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what type of gas |
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farna
Supporter of TheAMCForum Moderator Lost Dealership Project Joined: Jul/08/2007 Location: South Carolina Status: Offline Points: 19692 |
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Posted: Aug/18/2017 at 6:50am |
Well, a new carb kit should have a solid brass or Delrin tipped needle that is compatible with ethanol. I can understand the bit better idle when cold with non-ethanol though. One reason more than 10% ethanol doesn't work well in cars made for normal driving is cold weather performance. E-85 is blended with less alcohol for winter as well -- it's not really E-85 in winter.
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Frank Swygert
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MaxiBlue
AMC Apprentice Joined: Jul/25/2012 Location: Wisconsin Status: Offline Points: 38 |
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I personally don't mind what others do, it's their car. But I noticed with my gremlin (232, Carter YF) that the needle and seat in the carb stick when I use ethanol fuel. The car would run out of fuel with a full tank, and I'll pull the top of the carb, and the bowl is empty. I put it together, and it overflows through the vent. Next time, it will run fine for a little while and then run out of fuel again. That float/ needle and seat were driving me nuts for about a day and a half. Through trying different needles and seats and then trying different fuels, I found that the ethanol added fuel was the culprit. I can get fuel without ethanol, but it's only the premium around here. I use premium to avoid ethanol, and the needle and seat have stopped sticking. I've even tested it with two gas cans, swapping a hose from the pump from can to can. It makes a difference in my car almost immediately. I've heard (only rumor) that the old rubber tipped needles aren't compatible with ethanol and swell with the fuel and that causes them to stick. From my own personal experience, I buy this. The gremlin gets shell premium. I've also noticed that it idles better (especially when cold) on the non ethanol fuel. These are my observations on my car. If you have differing results with your car, just keep doing what works for you. I will likewise. Scott
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6PakBee
Supporter of TheAMCForum Charter Member Joined: Jul/01/2007 Location: North Dakota Status: Online Points: 5458 |
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I have no dog in this fight. I buy the cheapest gas that will work acceptably. But I do note this post is going the same path as the synthetic oil one.
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Roger Gazur
1969 'B' Scheme SC/Rambler 1970 RWB 4-spd Machine 1970 Sonic Silver auto AMX All project cars. Forum Cockroach |
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vinny
Supporter of TheAMCForum Joined: Jan/05/2012 Location: Calgary Status: Offline Points: 2837 |
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I also read that article by the engineer that did oil testing which basically stated that with the addition of additives most oils performed worse than without them. I believe that.
I had a problem with cheap gas bought at a place called Discount gas in Edmonton back in the winter of 77-78. It was around minus 40 and it took me a couple of days to get my car started. After that when cold I would buy the premium at a big name station and car started much better. I don't think they put ethanol in it back then. My Rambler has 155,000 miles on it now and onto its second engine but still AFAIK both engines with original fuel pumps and carburetors. I buy the regular with up to 10 % ethanol without problems. One thing when using ethanol you don;t need to worry about gas lines freezing up. |
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electricbluesc/360
AMC Apprentice Joined: Aug/16/2014 Location: Wisconsin Status: Offline Points: 236 |
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sc/360 hornet
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Ollie
AMC Addicted Joined: Sep/17/2012 Location: Brandon, MS Status: Offline Points: 2803 |
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I don't own a timing light.
I set everything with my vacuum gauge. Every engine has a sweet spot. Having AMC Fun, Ollie |
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1966 American Convertible -- "The Rambler"..SOLD
1974 Postal Jeep -- "Rapid Delivery"...SOLD 1969 Rambler 220 post car--"Road Warrior" 1989 Jeep Comanche Pioneer, 4.0L, auto, 2wd |
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farna
Supporter of TheAMCForum Moderator Lost Dealership Project Joined: Jul/08/2007 Location: South Carolina Status: Offline Points: 19692 |
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Now that last statement is a fact! Modern gas will generally take more timing too, so set timing by the book to start with, then go out and find a hill to pull and bump it up until you get ping, then lower a bit. Might want to put a light on it to see where it is, record for future use. Setting it "by ear" like that on a cool day will likely require a slight adjustment on a hot day (more likely o get ping on a hot day), but it's the only way I know of to get the most timing on the gasoline you are running.
You need a "break-in additive" to break a new flat tappet cam in regardless of type of build -- stock to full race. After that regular "cheap" oil will be fine for stock valve springs as long as the oil has an API rating. Non-rated oils (some race oils) could be suspect, as they can be formulated however the company wants. Current oil is SN, but SF or more (F-N in the alphabet) is suitable. Actually, SD started in 1967 and would technically be fine for most of our cars. but the SAE only recommends SF or newer in all vehicles. I got to have a discussion with an oil company engineer a few years ago regarding the removal of zinc. He stated that it was safe for all stock motors with the exception of some of the 1960s "hi-po" models. The general rule is anything with valve springs under around 300# of pressure open needs more high pressure lubricant than current oil standards have. Crane sells a 330# spring for AMC six cylinders that should still be fine, but that's on the edge. So if you're building a race engine with a high lift/long duration cam and stiff springs you need to run an off-road racing oil or use an additive. I use the break-in additive to break a flat tappet motor in, then use it in the first oil change just to be safe, but none after that. There are other additives in modern oil that make if safer than older oil formulations. The engineer stated he'd not run older oil in anything. From the SAE specs page, SM oil was "Introduced in October 2010 for 2011 and older vehicles, designed to provide improved high temperature deposit protection for pistons, more stringent sludge control, and seal compatibility (than older spec oil)." All the stuff about ethanol fuels is a joke, just like taking the lead out of gasoline ages ago. There is a little increase in wear with unleaded gas in an engine designed for leaded gas, but for 90% of engines it's very little. There is a noticeable increase on hard worked engines, such as heavy trucks (towing) and race engines. Even then it's in the 20-25% range -- for most it's 10% or less extra wear. So if you would rebuild a head at 100K miles, you do it at 90K or so instead. Even then valve seat inserts aren't really necessary -- the valves can generally be ground twice before the seats start to wear down into the head to the point inserts are required. Inserts are common enough now that they are relatively inexpensive to have installed, so you may as well if the engine is being rebuilt. Generally $15-25 a seat (if doing more than one), and you really only need to do the exhaust seats -- no extra wear on intake seats. |
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Frank Swygert
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6768rogues
AMC Addicted Joined: Jul/03/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 6241 |
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Any modern gas formulation is very different from gas 40 or 50 years ago and an old car needs to be tuned to run on modern gas. When they are, they run great.
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Content intended for mature audiences. If you experience nausea or diarrhea, stop reading and seek medical attention.
Located usually near Rochester, NY and sometimes central FL. |
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Ollie
AMC Addicted Joined: Sep/17/2012 Location: Brandon, MS Status: Offline Points: 2803 |
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I agree with this statement. I put a Carter YF on the 199 that was in The Rambler. It was a factory size jet. It was getting 18-20 MPG. I went up one size jet and my mpg jumped to 20-22. (That is the motor and transmission that is now in Rapid Delivery) Having AMC Fun, Ollie |
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1966 American Convertible -- "The Rambler"..SOLD
1974 Postal Jeep -- "Rapid Delivery"...SOLD 1969 Rambler 220 post car--"Road Warrior" 1989 Jeep Comanche Pioneer, 4.0L, auto, 2wd |
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Rogue Rod
AMC Apprentice Joined: Jun/06/2011 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 90 |
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Thanks to all for their detailed responses. Lots of detail to digest, I appreciate it.
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