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1960 rambler rebel transmission swap

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willclassic View Drop Down
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    Posted: Feb/01/2018 at 4:07pm
I have a 1960 rambler rebel with the 250 V8.  Right now it has the 3 on the tree with overdrive.  I have a change to buy a parts car that is a 1960 classic with the 6 cylinder and an automatic. Is the auto trans behind the 6 cylinder the same that was used behind the V8?  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Buzzman72 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb/02/2018 at 6:05am
58-61 or so transmissions were push-button controlled. I've been told it's a real tough act to get the shifting cables [?] in proper adjustment.

In about 1970 my brother drove a '61 Classic six and put an elm tree into the hood about even with the front suspension crossmember. We were able to get the body work lined out, but we had to get used to driving the car without reverse...because if the cables were adjusted so that reverse worked, we had no forward gears. And if we got forward gears, we had no reverse. [Damn site better to have no reverse.]

So I'm thinking such a swap might be more aggravation than it's worth. Even by 1970 there were few techs left who could adjust the trans controls on those. I'd wager it's like finding chicken teeth today.

Edited by Buzzman72 - Nov/25/2018 at 10:53am
Buzzman72...void where prohibited, your mileage may vary, objects in mirror may be closer than they appear, and alcohol may intensify any side effects.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote willclassic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb/02/2018 at 6:35am
My first car in 1970 was a 60 classic. Got me thru tech school. Front end bottom spindles fell apart twice though. Lucky both times at low speed on dirt roads. That was first project on this Rebel. Rebuilt whole suspension. Havent decided about installing auto yet. Need to find out if 6 cylinder auto will bolt to v8.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tyrodtom Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb/02/2018 at 6:53am
The bellhousing bolt pattern is different between the 6 and V-8,  the transmission case and bellhousing separate,  and the bolt pattern at the case may be the same for the two transmissions,  but I don't think you'd want to do that,  the sixes transmission is a lighter duty transmission than the V8.
66 American SW, 66 American 2dr, 82 J10, 70 Hornet, Pound, Va.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote willclassic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb/02/2018 at 8:48am
Thanks for replies.  Going thru parts information does show v8 auto to be heavier duty.  Probably just stick with manual w/overdrive.  The 3 speed on the column is very confusing to young people at the shows.  Most have never seen one.  There is a barn find 60 Classic Deluxe on Craigslist near Booneville Mo. if anyone is interested.  Few pictures shows it to be pretty straight.  Maybe someone can resurrect it.  Too many projects and not enough room, or I would be tempted.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote farna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb/02/2018 at 10:50am
In 1960 the V-8 and six used the same basic M-8 trans. The V-8 version was probably calibrated to a different internal pressure and may have used more clutches though. You should be able to build the six cylinder auto to go behind the V-8, but as noted, you will still need the V-8 bell housing (trannys interchange on the bells). Converter and flexplate are different as well, so you'd still need some V-8 parts.

I'd prefer the manual with OD. If you have issues with the OD let me know, usually easy to fix. You should have a T-85 trans. It' heavy enough, just remember not to down-shift into first -- no synchro on first gear! Three speed column shifts aren't fast, and the column can get loose and sloppy, but they work great when adjusted properly... and not worn out!

A universal floor shifter will work, but you will have to do extensive work on the mounting bracket or make your own. Most floor shifters bolt to the bracket with a single large pivot bolt. The OD makes it hard to make one fit, but it's doable. Might have to offset the shifter to the driver's side a little more, which might make bending the shift rods a bit harder. A bit of trial and error and it works. I did it years ago, can't remember what shifter or any details, was a T-96 with OD.  I would suggest pulling the trans and mounting the shifter first, then measure for where the hole needs to be. May have to get creative with shift lever with a bench seat...
Frank Swygert
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote willclassic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb/02/2018 at 1:11pm
I believe I will stick with the manual.  There is something calming about going thru the gears with the column shift.  You can't get in a hurry, so might as well relax and enjoy the process.  My Rebel had some slop, but turned out to be easy to fix.  Shifts nice now.  The overdrive is not working.  I have troubleshot and repaired all the electric issues.  New solenoid and confirmed everything works by jacking and running car with voltmeter attached at pertinent points.  Also, vehicle free wheels when overdrive is engaged as it is supposed to.  But still not getting overdrive.  I am guessing that something is wrong internally.  Don't understand all I know about things inside.  Planning on pulling it out and apart soon.  Got seals leaking everywhere anyway.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tomj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb/04/2018 at 10:43pm
good decision i think -- not just for practical reasons, but aesthetically, autos are a dime a dozen, and a good column shift with OD is unique! i loved my three speed OD setup (even though the T96 trans behind the six is junk). when you get that overdrive going i think you'll like it once you work out how it behaves.

its very hard to describe, but easy enough to operate.

as you've already noticed, it's pretty much an anti-theft device as well!

1960 Rambler Super two-door wagon, OHV auto
1961 Roadster American, 195.6 OHV, T5
http://www.ramblerLore.com

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote farna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb/05/2018 at 9:22am
You have checked all the electrical connections and contacts? There is a set of contact points in the governor and in the solenoid. Check those and make sure they are clean.  Other contact points are in the relay -- you may need to pry the case off and clean those as well, but the governor and solenoid points are the most likely culprits. Points are in the top cover of the governor, the case comes off the solenoid by removing the two screws on the end -- don't have to remove solenoid, but will be hard to clean the points with it in the car. You said you've checked everything with a voltmeter and have a new solenoid though.

The solenoid may work on a test bench, but not have enough power to push the locking pawl in. But you've got a new one...

When you install the solenoid, it should be twisted to the right (counter clockwise) about 45 degrees, inserted, then twisted to the left to lock into the pawl. I think that's right... in any case, when you put it in the two bolt holes won't line up and the end will slip all the way into the locking pawl. Twist it to line the bolt holes up and the solenoid sholdn't pull back out. It might come out a little, but won't come all the way out. If it does pull out the end isn't locked into the pawl and it may not engage OD. The only other thing to look at is the cable adjustment. If the cable doesn't push the lock-out lever all the way rearward to the stop, OD may not engage. Arm forward should be OD locked out...  You might want to disconnect the cable and push the arm backwards as far as it will go then check again... after checking the solenoid to make sure it's locked in the pawl.
Frank Swygert
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