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Header Hack |
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Greyhounds_AMX
AMC Addicted Joined: Nov/14/2009 Location: Kansas City Status: Offline Points: 1268 |
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Posted: Jun/10/2016 at 12:53pm |
I’ve
always wanted headers on my '68 AMX but didn’t want the associated leaking gaskets,
leaking flanges, bottoming out, etc. It seems some brands have better flanges
than others so gaskets may not be an issue, but collector flanges still are a
trouble spot. And my car sits LOW, so I’m going to bottom out any stock
headers.
I
decided to re-shape a set of headers to form fit my car using an old set I had
laying around. I got these at a swap meet as part of a $60 package deal, and
the other parts (including a Machine manifold) were what I was after, so IMO
they were free. I tried to sell them at NAMDRA and had no takers at $80, so
they’ve been sitting on the shelf for 10+ years now. They were in very good condition and ceramic
coated, so I had that blasted off since I expected to be doing a bunch of
welding on them. After test fitting the driver’s side it was apparent that the forward bends near the oil pan needed to move up about 1.5”, and the collector needed to come up about 2.5” and move out toward the rocker a few inches to give some clearance to the clutch release arm. You have to look past the hanging exhaust pipe to see the relationship between the header collector and the frame - it’s angled down quite a bit. I
mounted a spare cylinder head on my welding cart at the same angle as the heads
are on the block, and arranged some wood to indicate the original elbow and
collector position. Then I sketched the required positions based on how far up I wanted to move, and started trimming
the tubes accordingly. There
was a problem though, in that the pipes hit the Jeep slave cylinder before I
could get them up where I wanted them. I moved everything up intil it pretty
much contacted the slave, but the collector was still hanging too low. The
solution was to move to a “pull-type” slave from Wilwood instead of the stock push type slave cyinder. There are a number of
pull-type slaves available from Wilwood, CNC, Howe, Coleman, and Speedway. Of
them, the Wilwood has the longest travel and has the same bore size as the
stock Jeep slave that I’m replacing. It’s $82 at Jegs/Summit. Here’s an example
of a pull-type on a T5. I don’t have mine mounted yet.
With
the slave out of the way I could pull the collector up nice and tight to the
floor. The two center pipes simply got shorter and got a slight angle to roll
the collector out toward the side of the car, and the font pipe was reconnected
using the original elbow trimmed down to fit. The rearmost pipe was heated with
a torch and stretched to meet up before welding. Now the lower elbows are about
level with the crossmember, and the collector is as close to the floor as
practical.
On the passenger side it only needed to move up (about 1.5" up at the elbows and about 2" up at the end of the collector), but it was obvious that the stock starter would prevent moving the pipes upward the same amount as the driver side. I opted for an Alterstart reman mini starter because it has a bunch of mounting orientations and the motor is mounted up high, away from the header heat. And it’s cheap, like me.
More to come... Edited by Greyhounds_AMX - Jun/11/2016 at 4:25pm |
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1968 AMX 390 w/T5
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THE MENACE
AMC Addicted Joined: Nov/04/2008 Location: So. California Status: Offline Points: 4438 |
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If you want to never have to replace the collector gaskets you can use something like this!
It's an OE style conical seal and heavy duty flanges. It not only won't blow out like the flat gaskets do, but also allows for some engine movement without putting unwanted stress on the header tubing which can eventually cause tube cracking. Dennis |
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Former Owner of:
The Craig Breedlove "AERO AMX" Still Owner: SS/AMX #9 replica (THE BIG MENACE) 70 AMX 416, EFI, Nash 5 speed 70 Javelin 401, 727 (Wife's car) 72 Gremlin Autocross Project. |
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White70JavelinSST
Supporter of TheAMCForum Joined: Aug/08/2012 Location: Minnesota Status: Offline Points: 4867 |
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X 2 on Dennis' suggestion.
I'm guessing the collector is 3" on your headers. There's a myriad number of "ball and socket" or "ball flange" collector kits available. Jeg's, Summit, lots of places to buy from too. There are two bolt flange and three bolt flange varieties. Post up more photos, I'm real curious on this one as I've got a set of Hedmans that are NOS, but the welds at the header flanges are real crappy, the flange itself is too thin to resist warping and the collector flanges are not ball and socket type. I bought a set of thick header flanges and a 3 inch ball and socket collector kit to redo the headers exactly as you are. BTW, nice work, very pretty welds. Edited by White70JavelinSST - Jun/11/2016 at 10:09am |
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70 Javelin SST, second owner, purchased 1972
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motorhead_1
AMC Addicted Joined: Apr/16/2014 Location: AZ Status: Offline Points: 1006 |
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nice work! looks tight, were you able to weld 360 around the header tubes?
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69 SC/Rambler tribute 401/th400, 68 Rebel SST LSA, 66 F100 460/c6, 88 Merkur Xr4Ti, 71 Jaguar XJ6 LS1, 08 Supercharged Tundra
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jrsjav
AMC Apprentice Joined: Jul/17/2007 Location: Franklin, Wi Status: Offline Points: 75 |
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Remflex header gaskets are the real deal, I really like mine.
Life's to short to be stock! |
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Greyhounds_AMX
AMC Addicted Joined: Nov/14/2009 Location: Kansas City Status: Offline Points: 1268 |
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Thanks guys. It's been a fun project so far.
It was kind of tough to weld between the two center pipes, but I used two rear axle leaf spring wedge plates to open the gap between the two pipes slightly and that helped. I considered using the ball and socket setup at the collector, but heard a few problems with them. Next thought was the setup like Dennis has except with spring loaded bolts, as I see that on lots of Imports and it seems to work well. But it's typically only a single pipe so rotation around the joint is possible, but when you add a second pipe to the mix like in a V8 application there wouldn't be rotation, but translation. With that in mind I've decided to us a flex joint on each pipe. The flex joints alone should relieve enough stress to let the gaskets live longer, but I'm getting rid of them as well. The plan is to weld reducers right to the collectors, follow that with the flex pipe, and then join that to the rest of the system with a stainless band clamp. |
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1968 AMX 390 w/T5
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304-dude
AMC Addicted Joined: Sep/29/2008 Location: Central Illinoi Status: Offline Points: 9082 |
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Menace's idea was mine for my custom headers, though i will be doing the old 70s Vette style through air vents. Yep, i know our cars dont have air vents behind the tires. But who sez a Humpter can't. I have removed the fresh air box at both ends of my cowl to help facilitate for room and ventalation of the extra heat behind the fender.
I never liked the tri bolt collector with flat flanges. Doing offset grouping with ball socket design allows both for good sealing and ease of mating if off angle by a wisker. Though Greyhound, does a great job ironing out issues like pro. Great to see fixes not patches. Edited by 304-dude - Jun/11/2016 at 5:12pm |
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71 Javelin SST body
390 69 crank, 70 block & heads NASCAR SB2 rods & pistons 78 Jeep TH400 w/ 2.76 Low 50/50 Ford-AMC Suspension 79 F150 rear & 8.8 axles Ford Racing 3.25 gears & 9" /w Detroit locker |
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Rebel Machine
AMC Addicted Joined: Jul/03/2007 Location: Western Il Status: Offline Points: 5122 |
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Nicely done. Nice O'scope too!
-Steve- |
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farna
Supporter of TheAMCForum Moderator Lost Dealership Project Joined: Jul/08/2007 Location: South Carolina Status: Offline Points: 19676 |
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Really good job! The same technique would work for using a Jeep six cylinder header in a car.
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Frank Swygert
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raceral
AMC Apprentice Joined: Jul/16/2012 Location: BC Status: Offline Points: 61 |
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This style of clamp is also an option.
Al
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1969 390 AMX Black,leather, air, 8-Track, auto...
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