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Is this a stupid idea (that won't work)

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uncljohn View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote uncljohn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul/03/2014 at 10:05pm
Originally posted by MARTINSR MARTINSR wrote:

I didn't read every word in this thread so forgive me if I am repeating something but if you aren't dealing with a REAL parts store, you could be spinning your wheels looking for the "rare" part. I was blown away to find my local REAL parts store (not the McParts chains) that supply the local shops, they had IN STOCK the master cyl, wheel cylinders, brake light switch, they had it all for my 59 American and this is Wagner, not even the more popular Bendix. 

So do some home work, don't give up and go to a REAL parts store first off.
Brian   


I agree with the above in spades. I have been maintaining at least 3 AMC products that are essentially drivers, although they all have been driven cross country to shows where we (Valerie and I) enjoy ourselves. There are many many mechanical parts available over the counter at major autoparts stores.  Specialty mechanical parts are problematic and you learn to take very good care of the smog parts that are unique to AMC.  However many of them are blanket certified from a GM application.
It is the cosmetic stuff that gets more than a bit tricky
And give our vendors the credit due to them.  They stay in business by being on top of what fits, where to get them and who else is using the same thing.
I have yet to have a problem a vendor has not been able to solve.
Recently I had an AC control knob for my Spirit turn into knob bits and pieces and the right question phrased correctly got me a functional replacement at a Chevrolet venders booth at a local swap meet.  I also obtained replacement seat belts from a used seat belt pile at a Chevrolet booth at a swap meet.  The fit, bolt into place and are the right color and trim appearance.  Except the say Chevrolet on the buckle I.D. and you know something, I have received compliments on how nice the belts look but no one once said anything about spelling Spirit incorrect.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Javelin69 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul/07/2014 at 11:39pm
Thought I'd mention that my 68 AMX has the rear mounted proportioning valve and servo brakes. Must have been a running change, unless non servo cars also had that valve. I've always has a rear lock up issue on quick brake application, although road tests of the day mention that also. I've thought about rebuilding the valve per an article I saw on line.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 401MATCOUPE Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul/08/2014 at 6:10am
Originally posted by Javelin69 Javelin69 wrote:

Thought I'd mention that my 68 AMX has the rear mounted proportioning valve and servo brakes. Must have been a running change, unless non servo cars also had that valve. I've always has a rear lock up issue on quick brake application, although road tests of the day mention that also. I've thought about rebuilding the valve per an article I saw on line.
 
Sounds like your AMX has Front Disc Brakes......all Disc Brake Cars with Bendix Four Piston Caliper fromt he factory had a rear proportioning valve.  In 1971 when the Kelsey Hayes Disc Brake was introduced in the US, the front spliter block was changed to a front proportioning/combination valve and the rear valve was eliminated.  Rebuild kit for the rear valve is available from Scott Hollenbeck at Muscle Car Research...he is a memeber of this Forum too.
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote uncljohn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul/08/2014 at 7:54am
Originally posted by Javelin69 Javelin69 wrote:

Thought I'd mention that my 68 AMX has the rear mounted proportioning valve and servo brakes. Must have been a running change, unless non servo cars also had that valve. I've always has a rear lock up issue on quick brake application, although road tests of the day mention that also. I've thought about rebuilding the valve per an article I saw on line.


I drove a 69 AMX as a one year old used car.  Something the local Rambler agency ordered and sold a lot of at the time with the group 19 optional parts in the trunk and installed at the dealer.  With no power steering.  A configuration at the time that was popular with wannabe drag racers.  And what is a memorable memory of driving the thing was how scary it was to stop it from speed.  With the short wheel base and the tires of the era the back brakes would lock up at the slightest provocation.  An AMX is nose heavy typical of the pony cars of the time and the weight shift would move the weight forward and technology was not good enough to compensate for that.  Staying in anything resembling a straight line was a function of imagination.
It was my dad's 1st AMC car.  I still own the 2nd one, a Mark Donohue and while it is not as bad as the AMX was, it is still spooky getting it whoaed up from speed.  But the longer wheel base mellowed it out a bit.  And today's tires helped a lot too.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Javelin69 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul/08/2014 at 8:45am
So I guess I'm wondering since mine is a 68, should it have the non servo rear brakes even though it has the rear valve? Could this be part of the rear lock up issue? Perhaps the rear axle has been swapped at sometime with servo rear brakes. My TSM is at work but the Chilton manual I have here shows all 68 AMX with servo rears regardless of disc or drum fronts.

Edited by Javelin69 - Jul/08/2014 at 8:49am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote uncljohn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul/08/2014 at 8:57am
I would personally say it is a characteristic of the beast.  To find out what you have take it apart and see.  And then worry about what it does. There are parts on the market today that allow tailoring and adjusting of the brakes not to mention whole new brake packages at a price, some in the area of the national debt. 
Personally, I would just live with it as that in my opinion is the nature of the thing.  That does depend though on how bad this symptom is as to whether it is a problem or not.
There are also brake material available today that was not available when the car was built.  No whether ceramic material is being used for brake shoes on drum brakes, I don't know but up graded brake material has been around for quite some time.
Find out what you actually have before I would worry about it.
I still have the OEM front discs and what ever is on the rear has not been touched in years so I now have forgotten what is there.  Semi-metallic?  I dunno, but I have no interest in upgrading anything.  The car stops when I put the brake on.




Edited by uncljohn - Jul/08/2014 at 9:00am
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80 Fuel Injected I6 Spirit
74 232 I-6, 4bbl, 270HL Isky Cam
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SEdmonds Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul/08/2014 at 10:41am
The 66 Marlin had an odd combination of brakes when we got her. She had the non-servo drums in back and regular drums in front. We had no way of knowing if the discs had been removed from the front or if the non-servos had been placed on the rear. Both front and rear needed work and the rear non-servos were missing parts. What we opted to do was replace the non-servo rear brakes with regular drum brakes as it was an easier system to get parts for.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote farna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul/08/2014 at 10:50am
That is odd! My best guess is that the front calipers started leaking and rather than replace them (expensive!) the PO just found a set of drums and installed.

Of course I have heard weird stories about cars coming off the line! One person told me that they bought a new 70s Ambassador and it always pulled on braking. Took it back to the dealer and they discovered a drum brake on one side and a disc on the other! That was when standard was still drums. Remember, AMC assembled all big cars on one line, and they were in batches -- might be 5-6 Ambos followed by 10-12 Rebels (or Matadors) -- models and trim/option levels were all mixed on the same line. It would be easy to get a part going to the line in the wrong sequence. I wouldn't have wanted to have to coordinate all that!! 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SEdmonds Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul/08/2014 at 11:06am
The Marlin wasn't stock when we got her. A Gen 2 or 3 engine had been placed in her (the T-10 and original torque tube remained - they had made adapter pieces for this). The rear end is a 3:45 ratio and it was running 10 inch wide tires. Possibly, the rear axle was replaced...possibly the front discs were removed to lighten the car. We opted for what was going to be the easiest system to maintain. It's factory correct...we just have no way of knowing if it was how this
particular car left the factory.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote farna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul/08/2014 at 1:00pm
Made adapters for the T-10 to torque tube, or was it a T-10 made for the torque tube? There were some factory T-10 four speeds in 66...
Frank Swygert
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