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199 Model 1931 Carb Questions |
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tomj
AMC Addicted Joined: Jan/27/2010 Location: earth Status: Offline Points: 7544 |
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OK well i guess i'm a party pooper! lol i just read the entire thread again. it's good that you got AutoLine to send you the correct throttle shaft that accepts that front-mounted return spring. it's a safety hazard without it. if you are still unable to make it idle right, next time you have the carb off, see if the throttle shaft is loose in the body. it should not "rattle" or have excessive play. that will leak enough air at idle to prevent proper idle mix setup. on nearly any carb, the idle mixture screw setting should be fairly "sharp" -- when you're close to the right mix, 1/4 turn too lean (screw in) will audibly drop the idle speed. (quarter too rich will be "softer" but should also drop idle speed.) i don't know the 1931's; but the mix screw should not be out more than two turns. if it is, that's also indicative of air leak. on mine, the linkages around the two idle speed screws ("stop" screws, the left/front one with the big w3asher is all-warmed-up idle speed (speed, not mix) were wrong or bent. there's a little bent tang on the throttle lever that was striking the choke unloader (the lever with the weight towards the valve cover) and causing the choke to move and increase speed. it was hard to see and visualize. i had to bend the throttle lever to increase clearance. this should absolutely have been caught by even a modest rebuild job; operate the linkage to check for interference. sheesh. i'm dismayed with AutoLine. junk quality. i bought parts for my Carter YF from Mike's Carburetor. https://www.carburetor-parts.com/ i emailed them abourt the flat-accell-pump-rod Holley 1931; they have no parts for it. so i bought from Rockauto hoping i'd get a round-shaft carb, but instead this junker (already sent back). Mike's is a small shop. quality all around. no bull. and no replacement parts for the 1931. at least they didn't lie to me. if you ultimately give up on this carb, there is a Carter YF with the right throttle linkage. it's a far, far better design, parts are widely available. the catch here is that the air cleaner for the 1931 will not fit. you'll need an air filter with a 2-3/4" opening. it's only slightly taller. i had to bend the choke stove to fit. Edited by tomj - Aug/13/2019 at 9:03pm |
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1960 Rambler Super two-door wagon, OHV auto
1961 Roadster American, 195.6 OHV, T5 http://www.ramblerLore.com |
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Fisherwerke
AMC Apprentice Joined: Mar/12/2019 Location: Grand Rapids, M Status: Offline Points: 34 |
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Hi tomj,
Definitely not a party pooper. I see you've had trouble with the carb like I have but with me not being used to this carb at all I may have missed some of the slop you discovered on yours. I will definitely take some notes and check mine closer. Its definitely not a nice rebuild. I was unhappy with the quality right away. I used your instructions to tune in the carb but had to give up due to the alternator not charging. I just replaced that last night and started the transmission service. I think it just needs a couple more adjustments then I can see if its ready to move under its own power.
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1968 Rambler American 199
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billd
Moderator Group Forum Administrator Joined: Jun/27/2007 Location: Iowa Status: Offline Points: 30894 |
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I HATE REMAN PARTS. Period. Perhaps Tom, you have read my rants about them, but having been in the business for over 4.5 decades, and having had to deal with reman junk - and having actually TOURED facilities.......... it's scary. I have shelves of carbs - some reman, and what they do to "make it fit xxx model" is sometimes funny, sometimes sad....... Same for reman alternators - I have many dozens of alternators in my shop, many are "reman" from the past or even recent years and it's no bloody wonder people have to go through 2 or 3 to get one that works right. Wrong parts, stators patched up, paint over RUST, a mix of whatever bolts they had to hold it together. Some folks get really lucky and get a great reman part first time - maybe two or three times in a row, and swear by them - me, after having spent decades fixing problems caused by reman parts - I can't ever recommend them. Carbs are the worst........... |
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billd
Moderator Group Forum Administrator Joined: Jun/27/2007 Location: Iowa Status: Offline Points: 30894 |
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Rockauto never touches or sees most of the stuff they sell - if any of it at all. They are a seller - things are typically drop shipped from their suppliers. They also only go by what their supplier tells them. This means if a part is wrong but their supplier says it's right, RA says it's right and won't do anything. I could give two great examples - one a selector shaft seal for MOPAR automatic transmissions, another for the steering stabilizer for Eagle - Gabriel had the totally wrong part listed, it was huge, too long, too big around, just plain wrong, you couldn't make it fit with a torch and big hammer. It was WRONG. I told RA they sent the wrong part - AND I took detailed photos of the original and the crap they sent me - showing how it was at least an inch too long and couldn't possibly fit next to the cross member. No way - still, they said that's what Gabriel said was right, so I was stuck. Same on that seal - the seal they sent was the OUTPUT seal - huge compared to the selector shaft seal. See - Rockauto doesn't stock parts, they take their vendors parts list and put into their tree and when you order, they order and it's sent to you with an RA label. At least that's how they used to do business. They stocked nothing. It was started out of a garage. If THEY screw up it's usually good for you - you keep the wrong part and they send you the right part. But if it's a vendor problem, they will not make it right. They do sell some very good parts - brake parts if you buy the NAME BRAND STUFF - Bendix, Wagner, and certain others - but stay clear of the discount brands! |
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Heavy 488
AMC Addicted Joined: Apr/27/2019 Location: In the Status: Offline Points: 3553 |
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The whole replacement parts market is manufacturing junk. Evev OE replacement parts are packaged made in China. I've had to send some back for failure within a week. Sad when youre willing to pay up front in the hopes of doing it once only having to do it over.
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purple72Gremlin
AMC Addicted Charter Member Joined: Jul/01/2007 Location: Illinois Status: Offline Points: 16611 |
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tomj
AMC Addicted Joined: Jan/27/2010 Location: earth Status: Offline Points: 7544 |
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you won't get an argument from me. i was in the spot where i had a literally-unbuildable carb -- the flat-rod version -- and hoping to get one with a round rod. FAIL. i may do something creative with the metal parts, but it won't go on a car. i stand by my assessment of the Holley carb(s), design-wise. the sideways bowl is a stupid unsafe design. the Carter YF on now is just fine. haven't checked jetting yet. i will eventually. |
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1960 Rambler Super two-door wagon, OHV auto
1961 Roadster American, 195.6 OHV, T5 http://www.ramblerLore.com |
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tomj
AMC Addicted Joined: Jan/27/2010 Location: earth Status: Offline Points: 7544 |
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they're a very modern thing -- the drop-shipper. it can be a successful business model. i liken them to the giant corporate farmers in the California Central Valley -- they draw deeply from the "well" of scattered suppliers/warehousers/manufacturers of auto parts. they do a great job of coordinating/consolidating various parts databases (the best single-source cross-ref site ever!) and /most of the time/ do precisely what they claim to do. but i think they are also sucking the ground dry. this sounds funny... but many of their prices are waaay too cheap. they're clearing out old-fashioned warehouses at a crazy rate. i really think we are going to have some serious old-car parts shortages very soon. i'm stockpiling like some crazy [Rambler] survivalist. no one reputable is making new brake drums -- period. wheel cyls can be relined (not cheap, but then they last forever -- assuming you can find cups), shoes relined, drums need replacement after one or two cuts. a friend of mine that runs an old style repair shop spends half his time tracking down parts. some stuff is already scarce. we were grousing about it just this morning. and yeah, carbs are the worst! subtle, delicate, very few people know how to _deeply_ work with them, or adapt realistic carbs to cars that need them.
Edited by tomj - Aug/22/2019 at 10:15pm |
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1960 Rambler Super two-door wagon, OHV auto
1961 Roadster American, 195.6 OHV, T5 http://www.ramblerLore.com |
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