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FUEL PUMP, oem?

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gretchenthegremlin View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gretchenthegremlin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: FUEL PUMP, oem?
    Posted: Dec/01/2017 at 11:52am
I know it can kinda be sketchy to buy a NOS part with rubber, as it may be dry rotted or damaged, but I was curious to see if anyone knows where to get a NOS fuel pump from a reliable source. If not, what fuel pump do you guys run? I have a 73 gremlin x 258. 

I have recently been working on my 1986 corolla sr5, and it also is carbed with a mechanical fuel pump... I took off some kind of aftermarket "made in USA" one. It was so much smaller than the actual Toyota one. Took ordering it from 3 places, having them call saying it was not in stock, and then finally found it for 100 buckaroos. Totally worth it though. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bigbadgreen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec/01/2017 at 4:59pm
I'd try Rock auto.Problem with nos fuel pumps is the new ethanol gas destroys any old rubber components.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote vinny Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec/01/2017 at 6:09pm
I don't know when ethanol came in but when the 196 parted company from my car I think its fuel pump was original to the engine and still in good working order. Probably that is also true with the 67 engine in the car now but who knows, maybe it is just running on luck. Rock auto only lists a pump for a car that has electric wipers so a NOS pump is probably a good find if it has the vacuum pump on it. I am guessing the 73 Gremlin has electric wipers so should be no problem in finding a fuel pump for it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pacerman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec/01/2017 at 6:33pm
I have a Carter from an AMC vendor in Kenosha.. It probably left the factory in a lunch box some time in the early 80's. PM me if you want one for $20 plus shipping.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tomj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec/02/2017 at 12:10am
Originally posted by gretchenthegremlin gretchenthegremlin wrote:

I know it can kinda be sketchy to buy a NOS part with rubber, as it may be dry rotted or damaged, but I was curious to see if anyone knows where to get a NOS fuel pump from a reliable source. If not, what fuel pump do you guys run? I have a 73 gremlin x 258. 

all old rubber is bad rubber. it goes bad on the shelf, stored indoors in a plastic bag. there may be exceptions but i've not found one. hoses, fuel pumps, gaskets, suspension parts. nothing seems spared. 

most of the "new" AMC parts were made in the 80s, or maybe 90's, i dunno. but it's now all very old. 

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tomj View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tomj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec/02/2017 at 12:13am
73? can't you just use one of the new pumps from RockAuto as suggested? were there still vacuum wipers in 73?!

if you have vacuum wipers, send it off to Peter Stathes for rebuild. he does good work last i knew.


1960 Rambler Super two-door wagon, OHV auto
1961 Roadster American, 195.6 OHV, T5
http://www.ramblerLore.com

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote amcenthusiast Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec/02/2017 at 3:09pm
IMO, keep the original fuel pump if original to the car (sheesh; even a date coded master brake cover can ask for $300 on eBay & a show car owner would love to have that part in order to take first place at the car show) ...just put it in a box, on a shelf for safe keeping until the aftermarket industry or manufacturing industry 'wakes up' and makes some 1/16" thick cloth reinforced Viton we can use for fuel pump diaphragm replacement material.

-Until then, just install one of those mini-cube electric fuel pumps like Edlebrock sells for daily driver type cars and you'll be done; no more worry about gasohol diluting the engine oil causing viscosity breakdown and rapid engine wear.

True true a dry rotted old fuel line can be misdiagnosed for a bad fuel pump; the price of replacing the send unit to gas line hose is nothing compared to the hassle of the car seemingly 'running out of gas' in the middle of nowhere... so typical.

IMO every AM vehicle owner should study this site:

https://www.epa.gov/gasoline-standards

Time to get ready; Gasohol is here to stay and E15 is 'right around the corner'.

Notice how carburetors basically died out when the law to have E10 nationwide began in '85 (by '87/8 AM had fuel injection > this makes a sealed fuel system on the pressure side, unaffected by rapid evaporation)

Furthermore, Nitrile aka 'Buna N' material is not rated 'excellent' for ethanol compatibility (but Viton is) see chart here:

http://mossrubber.com/pdfs/Chem_Res.pdf

...there is a difference between 'ethanol tolerant', 'ethanol resistant' and 'ethanol compatible'!

I bet tomj can tell us about Weber two barrel gasohol compatibility.

For now the safest carb recommendation for me to advocate is the Carter metering rod type two barrel carb they used in the mid-sixties; that unit has no nitrile diaphragms to seep ethanol laced fuel into the engine.

When in doubt about old fuel system parts, sniff the dipstick to check for fuel diluted engine oil.

Engines that are doing this will appear to have a lower oil consumption rate but they will look to have leaky gaskets; the ethanol is seeping in to 'top up' the engine oil and causing leaky gaskets because the solvents eat up the old school Buna N/nitrile seals also

...this makes the old school 'fiber' type rear main seals look good all over again!

I could go on and on about this topic -much to discuss

Please copy the the two links above and pass them along to the next car owner who asks this or a similar question.


443 XRV8 Gremlin YouTube video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?reload=9&v=2DmFOKRuzUc
XRV8 Race Parts website: http://amcramblermarlin.1colony.com/
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pdok Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec/02/2017 at 3:51pm
Guys, what are we talking about?  This is a Carter M6737, per Carter's website.  It's 20 bucks new on Amazon.
76 Grem X 258/904,4.0 head/MPFI, Comp X250H cam, Hughes springs, Clifford header, serpentine swap.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 6768rogues Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec/02/2017 at 6:51pm
Jeeps used 258 engines for years. Any parts store or Jeep catalog can probably get you a fuel pump.
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tomj View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tomj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec/06/2017 at 12:56am
if the fuel pump you have is SCREWED TOGETHER you can have it rebuilt/rebuild it. you never told is if it's got the vacuum booster on top for vacuum wipers, i would think not for 1973, but i dunno. you tell us.

if its crimped together, than you probably have to buy a new one. there;s a bunch of minor variations (fuel inlet and outlet positions) but for 199/232/258, they should all bolt into the hole and deliver fuel in a compatible way, "correct" or not.

"new" pumps will be resistant to new fuels. define "new", lol. 

(all "new" weber carbs are modern-fuel ready. zero issues. it's only an issue for old carbs. i hav enot had a problem with fuel or hoses or rubber in 10+ years because i've shot-gunned all old rubber and hoses without even looking at them. i dont find it worth even thinking about it.)

you should outright replace all -- ALL -- fuel hose in an old car. its easy, its cheap, and it never, ever hurts. leaking fuel on the ground is simply a bad idea never mind fires, etc.


there *are* good inexpensive electric fuel pumps out there. i have a Carter in my car, about $40, buy 'em anywhere. they put out a smooth and steady 3 PSI pressure at far more gallons/minute my 200 hp six will consume. the catch with pretty much ALL electric pumps is that that are designed to PUSH, not PULL.

mechanical pumps create vacuum with a diaphragm that is fine pulling fuel. electric pumps must be installed back by the tank so they can push. they also need to be below the "water line", eg. be gravity fed to prime them since that cannot pull fuel for crap. they need to be wet the whole time, if they spin dry they overheat and die early deaths.

i would offer this advice -- the shortest path, the easiest path to continued success and reliability is usually to keep it dead stock. sometimes that costs more. AMC did a fine job sizing components, if you have a good one it iwll be more than fine. a cheaper pump (eg. a good Carter electric) won't "save money", or work better, all things being equal. in foolish projects like mine, i changed so many things that installing a pushed pump out back was "easy".

but it's easy to underestimate how much tiny and subtle accommodation manufacturers make to asemble a reliably working car. you can mess with it, but you gotta juggle all the trivia that they did (and that's mostly been forgotten!)

1960 Rambler Super two-door wagon, OHV auto
1961 Roadster American, 195.6 OHV, T5
http://www.ramblerLore.com

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