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73 Javelin brake and suspension project

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Lyle View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lyle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/03/2018 at 7:37am
***Edit now*** 1973 seems to be the special year, lucky you:), there is the transmission NSS and there may or may not be the floor shifter/column switch. Sorry this is a TSM or vehicle specific question.
Floor and column switches started to be standard requirement in 1973.
TSM 3-23 shows the NSS from the transmission straight to the start solenoid - single wire. 
 


Edited by Lyle - Apr/03/2018 at 8:15am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lyle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/03/2018 at 12:06pm
Is it possible the idler arm length being the problem?
My parts book has 3189512 for AMX/Javelin 68, 69 and all but Hornet and Gremlin 70-73, then nothing listed in 74 AMX/Javelin?
Gremlin, Hornet are 3195174 70-73 and 3224141 74-76
Matador has a different listing 3224142
If these are different lengths and it was just switched out at some point then this may be your problem.
My 69 is 5-1/2" CC. Offset approximately 1". And doesn't look anything like your post 23MAR2018 at 10:14 AM.
I'll try and get a picture to post.



Edited by Lyle - Apr/03/2018 at 1:49pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mopar_guy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/03/2018 at 3:05pm
I think your fatter replacement ends are what's closing the gap.  Maybe these pictures can help. They are all original ends, center link and idler arm. (just ignore the non AMC motor) Wink






"Hemilina" My 1973, 5.7 Hemi swapped Javelin
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote billd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/03/2018 at 6:34pm
Originally posted by Lyle Lyle wrote:

Is it possible the idler arm length being the problem?
My parts book has 3189512 for AMX/Javelin 68, 69 and all but Hornet and Gremlin 70-73, then nothing listed in 74 AMX/Javelin?
Gremlin, Hornet are 3195174 70-73 and 3224141 74-76
Matador has a different listing 3224142
If these are different lengths and it was just switched out at some point then this may be your problem.
My 69 is 5-1/2" CC. Offset approximately 1". And doesn't look anything like your post 23MAR2018 at 10:14 AM.
I'll try and get a picture to post.


It's the original idler arm - and the drag link is very parallel and not tracking in or out or up or down from one side to the other. I'd bet if you put a level between idler and pitman the bubble would be centered. 
All I did on the idler arm was replace the bushing since the rest was ok. The bushing is set per the TSM and in as far as the original was.

I note the tie rods are a little different in that they are beefier and thicker where the joint is.

I didn't get time to do photos - having our driveway totally replaced and a retaining wall extended and changed and boy is it muddy, and cold and wet here.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote billd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/03/2018 at 6:59pm
OK, here are some earlier photos - and I bet that it's the "meat" of the new tie rods that are doing it, especially after looking at the originals and then the photo of that poor car with the foreign engine in it - or else someone moved their oil filter back a ways.......... anyway, the original are thinner and the meed of them is on the side where the socket is - where these have meat where the fitting is............

i also post these as if I've done something dumb I'd sure not mind being told about it!!

Anyway, the outers are similar to the inners - check out the thickness or beef these have - 



Now if you can, think back to your high school GEOMETRY - the pitman and idler swing in an arc - not straight left or right. And when the wheels are straight, the idler and pitman are at their furthest back in that arc and note that's also where the inner tie rod ends line up perfectly with the forward-most part of the cross member. In other words, as you turn, when the wheels are centered the drag link is as far back in its arc as it's going to swing and that coincides with the tie rods lining up with the furthest forward part of the cross member.
In this next photo the wheels are straight ahead, the idler and pitman as far back as they go, and that means the drag link is back in its swing - and see how the tie rods line up perfectly with the engine support piece.



Yes, I know it's filthy, dirty, greasy, etc. the beast has some leaks and is old........... and the PO did't really seem to care.





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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lyle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/03/2018 at 8:26pm
I was looking at the wording of your post "PLUGS would smack the crossmember",  and that was what had me looking at the idler arm. I noticed your's was different from mine and researched it more. If your's is the same CC then yes, I do know the geometry and the tie rod end being beefier could be the problem.
Only trying to help. The parts are different, same CC or not.
I wonder if there is an offset difference that provides clearance? Lower the idler end and clear the crossmember? The angle of Mopar_Guy's pictures show that if the idler were straighter it may interfere with the crossmember but hard to tell. Have to be in your shoes.
Would do nothing for the outboard tie rod ends though. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote billd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/03/2018 at 8:33pm
Outers are fine - only the inners are touching anything. No clearance issues on outers - at least with stock type/size wheels and tires, etc.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote billd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/04/2018 at 6:22pm
I have the butt-end of the car raised, lower ends of the rear shocks disconnected (and those shocks are SHOT and the lower mounts busted up - dang)
Also have nuts removed from from spring bolts, shackle nuts and sides removed, brake line disconnected, parking brake cables disconnected, drive shaft dropped, basically all but ready to pull the original differential.
I got curious and pulled the right brake drum - about the thickness of two post cards left on the linings. Good time to make the swap!! Brakes are perfect on the replacement plus I replaced the wheel cylinders even though those on the replacement differential looked ok....... as cheap as they are, and all else being new, it seemed silly to leave old wheel cylinders.
Finished running new lines on the replacement rear. The bolts that came with the replacement springs were VERY good, so that made it very easy to plate them so now they are basically like new.
HOPEFULLY tomorrow get the rear end actually swapped, but now I see I need to find shocks - bummer. 
In the end, all brake lines, all brake hoses, cylinders, etc. will be new so brakes should be good assuming that combo valve functions ok. That's the only part still bugging me. Time will tell.

Yeah, the replacement differential is a mess - I hate how it looks, but I have other stuff piling up badly, other cars to work on, other things to do so this has to get done. 
Besides, the original is FAAAR worse........ and I was really glad I was changing the steel lines - those on the differential under the car were a mess and even those on the replacement differential were actually flaky with rust. 
These C/N lines won't rust!






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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote purple72Gremlin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/04/2018 at 8:01pm
whats the gear ratio?  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote billd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/04/2018 at 8:06pm
3.15  (and limited slip) for the one going in. That was easy - I marked a drum and the yoke and turned the yoke until the drum made a full revolution and the yoke went just over three full turns, about three and a fifth turns. That figures reeeeaaaaly close to 3.15

I suspect same for the one I'm taking out but since it's an open carrier it's not as simple as turning the yoke until the wheels make one full rotation. 

I need to find out what the one I'm taking out is as I may have to switch speedometer driven gears.....
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