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My "new" 72 Javelin SST

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CamJam View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CamJam Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul/25/2018 at 10:09pm

It was 111 degrees here yesterday, and since the garage is not cooled and I don't have a lift, I decided to call a local transmission shop and see what they would charge to remove the 998 and put the AW4 in. I hate not doing this myself, but for $350, I couldn't pass it up.  They're just going to do the grunt work, and I'll deal with the driveshaft, cables, wiring and shifter once I get the car back home. 



They won't start until Monday, so that gave me some time to put some helper springs on the car.  It had been a little high in the front since I put the new coils springs on (probably because the 45-year old rear springs were sagging a bit too) so I thought the $35 cost of a set of helper springs would be worth a try.   It raised the back of the car an inch or two, and the stance is now just where I want it.  Feels a little more taut on the road too without ruining the ride.


Edited by CamJam - Jul/28/2018 at 10:29pm
'73 Javelin 360 (current project)
'72 Baja Bronze Javelin SST
'69 Big Bad Orange AMX (2018 Teague Heritage Award) SOLD

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote CamJam Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/12/2018 at 9:15pm

The 998 is out of the car and I took both flex-plates down to King Balance in Phoenix and had them match balance the Jeep 4.0 flex-plate to the 304's.  I got that back on Friday, and now I'm just waiting for the tranny shop to install the AW4 transmission.  I should get it back tomorrow or Tuesday and am anxious to get on it so I can finish the wiring, shift linkage, etc.

They're also going to fix the leaky rear seal on the 304 while the tranny is out. 

Not wanting to be sitting around while the car was gone, I took the connectors I'd removed from my donor '94 Cherokee and built a harness to connect to the TCU.  The TCU is not waterproof-- in the Cherokee it's mounted behind the dash-- so my plan is to mount it at the rear of the Javelin's glove box, which in the humpsters is right over the transmission tunnel.  I won't be able to crimp everything together until I've run the harness through the firewall, so for now I've labeled everything, and when the car comes back it will be a simple matter to join the wires, heat shrink them and cover with plastic spiral wrap. 



I actually have two TCUs, from '94 and '96 Cherokees, which should be identical, so I have a spare if needed. Jeep changed the connectors and pin-outs in '97 or '98, but these TCUs should work with just about any AW4 prior to that.

I've been wondering how to deal with the speedometer, since the 92 and up AW-4s have electronic VSS output, but I believe that the mechanical speedometer gear housings from pre-92 AW4's will bolt right in.  I'm still awaiting confirmation of that, but if so I'll be heading back to the Pick n' Pull to find one.

I'm optimistic that the shift linkage won't be a huge deal.  The Jeep shifter had a Park lockout cable that prevented the shifter from being moved in or out of Park unless your foot was on the brake, but I won't be needing that since I'll be using the stock Torque-Command floor shifter.  None of that idiot-proofing was done back in 1972. Makes you wonder how we managed to live through those years! 

I think that using the stock Javelin shifter might also allow me to use the original neutral safety switch, which minimizes any NSS-related wiring mods I'll have to make.  That's one of the things I just won't know until I can get the car back and start working on it.

The Throttle Position Sensor and kick-down cable will require some fabrication of a bracket.  I just picked up a used metal brake at the local Habitat for Humanity store for $25 that will be useful for that, and Rick Jones' (SC397) AW-4 sticky in the transmission section gives me a pretty good idea what I need to do.

Hopefully by this time next week I'll have overdrive in the Javvy. Once everything is done I hope to detail it a little better to help anyone who plans to put an AW4 into a humpster in future.  Rick's sticky is very helpful, but his Javelin was a '69 and there are a few minor differences, especially since I'm trying to use the stock shifter.


Edited by CamJam - Aug/12/2018 at 11:00pm
'73 Javelin 360 (current project)
'72 Baja Bronze Javelin SST
'69 Big Bad Orange AMX (2018 Teague Heritage Award) SOLD

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pit crew Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/12/2018 at 9:39pm
Check some of the custom gauge vendors like Dakota Digital with the ECD-100. They offer a "motor" that reads the VSS and then drives an analog gauge just like a cable would. Something also like the Speedhut Speedbox works which is a little spendy because it can also go GPS.




Edited by pit crew - Aug/12/2018 at 9:55pm

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CamJam Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/12/2018 at 10:58pm
Thanks, Ken.  I'm familiar with those, but even the Dakota Digital unit is $300!

I've got the same problem in my Opel GT since I put a T5 in it, and I've been using a GPS heads-up display I bought off Amazon for $30. I'll just do that if the pre-92 speedo gear housing doesn't work out, though it would of course be nice to have the original speedometer working.
'73 Javelin 360 (current project)
'72 Baja Bronze Javelin SST
'69 Big Bad Orange AMX (2018 Teague Heritage Award) SOLD

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CamJam Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/13/2018 at 8:49pm

Today was the day to sort out the speedometer drive, and the trip to the Pick 'n Pull was a success.  I didn't find any 2WD Cherokees, but took a chance that the 4WD speedo gear housings would be the same. The 2WD drive mounts to the transmission while the 4WD mounts to the transfer case, but they are indeed identical.

Next issue to overcome was to see whether the mechanical speedo drive from a pre-92 AW4 (top photo) would work in place of the electric VSS drive (lower photo) that was in my '94 transmission.  I grabbed a mechanical drive from an '89 Cherokee today for $10, and indeed, it bolts right in! Another reason the AW4 is a great choice for our old AMCs.  

It takes just a minute or two to change the drives out-- and connecting the Javelin speedo should now be just a matter of finding the right speedometer cable to match the threads on the drive.  Possibly the stock Javelin cable will fit, but I haven't tried it yet.  





The mechanical drive shown in the top photo is obviously pictured without the gear.  While the drives themselves fit without modification, the gears are different.  They have different shaft lengths, so if you're doing this swap yourself you'll need to use the right gear for your drive.  AW4 speedo gears are readily available at most Jeep/Off-Road outlets, and many different ratios are available to match the tire diameter and rear axle ratio of your car.  I just went with the dark-green gear that came with my drive, and we'll see how that works.  Looking at the charts available on many of the Jeep sites I should be close.


Edited by CamJam - Aug/13/2018 at 9:00pm
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'72 Baja Bronze Javelin SST
'69 Big Bad Orange AMX (2018 Teague Heritage Award) SOLD

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 1970390amx Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/13/2018 at 10:06pm
Does the AW4 computer use an electric speed signal? 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CamJam Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/13/2018 at 10:48pm
Originally posted by 1970390amx 1970390amx wrote:

Does the AW4 computer use an electric speed signal? 

The pre '97 (or '98) have a simple reed switch output to the transmission controller.  The reed switch is activated by a magnetic trigger inside the transmission. That's separate from the speedometer output, which uses a gear on the output shaft.  The pre-97 AW4 use a standalone controller and don't tie in to the vehicle's computer.  The later AW4 do, so things get more complicated then.

Here's a description I "borrowed" from one of the Jeep forums:

1987-1990, the AW4 had a 21 spline output shaft, a 1 pulse per revolution reed switch Output Speed Sensor, no Input Speed Sensor, and a 0.705:1 OD ratio. 4.0L and 2.5L transmissions are fundamentally the same, except for the torque converter and bellhousing, which are unique for each motor.

1990.5-1996, the AW4 switched to a 23 spline output shaft and a 0.75:1 OD ratio. It was no longer available behind the 2.5L engine. Otherwise, it remained exactly the same.

1997, the AW4 is exactly the same as the 1990.5-1996 units, except the electrical connector for the wiring harness changed. A simple cut and splice will solve this problem.

1998-01, the AW4 changed electrically, but is otherwise the same as 1990.5-1997 units. The Output Speed Sensor changed from a 1pps reed switch to a 4 pulse/rev variable reluctance pickup similar to the RENIX CPS and most ABS wheel speed sensors. A 16 pulse/rev Input Speed Sensor was also added. The ISS and OSS for these years are the same part number; one may be substituted for the other for spare parts purposes.

I'm using a '94 transmission with the mechanical speedometer drive from an '87-90.


Edited by CamJam - Aug/13/2018 at 11:00pm
'73 Javelin 360 (current project)
'72 Baja Bronze Javelin SST
'69 Big Bad Orange AMX (2018 Teague Heritage Award) SOLD

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CamJam Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/15/2018 at 7:39pm
I'm taking a few minutes off from working on the car so thought I'd write down some thoughts on the AW4 transmission swap.

The shifter linkage was a pleasant surprise.  The standard Javelin console shifter rod comes within 1.75" of where it needs to be on the AW4.  I've cut the end off the the Jeep's cable (last four inches or so at the transmission end) and just to see if it would work I clamped it to the Javelin's linkage with vice grips.  Works just as it should, so I'll have it welded together.  Only problem is that the indexing is off, so when it'says neutral it's really in drive.  I haven't had to disassemble the Javelin console at all though... it's just a matter of extending the linkage by 1.75"!

The original Javelin drive shaft is within 1/4" of what it needs to be to, so no changes there except the front yoke.  The AW4 has a different spline count than the 998, so I'll need to put the Jeep yoke on the Javelin driveshaft.  That will be easy because the Jeep and Javelin use the same U-joint.

The speedometer cable too is right where it needs to be and connected right up!!  Same threads!

Only snag I've run into so far is the transmission crossmember.  It barely fits under the transmission, and finding a mount that is thin enough will be a problem.  The Jeep mount would work with minimal changes if there were more clearance between the tranny and the crossmember.

I can see that the transmission cooler line fittings are larger on the AW4, so I'll need to fabricate some new lines with the smaller Javelin fittings on one end and AW4 fittings on the other.

I'll try to get all these mechanical issues out of the way before I start on the wiring. 
'73 Javelin 360 (current project)
'72 Baja Bronze Javelin SST
'69 Big Bad Orange AMX (2018 Teague Heritage Award) SOLD

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Scene One Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/16/2018 at 6:33am
sounds like you are having fun on this project. Nice work!!

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JolleyGreenSST Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/17/2018 at 9:48pm
Well I just went through all 23 pages and have to say that you've made so much progress in a years time that I'm not sure if I should be motivated or intimidated! lol! J/K definitely motivated Thumbs Up
I know I won't get that kinda result in a years time, because your car started off in better condition. 
Also like you I have other projects as well, and some of those are on the front burner, but I did order a few parts for my Javelin that I know I wanted, like the disc brakes and I'm working a deal on some other things that I'm hoping to seal the deal on soon.
But just wanted to say how impressed I am with your restoration and painting skills and especially your tasteful upgrades. 
"God is good all the time and all the time God is good!"
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