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Pierre Cardin Seat Cloth - Available! |
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REBEL X 
AMC Nut 
Joined: Nov/09/2015 Location: Winnipeg Canada Status: Offline Points: 385 |
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 Posted: Aug/12/2016 at 8:23am |
Hi Mark. I have done auto upholstery for over 45 years. I can tell you from experience that thee is no way to restore your original torn material easily and effectively. You can remove your seat cover(s), un-stitch the fabric from the cover(s), laminate the original fabric to a backing material then resew the seat cover(s). That will buy you some time but may not be worth the effort. You have to remember your fabric is over 40 years old. Cloth unlike metal does not last "forever". If the fabric is exposed to sun light it will fade and break down. The more sun exposure, the quicker the damage happens. That is why you see the top of some seats, especially the rear seat get brittle and tear apart while the bottom of the seats look fine. The other cause of damage is usage. That is why the driver's seat wears out and tears first unless the other seats are constantly exposed to the sun. Only a car like a museum vehicle that is not exposed to the sun or sat in very little will have seats that "look like new". On the amount of material require there is a specific repeat of the pattern on the material. You need to know the distance the pattern repeats to determine your needs. If SMS copy Brian's material and duplicates it in sheets then it will take one sheet for both front seats, one for the rear seat and one for the headliner. You need to order enough material so that you have a complete design pattern for your front seats then again for your rear seats. If the repeat is two yards then order two yards for the front, two yards for the back and two yards for the headliner. It is great news that SMS is considering making this material. It is very generous of Brian to lend his NOS material. By helping out the P.C. Javelin owners by offering his material to be copied he is possibly hurting his investment in this rare material. Hopefully the P.C. Javelin and other AMC owners will acknowledge Brian's kind gesture and support him in any way they can. He makes a lot of NOS and good used items available for sale
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67 Rebel SST 343 AT conv
68 Rebel 550 232 AT conv 68 Rebel 550 232 AT conv 68 Rebel SST 343 4 SP conv 68 Rebel SST 401 727 HT 70 Rebel SST 360 AT Wgn 70 Rebel SST 304 AT HT 70 Rebel Machine 390 AT |
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billd
Moderator Group 
Forum Administrator Joined: Jun/27/2007 Location: Iowa Status: Offline Points: 30894 |
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Posted: Aug/12/2016 at 11:46pm |
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There is a reason when we owned the quilt shop that we had the store windows tinted with the darkest stuff they offered but that would still allow us to use the windows for display. Anything in the store front was there for a limited time.
At home my wife keeps her fabrics on shelves (for which I need to make more raised panel doors) until I get the rest of the doors made, she's got the shelving units (floor to ceiling along two walls of a large room) covered with fabric sort of like curtains across the front to prevent sunlight from reaching it. Ah, but wait - it's not just SUNLIGHT that can fade fabrics and otherwise ruin it - it's light from fluorescent lights as well - depending on the color and type of lighting. Yeah, we have her work area WELL LIT with several light fixtures in both her main sewing area (she took over the lower level family room) and the room her quilting machine and fabric shelving is in. She also keeps her threads all stored away from ALL light. (hundreds of spools, I hate to think of the thousands just in thread in those rooms) Cotton is subject to being ruined by acids in wood, certain plastics, and sunlight, etc. If you store fabrics on a wood shelf long-term, it will discolor and even eat at it. I say all that because depending on the seat material - even a car stored in a building can have seats and other interior materials ruined over time from the environment Light coming through a window, lights in the building and more. It's been a while, but I have bought things from Bryan and others who help the hobby by having enough foresight years ago to save parts, cars, and so on. It's like my wife says now when shopping for her stuff - yeah, she can buy online, but then when she really needs it, the local shops will be all gone and she'll no longer be able to go see and feel what she wants, or get direct customer support. My headliner is actually fine - at least fine enough I am not going to replace it - the seats SUCK and that's being KIND. Comfortable though, that car is VERY comfortable to sit in. Those seats are the most comfortable seats of any car I own now. Even more comfortable than my 2011 truck with all the fancy adjustments. I can sit in the 73 Javelin seats and not get a back ache or have my hips ache but all the others cause back or hip pain and aren't that pleasant, IMO, for long drives. I don't know what it is about them, but the 73 seats beat them all This is what someone did to the seat backs - why, I dunno, unless the seat release was rusted stuck and they did this to access it inside the seat. The interior apparently had set with water in it and things sort of got rusty and messed up.  Back seat -  You can likely see why I need my seats done, or want them done - pretty faded and filthy and stained, can't be cleaned or repaired. 
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mrblatzman
AMC Addicted
Joined: Oct/01/2008 Location: Alabama CSA Status: Offline Points: 2155 |
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Posted: Aug/13/2016 at 8:08am |
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Funny thing...There was a complete set of PC front and back seats in the booth next to us at Rockford...They had the typical fade and had some water spots, but no rips or tears...At the end of the show they finally sold for $50.00 for all of them....The cores and foam were worth more than that...
A interesting fact that has not been brought up....The original material was printed on continuous rolls....not in individual sheets...with a plain black area between the printed colored sections...If the repo material is printed on individual sheets that big black area will be compromised and there may not be a black area big enough available to do the job correctly...This could be a problem and needs to be looked into before people buy expensive material that will not do what is necessary to cover the required areas.... Bob Reno in Fort Payne Alabama |
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Thankyou....Bob
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REBEL X
AMC Nut
Joined: Nov/09/2015 Location: Winnipeg Canada Status: Offline Points: 385 |
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Posted: Aug/13/2016 at 8:09am |
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Thank you for mentioning the damaging effects of artificial lighting on fabrics Bill. It is the UV factor of the lighting that is the most damaging. Long term storage of some fabrics must be done with care to avoid damage as you had stated.
I did not find any issues with the automotive fabrics and materials that I stored on shelving. However they are all made of synthetics and contain little to no cotton or wool. Materials for antiques are an exception.
There definitely is a difference in types of fabrics and materials and what they are made of. Most residential fabrics have little to no UV protection. Some may have protection to 200 hours of sun light but most are 80 hours or less. Fabrics for marine usage have both high UV protection ratings as well as high MR (mildew resistance) ratings. Automotive fabrics and materials have high UV factor ratings and last the longest before showing the damage of being exposed to damaging light. They have high MR ratings as well. Cold generally doe not affect automotive fabric and leather but does affect materials such as "leatherette" , Naugahyde and vinyl. Most automotive materials have a cold crack factor of -20 F and up to -40 F. Snowmobile and off road vehicle materials typically have high UV lasting as long as automotive materials. They also have high MR and the best cold crack ratings of -40 F or better. Edited by REBEL X - Aug/13/2016 at 8:12am |
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67 Rebel SST 343 AT conv
68 Rebel 550 232 AT conv 68 Rebel 550 232 AT conv 68 Rebel SST 343 4 SP conv 68 Rebel SST 401 727 HT 70 Rebel SST 360 AT Wgn 70 Rebel SST 304 AT HT 70 Rebel Machine 390 AT |
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REBEL X
AMC Nut
Joined: Nov/09/2015 Location: Winnipeg Canada Status: Offline Points: 385 |
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Posted: Aug/13/2016 at 8:53am |
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Bill you front seats look to be in very good condition structurally.
There is a common problem with the seat structures on these seats. On the bottom seat frame metal structure there are tabs that hold the "no sag" springs in place. After time and usage those tabs break off and the spring drops and no longer is effective. The seat sags and the back vinyl panel of the seat cover tears where it meets the fabric. Another issue is sometimes the spring will break again resulting in a saggy seat. Sometimes the broken spring may work it's way up and damage the seat cover from down below. The seat structures are made of several pieces of metal spot welded together. Sometimes those spot welds break resulting in the seat frame twisting. This can be repaired by removing the seat cover and foam then welding the parts back together. Usually this only happens to the backrest as it only has support on the two bottom corners where it is bolted to the bottom seat frame. Pressure on the top of the backrest like when you lift you rear end to adjust your seating position or to get your coat tails out of the way causes some twisting of the frame. This will result in a damaged frame structure. I wonder if a previous owner of your Javelin may not have had the experience to remove the seat cover from the foam padding and did want to attempt it to repair a damaged frame. Cutting the seat cover from the back as your's is would allow the cover and foam to be removed as an assembly and much easier to reassemble. It's a shame that someone did that to an otherwise nice seat. A good upholsterer can replace that back vinyl panel with the correct vinyl and nobody would ever know the cover was damaged. It would be about a 2 to 2 1/2 hour job to R & R the seat cover and to sew in a new rear panel. There is similar grained black vinyl available or the correct vinyl can be ordered from SMS. |
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67 Rebel SST 343 AT conv
68 Rebel 550 232 AT conv 68 Rebel 550 232 AT conv 68 Rebel SST 343 4 SP conv 68 Rebel SST 401 727 HT 70 Rebel SST 360 AT Wgn 70 Rebel SST 304 AT HT 70 Rebel Machine 390 AT |
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Camp62299
AMC Fan 
Joined: Aug/07/2016 Location: georgia Status: Offline Points: 13 |
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Posted: Aug/13/2016 at 1:19pm |
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Thank you so much for the feedback! I know, still hoping for some magic answer to make the beautiful and unusual PC come back to brand new life! And yes, pulling the original material and sewing back on a base for seats is what I had thought if cant get material - IF I can find someone willing to do that. Guess will just hope SMS come through in the next several months maybe?
also from anyone - about to buy some American racing 17" rims - figure a better showing and much easier to get tires... I am doing a 5 spoke torque thrust - 17 x 7.oomm or 17 x 8.00mm / any suggest (or warning...) on too large of a size /or offset that wont work in our SST wheel well? Thanks to anyone for the wisdom!! thanks again, Mark
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Teamamc
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Joined: Jul/04/2007 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 1054 |
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Posted: Aug/13/2016 at 2:03pm |
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Hi Mark, I offer restoration on the original PC fabric and have some core pieces to replace non restore able sections.
If the rest of your seats are good then we can restore. The only original piece you get back is the PC section. The restored seat socks have new vinyl, welting, back foam. I only have 73 seat cores at present. |
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Teamamc
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Joined: Jul/04/2007 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 1054 |
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Posted: Aug/13/2016 at 2:16pm |
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I have a set of NOS PC seat bucket socks on EBAY right now.
262567544699 |
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Teamamc
AMC Addicted
Joined: Jul/04/2007 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 1054 |
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Posted: Sep/14/2016 at 11:03pm |
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I now have the 3M vinyl peices to restore the PC door inserts on the 72/73 AMX and javelins.
I will put up some pictures shoeing how it is done. I have 15 pairs made. $47/pair shipping included to canada and US. will be more oversea's This is a finished one beside a decent origional. The camera makes the silver /gray a little off. I will post a topic showing start to finish.  |
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Camp62299
AMC Fan
Joined: Aug/07/2016 Location: georgia Status: Offline Points: 13 |
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Posted: Sep/20/2016 at 8:14pm |
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guess a little late on replying - the PC seats socks available? also - any feedbalc on my questions relating to 17 inch wheels and sizes of 17 that will work with my 1972 SST? thanks
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Camp62299 wrote: