options available now that were not out there when I purchased this, but I'm happy with it and it's not failed. It's sits between my mild 401 and the Moser 9, so truth be told this is the weak link in my drive-line, and it's working so far

If this does fail, I'll probably go with the legend gear LGT-700. had that been available when I upgraded I may have gone that direction. If I recall the LGT-700 is a bit pricey, but my G-Force stuff wasn't cheap either.

The T5 transmissions are compact and fit easily into these old cars which is a major positive.

The G-Force Case and internals are stout pieces.

I don't recall the details, other than it's a 10.5" diaphragm clutch.

The only trick is that the clutch plate needed to match the spline count of the G-Force T5 input shaft.

Stock Z-Bar and a Jeep Bellhousing, and stock clutch pedal assembly.

The Richmond Super T10 comes in a Chevy bolt pattern. You'll need a $1000 Quicktime bellhousing, clutch & pressure plate, rear yoke, possibly a new driveshaft, shifter, & custom speedometer cable. So, basically, everything is different.

If you want a lower first gear T10, you'd be better off shopping for an AMC T10 with the 2.64 first gear ratio. They can be hard to find, but they are out there.

Seems Keisler is no longer... bankrupt! But they were bought out and a new company formed! http://www.hotrod.com/articles/silver-sport-transmissions-takes-over-keislers-assets/" rel="nofollow - https://www.hotrod.com/articles/silver-sport-transmissions-takes-over-keislers-assets/

I thought they made their own transmissions, but what they have listed now is a modified Tremec TKO and the components to fit it into a classic muscle car (including AMCs!). Apparently that's what they had from the beginning, not an original design trans, which some of their early literature seemed to make you think, at least to me.

I checked this out myself once. The AMC T-10 pattern looks like the narrow Ford T-10 pattern, but it is slightly different.

Bandana wrote: I was afraid of that...AMC T10s with the lower ratio seem about impossible to find. Any idea what years and models they came in?

I think they came in cars with the 290 engine.

Keisler is gone.  I was one of the lucky ones that got a trans.  The purchase price was supposed to include a driveshaft, which I never got.  I heard they left over 200 people hanging with a 50% deposit paid when they declared bankruptcy.  Their signature trans was the SS700,  It's still available through Legend Gear & Transmission (as the LGT-700), and sold through Jody's Transmissions (he has a login here).

Bob

tufcj

The factory lower ratio T10 generally came with smaller engines.  The more 1st gear, the lower the torque capacity.   If just a cruiser, it may be okay ... but so would be a T5.

I went with a T56 Magnum and sourced all the parts myself.  I saw no advantage to buying a kit.  A bit more work to figure things out, but lower cost, lower shipping cost (picked up transmission from local Tremec dealer as same price across NA) and I got the parts I wanted - not what someone else figured was good to put in a kit.

A Doug Nash / Richmond 5 speed is also worth consideration.  At one time they offered an AMC input shaft, but not now. 

Another option would be to send your T10 to a shop that specializes in race transmissions (G-Force, Libertys, S-K) and get them to fit the gear set you want - but may cost more than a T5.

Unless you find a good used transmission and associated parts, not a lot of low-cost options.

Hope this helps,RD

 

There was a member on here that did this swap years ago in his 71-74 Javelin and also said best thing he had done.

 

With help from Scott and other members I went with a Ford T5WC with the 2.95 first gear. I rebuilt it and upgraded a lot of parts inside being I was there so it would live behind the 360 in my 70 Javelin, car had a T10.

I used AMC parts (Jeep bell, fork & clutch assy.) a new rear yoke (Ford racing) and a new positive stop shifter. My drive shaft with new yoke & cross member turned 180* and a few washers with a new Ford mount and it bolts in.

 

It has been in for years, guessing coming close to 10 years but have not driven the car on the road, just moving it around (long time project) and I like the lower 2.95 first gear over the T10 and with the 3.54 rear gear should do pretty good when I get it on the road some day.

Dave ----

The Gear Vendors is long enough that fitting it in an AMX may be a problem. The driveshaft will be really short.

Again, here's a link to a 2.64 first gear T10 for sale: http://theamcforum.com/forum/package-four_topic101560.html" rel="nofollow - http://theamcforum.com/forum/package-four_topic101560.html

Nothing is free.  So come to that fact.  If you want cheap, no such thing. Leave it alone if you dont want to spend the money. 

Remember there are four other gears besides that overdrive fifth in a 5 speed.

The White70 is going to end up with a 2.73 axle ratio with the first gear in the 5 speed trans being  3.35.

I estimate it will be turning about 1800 to 2000 rpm in fourth doing 70 mph with the tire.

Fifth will be for very high speed.

With a 390 having roughly 425 to 450 hp, I see no issues getting the car rolling.

I know I know, I'm crazy but I'm going to try it anyway.

with a 3.31 gear, first gear is like super low granny gear in a truck. It tachs out about 30 mph....

That's the problem I had with 3.08 gears and my AW4 -- had to be going over 70 to use 4th gear. With your five speed it's worse because of the low first gear. In my case the lower rear axle (3.55) made it take off better because first gear is 2.80 (I have the 87-90 0.705 OD mode instead of the later 0.750 OD). The torque converter is pretty low stall, but does make up a bit for the higher gear. Still, I picked up 2 mpg on average -- mostly from better in-town performance, I think. Mustangs with the T-5 used 2.73 rear axles in the 5.0L V8/T5 models with a 3.35 first gear. A 2.95 first gear would be better, but then you'd lose torque capacity in the trans due to the smaller diameter first gear. This is part of the difference between a NWC and WC T-5 -- the lower first gear to add strength -- NWC is 2.95 first.

I really think a 3.31 axle would work better in my 63 Classic wagon, but it's not worth the money to change the gears for ~2 mpg. Takes a while to burn $600 in gas at 2 mpg... and I don't drive it enough any more, maybe 3K miles a year?