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my 195.6 OHV state-of-tune

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farna View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote farna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/03/2018 at 5:40am
Front side cover or front of valve cover?  Side cover is stock location. I'm wondering if he didn't change to somewhere on the valve cover due to the reduction in oil usage. There is a shield on the front side cover behind the PCV valve, but I'm betting some oil still gets sucked in from there at sustained higher rpm. Never really thought about it when I was driving a 196, just assumed it used more oil at higher rpm since it is a late 30s design and never really intended to run like that. The shield may be the design element (same as behind the earlier road draft tube) that was causing the oil use at sustained high rpm (over 2000 for a 196).
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tomj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/04/2018 at 11:43pm
Originally posted by farna farna wrote:

Just to make sure I'm reading this right, rpm are top scale left to right, and the left scale is MPH (with vacuum on far left)??


that's right. it's basically a spreadsheet; when the engine is at 1200, the advance choices are that column below it. load (manifold vacuum) is similar, if it's 30 KPa, the choices are the row across; the intersection of the two is what's used.

of course RPM and mani pressure is rarely exactly 2000, etc. that's when the computer is so useful -- if RPM is say 2200, it interpolates between the two-closest values, more ir less what you or i would do.


Quote Where do you have your PCV valve... in the valve cover or stock location (front side cover)? I can verify that the 195.6 OHV typically drinks more oil when run 2000+ rpm for any length of time -- mine always did!


yup, dumb old front cover. the catch can -- not really it's function, but that's probably the best name -- seems to collect all the mist and condense it. it's the velocity vs. volume thing; in the "can" (really, VERY WIDE PIPE) the flow rate is slow enough for the mist to condense.

i dunno whaty happens after hours and hours assuming it collects liquid on the bottom. i assume it burbles down the 1/2" hose, at the same time mist flows up, just as an old steam radiator system worked.

1960 Rambler Super two-door wagon, OHV auto
1961 Roadster American, 195.6 OHV, T5
http://www.ramblerLore.com

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tomj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/04/2018 at 11:44pm
Originally posted by Gelalthedamned Gelalthedamned wrote:

5$s says it’s in the front


YOU WIN!

1960 Rambler Super two-door wagon, OHV auto
1961 Roadster American, 195.6 OHV, T5
http://www.ramblerLore.com

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gelalthedamned Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/05/2018 at 2:50am
Scientifically...it seems the front is the best location.
Unless your car is stock, then who even cares.

I reckon cause
A: my motor is angled -2 degrees at rest
B: when in motion (esp going fast) the flung oil suspended in valve cover is going to smack the rear of the valve cover and then has the potential to get sucked in the pcv valve (at least one of us has oversized vortec valves in the head and thus a bit more intake)
Calamity - 73 Gremlin X zombie rod (daily driver)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tomj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/06/2018 at 11:00pm
Originally posted by farna farna wrote:

Front side cover or front of valve cover? 


i missed this part earlier... front SIDE cover.

my previous engine i had modified a valve cover to put PCV in the top of it, with a welded in baffle. even THAT sucked oil, same as the side cover. and i was using the same very small PCV valve. there's a lot of mist in that engine. poor oil and air control, probably one of those engine design features most of us are completely unaware of.

1960 Rambler Super two-door wagon, OHV auto
1961 Roadster American, 195.6 OHV, T5
http://www.ramblerLore.com

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tomj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/06/2018 at 11:27pm
i lieu of real docs:



assembled.... the bottom elbow gets a 1/2" ID hose to the front side cover. a bracket mounts this can to the old spark coil bosses.  the little PCV is plumbed into the 5/16" vacuum line that runs from the intake trough (the hole in the head casting below the carb) to the wiper pump inlet.








1960 Rambler Super two-door wagon, OHV auto
1961 Roadster American, 195.6 OHV, T5
http://www.ramblerLore.com

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tomj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/06/2018 at 11:29pm
i carefully sandwiched the thin pain can with two steel discs inside and outside so that it's about 1/4" thick, then tapped with NPT taps.

it surprisingly hard to find a suitable container that could be opened for cleaning and inspection.

1960 Rambler Super two-door wagon, OHV auto
1961 Roadster American, 195.6 OHV, T5
http://www.ramblerLore.com

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote farna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/09/2018 at 7:26am
All the mist insides is probably not present, or maybe not as prevalent, in the L-head... the original version of the 196. The conversion to OHV introduced many anomalies! I do seem to recall my L-head used about as much oil as the OHV, but that was so long ago I hardly remember (I only ran an L-head in my first couple Ramblers... about four years -- mid 78-82). That was over three cars... the first had so many miles on it it didn't matter, then I rebuilt the engine and used it in another car (front end shot on first, easier to transfer motor to a better car with blown motor), and finally swapped it out to another car after more front end problems -- this time from cracks where some cracks were welded...and the metal over heated. That REALLY ticked me off, as I had it welded by a "professional" shop. Could have just been the actual metal and not really the welder at fault though....
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tomj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/12/2018 at 11:18pm
being of the engineering bent (I WANT EVIDENCE) and not having a performance background, i was reluctant to do what everyone else would have done... STICK A BIGGER CARBURETOR ON IT.

i've run waaaay out of carburetor. i don't have a tuning problem. i've exceeded the flow ability of the Weber 38/38 DGV by it seems a good margin. i was going by claimed CFM numbers etc but it's nonsense, it's too small, when the engine is in 5th at 3000+ rpm.

at 10 In Hg, it's sucking fuel, A/F ratio is 12 or less. it's half or 2/3rds throttle. half of this is the iteration of spark and jetting, after getting gearing dialed in.

it's why the motor hasn't been so happy over 3500.

i've been doing a lot of research on EFI, either TBI or port injection. TBI is sort of dead for me, in spite of the new bolt-on stuff from Holley (still not really in use) or Easy EFI, etc. i want the next ECU to do spark also, my MegaJolt Lite Jr is great but its old and soon to disappear i fear (leaving me on the side of the road if it fails). also EFI of any form is simply too much money, even bang per unit buck. i'm sticking wth carbs, and Webers, which have proven to be superbly tuneable (by that i mean beyond just repair) across the band. it's a PITA, and tedious, and horribly analog, and i'm fine with it.

so i am settled on a Weber IDF 44, or maybe 48. it's a dual/siamese carb, tuneable everything. even venturis. and its cheap ($400). i have to make a whole new trough plate, it needs to move out and up a bit, but i'm fine with that sort of fabrication, i'll start now now for winter install.

also the IDF is freakin' pretty. comes with air horns. i need a box to filter them, but i'll fab that into the hood.

1960 Rambler Super two-door wagon, OHV auto
1961 Roadster American, 195.6 OHV, T5
http://www.ramblerLore.com

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tomj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/12/2018 at 11:22pm
oh so the other point is that where previously i thought the Weber 32/36 DGEV was a good carb for a stock 195.6 OHV, i will upgrade that to the 38/38 instead. same bolt/base pattern, same air cleaner pattern. "close enough" fuel inlet, throttle was a bit different. the Redline/Weber "jeep" kit can be had with it. for a stock OHV, or a 232 even 258 that is just a daily driver, it's a truly great carb. i've now driven them for close to 7? 10? years, and even where odd/different to tune (if you're used to holley/edelbrock/etc) once set, they STAY PUT. (buy the Pat Braden WEBER book, oldie but goodie). i can tell you the jets to use/start with, and jets are cheap.

1960 Rambler Super two-door wagon, OHV auto
1961 Roadster American, 195.6 OHV, T5
http://www.ramblerLore.com

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