TheAMCForum.com Homepage
Forum Home Forum Home > The Garage > AMC V8 Engine Repair and Modifications
  New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - Dual Plane Intake
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Events   Register Register  Login Login

Click for TheAMCForum Rules / Click for PDF version of Forum Rules
Your donations help keep this valuable resource free and growing. Thank you.

Dual Plane Intake
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <12
Author
Message
 Rating: Topic Rating: 1 Votes, Average 5.00  Topic Search Topic Search  Topic Options Topic Options
jpnjim View Drop Down
AMC Addicted
AMC Addicted
Avatar

Joined: Nov/25/2007
Location: New England
Status: Offline
Points: 2752 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jpnjim Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul/09/2018 at 3:46am
This is the Cam data Ken:


"Cam is a Bullet custom ground on .904 lobes, 214/226 @ .050, .544/.576 lift with 1.7 rockers, 114 LSA in at 110"


and head specs for the 390:
  "heads flow 250-255 through an Edelbrock R4B intake at the lift of the cam and 275-280 through the heads at the lift."

from this thread:

Interesting build for me,
glad John took the time to post it up Clap
71 P-code 4spd Javelin/AMX
some Jeeps and some Fords
Back to Top
Boris Badanov View Drop Down
AMC Addicted
AMC Addicted
Avatar

Joined: Dec/14/2013
Location: NH USA
Status: Offline
Points: 4209 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Boris Badanov Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul/09/2018 at 5:28am
It well could be less to do with the
manifold runner design than manifold temperature.

Heat is horsepower but cold fuel makes more power.

There is an old rule that for every degree down
to somewhere in the 50 deg F range you make
an additional HP. Manifold temp is just as important.

Obviously the power to temp ratio has so many variables
as to be (more than) a little inaccurate. But cool fuel and manifolds
make more power and the air gap will result in both.

If the runner design was exactly the same the air gap
should make more power on any day above freezing temps.

Anyone remember running a cool can?
They work.
Gremlin Dreams
Back to Top
purple72Gremlin View Drop Down
AMC Addicted
AMC Addicted
Avatar
Charter Member

Joined: Jul/01/2007
Location: Illinois
Status: Offline
Points: 16611 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote purple72Gremlin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep/23/2018 at 3:42pm
Originally posted by Ken_Parkman Ken_Parkman wrote:

Fascinating data jcis - my thanks as well. Really good info; you've done a test I wanted to do. I agree with the conclusion on the air gap for a street car, but I've got a few qualifiers.

Gotta say up front I don't really like the air gap. It confuses me a bit, why have the race type no manifold heat, yet put a really small csa that cannot make a lot of power? Is it street or race? It seems like that may have been optimizing it for the 360, not the 401.

I've run them all on my street Rambler, and dynoed the air gap and torker - but not the same day Purple; however I tried to control the variables as much as possible. No question the air gap makes a terrific torque curve. Really good for scaring the wife when you roll into the throttle, but it's not actually any faster. That's why I always go back to a torker - it's faster and I'm a performance guy.

Your data tells me that an air gap will feel better for the average guy who does want to scare the wife, but is not likely to go to the track. Those small csa runners really boost the mid range. But those same small runners are too small for a 401 much over 5200 rpm. The power flat lines too early - it's choked. It might help an auto with a mild converter cause the shift rpm drop is so much, but not so good with a stick or an auto with a race converter.

The R4B data is real interesting, and to me shows it to be a better performance manifold. Makes sense with the bigger csa. You have 11 less inches, .5 less compression, and probably not as good a combustion chamber (dyno them with the same headers?) yet it made more power even with those limits. It's still gaining big time above 5000, not choked. Is the 5500 rpm the cam limit, (hydraulic?), or do you think it was a head csa limit?

With the limits of the inches and compression the R4B shows well and a better power intake. On the 401 I'd bet you would have seen more power. Probably faster at the track with the R4B, but the butt dyno will like the air gap.

A great test would be a R4B vs a Torker.


Well, I ran a torker for the first time...Im finding that Im not much for dual planes.......My 60 foot times actually improved, but my car is set up all wrong...
Back to Top
jcisworthy View Drop Down
AMC Addicted
AMC Addicted
Avatar

Joined: Jul/23/2009
Location: North Carolina
Status: Offline
Points: 2805 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jcisworthy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep/23/2018 at 4:34pm
The more I dyno with dual plane intakes, the more I am leaning on using torkers on just about everythig

The dual planes just do not seem to make the power of the torker

Even if there is some low end trade off, the torker is the intake to use for most applications in my opinion
Specializing in dyno services, engine building, and cylinder head porting

rbjracing.com
Phone Number 518-915-3203
Back to Top
purple72Gremlin View Drop Down
AMC Addicted
AMC Addicted
Avatar
Charter Member

Joined: Jul/01/2007
Location: Illinois
Status: Offline
Points: 16611 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote purple72Gremlin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep/23/2018 at 4:59pm
Originally posted by jcisworthy jcisworthy wrote:

The more I dyno with dual plane intakes, the more I am leaning on using torkers on just about everythig

The dual planes just do not seem to make the power of the torker

Even if there is some low end trade off, the torker is the intake to use for most applications in my opinion
Im finding that everytime I run a dual plane, I dont like it when I get used to it
Back to Top
SC397 View Drop Down
AMC Addicted
AMC Addicted
Avatar

Joined: Apr/30/2009
Location: Michigan
Status: Offline
Points: 5476 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote SC397 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep/23/2018 at 8:26pm
Originally posted by jcisworthy jcisworthy wrote:

The more I dyno with dual plane intakes, the more I am leaning on using torkers on just about everythig

The dual planes just do not seem to make the power of the torker

Even if there is some low end trade off, the torker is the intake to use for most applications in my opinion

The Torker is the best aftermarket intake aver made for a AMC.  The Air Gap is the second best. 
Lets move on..
Back to Top
purple72Gremlin View Drop Down
AMC Addicted
AMC Addicted
Avatar
Charter Member

Joined: Jul/01/2007
Location: Illinois
Status: Offline
Points: 16611 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote purple72Gremlin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep/23/2018 at 8:47pm
Originally posted by SC397 SC397 wrote:


Originally posted by jcisworthy jcisworthy wrote:

The more I dyno with dual plane intakes, the more I am leaning on using torkers on just about everythig

The dual planes just do not seem to make the power of the torker

Even if there is some low end trade off, the torker is the intake to use for most applications in my opinion

The Torker is the best aftermarket intake aver made for a AMC.  The Air Gap is the second best. 
Lets move on..

Believe it or not, Ive never had an air gap. Friends of mine do and like them. But in my case I suspect I wont like them either....lol
Back to Top
jpnjim View Drop Down
AMC Addicted
AMC Addicted
Avatar

Joined: Nov/25/2007
Location: New England
Status: Offline
Points: 2752 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jpnjim Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep/23/2018 at 9:25pm
Originally posted by purple72Gremlin purple72Gremlin wrote:

Originally posted by SC397 SC397 wrote:


Originally posted by jcisworthy jcisworthy wrote:

The more I dyno with dual plane intakes, the more I am leaning on using torkers on just about everythig

The dual planes just do not seem to make the power of the torker

Even if there is some low end trade off, the torker is the intake to use for most applications in my opinion

The Torker is the best aftermarket intake aver made for a AMC.  The Air Gap is the second best. 
Lets move on..

Believe it or not, Ive never had an air gap. Friends of mine do and like them. But in my case I suspect I wont like them either....lol


I just bought my first Air Gap,
it's for a smallish-cam 9:1cr 401 that will go in my Humpster with a 4spd (2.64 1st) and 3.15's.

Figured I'd give the small runner Air Gap RPM a try with the tall rear gear.

I measured the plenum volume of the original Performer, Air Gap RPM and the R4b,
and got 2.5L for the Std Performer
 2.6L for the Air Gap 
and 4.0L for the R4b
 in this thread:

my best guess is the smaller size of the newer intakes is because 
attitude towards velocity changed from when the R4b came out to when the Performer was developed,
and (I suspect) both performers were sized with 360's in mind instead of 390-401's with the R4b.
71 P-code 4spd Javelin/AMX
some Jeeps and some Fords
Back to Top
PROSTOCKTOM View Drop Down
Supporter of TheAMCForum
Supporter of TheAMCForum
Avatar

Joined: Jun/20/2010
Location: Indiana
Status: Offline
Points: 2450 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote PROSTOCKTOM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep/23/2018 at 9:48pm
The Torker might become the #2 best intake if this new intake turns out to be what I think it will.

Tom
Back to Top
PHAT69AMX View Drop Down
AMC Addicted
AMC Addicted
Avatar

Joined: Jul/07/2007
Location: West Virginia
Status: Offline
Points: 5919 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote PHAT69AMX Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep/23/2018 at 10:30pm
Air Gap while excellent under provides for relatively superior AMC Air Flow...


Link to a Short YouTube Burnout Video
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <12
  Share Topic   

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Forum Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 12.03
Copyright ©2001-2019 Web Wiz Ltd.

This page was generated in 1.777 seconds.
All content of this site Copyright © 2018 TheAMCForum unless otherwise noted, all rights reserved.
PROBLEMS LOGGING IN or REGISTERING:
If you have problems logging in or registering, then please contact a Moderator or