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one wire alternator |
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BBO Steve 
AMC Fan 
Joined: Apr/18/2016 Location: NC Status: Offline Points: 23 |
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 Posted: Sep/28/2017 at 9:33pm |
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billd, you build and sell 62 amp ones? If not what part number would I look for, every search I do for a 62 amp motorola comes up with ones for forklift or tractors.
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Moffman
AMC Nut 
Joined: Sep/28/2011 Location: New Jersey Status: Offline Points: 287 |
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Posted: Sep/28/2017 at 9:42pm |
Ideally, it would be at the main distribution point or fuse panel. Here's an article explaining remote voltage sensing. http://www.pirate4x4.com/tech/billavista/Wiring/Part2/#voltagesensing Personally, when I wired up my alternator, I just hooked it up to the battery side of the starter solenoid. The old output wire should be a thick gauge red wire. |
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dltowers
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Joined: Dec/12/2012 Location: Friendswood, TX Status: Offline Points: 5827 |
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Posted: Sep/28/2017 at 10:56pm |
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I made need correcting, but I think if a person uses the one wire type alternator,
the red "Dash Alternator Warning Light"
will not illuminate when the ignition is turned on? Am I correct? |
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Original Owner, 1974 Javelin:
360ci,2v,727TC. Motorola Multiplex with 8-Track. G4 Plum exterior with 421Q Black Uganda Interior. Purchased on July 16, 1974 from Hooker AMC, Sherman, TX for $4500.20 |
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Moffman
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Joined: Sep/28/2011 Location: New Jersey Status: Offline Points: 287 |
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Posted: Sep/28/2017 at 11:08pm |
Right, I don't think OP truly means a one wire especially if he's trying to wire up a warning light.
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vinny
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Joined: Jan/05/2012 Location: Calgary Status: Offline Points: 2837 |
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Posted: Sep/29/2017 at 9:30am |
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89 Pontiac Safari is often quoted as a donor vehicle for a CS130 alternator that has a 6.6" spacing 180 degrees across and comes with the V pulley. A metric 8 X 1 1/4 mm bolt is used for tensioning. How does that spacing compare with the Motorola?
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billd
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Forum Administrator Joined: Jun/27/2007 Location: Iowa Status: Offline Points: 30894 |
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Posted: Sep/29/2017 at 10:53pm |
The 60+ was used by AMC starting about 72 for the cars with AC, heavy-duty charging systems, fleet, etc. I'd have to consult my chart for exact details but after 71 the 55 was dropped for the larger units. So what I do depends on cores or parts I have on hand. Here's the problem buying alternators - if reman, you get what they put together out of available parts and decide it would likely fit. If new, you find what they have demand for - and Motorola made alternators for AMC, VW, Toyota, Porsche, John Deere, Case and a host of other companies, some other high-end foreign make cars other than Porsche, Toyota, etc. as well. So it's likely they see no demand for Motorola for AMC cars and sell for ag and industry and other vehicles. They also sold a TON of them for marine use - sealed bearings, in fact, sealed everything. They were water-tight. What you likely have found were units with the wide adjusting "ear" - instead of a single threaded hole like AMC used, you are likely finding those with 3 or so threaded holes, a "universal" fit. The hole for the through-bolt is likely larger as well. Anyway, if I have cores or parts, yes, I can put together the 60+ amp alternators. the nice thing is that they are identical in size except the front to back dimension - because the rotor is longer and the stator thicker, they are 1/2" "thicker" front to back than a 35 and 1/4" more than a 55 amp, but the same mounting pattern exactly - same brackets, same bolts, same belt, etc. just the back end sticks back a bit more. If you want to get really crazy, I have done this but it's not cheap because it's a lot of hand work, a lot of DETAIL work, a lot of time and the pulley and fan must be rust-free to plate this nicely...................    |
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billd
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Forum Administrator Joined: Jun/27/2007 Location: Iowa Status: Offline Points: 30894 |
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Posted: Sep/29/2017 at 11:05pm |
You don't need correcting very often, and this is another case where you do not.  I know they are called "one-wire alternators" but the fact is they are not. There is the method of wiring, but they are not one-wire alternators. It's all in how some choose to wire things. Your performance catalog outlets, JEGS and so on, call 'em that because it SELLS. (but you'll find at least a couple of other web sites explaining what I try to explain here, so I'm not alone) The GM alternators were notorious for owners finding low or dead batteries the next day, bad diodes, bad regulators allowing the battery to discharge through the alternator, etc. when wired this way. For some reason, perhaps weak diodes or regulators unable to handle large currents, I never tried to figure it out, only knew that GM was number one for trouble in that way. I worked on, repaired, replaced at least double if not more, GM alternators compared to all others combined. They went through a lot more regulators, diodes, diode trios and for some reason, wore more brushes. We had to keep GM alternator parts in stock and plenty of them. I won't say they were bad - well - the 10si and earlier weren't really good, but they sure had their share of troubles. GM moved to better units after the 10si series. (which were crazy large for their small outputs and meant more wasted HP spinning those larger rotors) We rarely saw issues with Motorola units unless someone did something STUPID like trying to trouble-shoot by pulling a battery cable on a running vehicle, that sort of thing, or mixing up the cables when jump-starting or charging, but you can hardly blame the charging system for those issues. No professional mechanic or tech would pull the cable off when the engine was running on a car with an alternator. I'd fire anyone who pulled that stunt. |
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amcfool1
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Joined: Jun/18/2011 Location: roanoke va Status: Offline Points: 1075 |
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Posted: Sep/30/2017 at 7:46am |
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billd, what is your opinion of the 12si? used in the 80s Eagles. I have a 12si (78 amp), that I rebuilt myself, and am thinking of putting it into my 77 258 AMX, to replace the original 63 amp 10si. I MAY go to electric fans at some point. Car has manual trans (T5) , AC, and a just slightly hopped up stereo, (45 watts/channel). thanks, gz
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george z
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billd
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Forum Administrator Joined: Jun/27/2007 Location: Iowa Status: Offline Points: 30894 |
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Posted: Sep/30/2017 at 12:00pm |
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The 12si (si stands for system integrated, meaning internal regulator) is the same as far as mounting dimensions - but has much better COOLING. If given a choice I'd shoot for the 12si.
They came in 56, 66, 78 and 94 amp. The larger were typically reserved for the higher-end GM cars with all the bells and whistles. Standard cars, Chevrolets, etc. typically had the lower outputs, I'd say 78 was most common on the typical full-sized GM.
12si is better output and much better cooling - the fan is the biggest "tell" visually as to which is which. If you are thinking of electric fans there's little question as to which way I'd go - the 12si, as it will handle the extended larger loads of the fans better and run cooler. Heat is bad when it comes to electrical stuff as I'm sure you know anyway. Since it's a bolt-on change, I'd say "do it". Do be aware of the wire sizes - the TSM should tell what gauge your car came with as far as from alternator to junction and so on - and there are charts all over, or you can ask here, if that gauge will handle the extra output if it happens to hit max. Until you add the fans it's likely that alternator will be loafing because they only put out what's needed. But think of the HP that standard steel fan takes, then change to electric fans and suddenly the alternator takes over generating the required HP in WATTS (volts times amps). (thankfully only when needed with electric where a standard fan takes that at all times unless it's a clutch type fan.) |
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BBO Steve
AMC Fan
Joined: Apr/18/2016 Location: NC Status: Offline Points: 23 |
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Posted: Sep/30/2017 at 12:39pm |
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I'm going to return the 120 amp alternator as the more people I talk to the more it seems it will create more problems then it solves. I plan on using the Delco 10 or 12 SI 66 amp as it should be more readily available here. Thanks billd and all the others for the info. Last question, does anyone know the actual part number for it?
Edited by BBO Steve - Sep/30/2017 at 5:21pm |
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BBO Steve wrote: