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does not shut off |
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matty 401
AMC Addicted Joined: Jul/06/2007 Location: Iowa Status: Offline Points: 1727 |
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Posted: Jun/18/2017 at 5:18pm |
i have a 1972 Matador with a 401 and a crane conversion on the ing and a accel super coil and now for some reason it does not want to shut off with the key any idea where i can start looking
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72 matador 401 the beast
79 concord 2 door 72 matador 304 grasshopper 68 Rogue 406 93 Cherokee 4.0 5 speed |
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304-dude
AMC Addicted Joined: Sep/29/2008 Location: Central Illinoi Status: Offline Points: 9082 |
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Assuming the ignition switch allows return to off, as I had my 73 ignition switch stick on once.
I would check how the ignition is wired up. You may have made a connection to turn on from fuse panel or a live feed, instead of the ignition switch. I would with the solenoid S terminal disconnected, check the power connection at the ignition after a few rotations of start, on, off. To see if the power at the ignition does turn off with key. By checking the switch that way may release it being sticky or prove there may be a wire that is live like clock and brake from the fuse panel being sent to the ignition. I would have wired up an automotive relay to control power to the ignition, using a tap from starter solenoid's I terminal, which should work just fine to activate the relay. Then a simple connection to the battery side of the starter solenoid to feed the relay output to the ignition. This way the 10 amp draw won't interfere with any other fuses and loads on your wiring. Very simple and should not cut or make mods to wiring. Just eye terminals of appropriate size and a nut for mounting the switched input to the relay at the I terminal. I don't think you are using the I terminal for ignition any way since using a box. |
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71 Javelin SST body
390 69 crank, 70 block & heads NASCAR SB2 rods & pistons 78 Jeep TH400 w/ 2.76 Low 50/50 Ford-AMC Suspension 79 F150 rear & 8.8 axles Ford Racing 3.25 gears & 9" /w Detroit locker |
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addic
AMC Nut Joined: May/01/2008 Location: Kansas City Status: Offline Points: 370 |
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I'm having the same issue with a 69 amx I just got running again ,that has a msd ignition, You have to put a diode that comes with the ignition on the orange wire from alt. otherwise it keeps feeding power to msd box ,but yours is different brand
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73 401 Pierre Cardin X P1
73 401 Pierre Cardin X F3 70 X 390 4spd 69 X 401 6 spd 69 AMX 401 auto BSO 73 AMX 401 4speed pc 73 vette 427sb 5spd 73 vette convt.? 08 zx14 |
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spiritdude
AMC Apprentice Joined: Feb/21/2017 Location: Cocoa, FL Status: Offline Points: 70 |
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matty401,
I don't have any experience with the Crane ignition setup, but it may behave like an MSD box. If this is true as addic says you will need to put a diode in between the field wire and the alternator. spiritdude |
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matty 401
AMC Addicted Joined: Jul/06/2007 Location: Iowa Status: Offline Points: 1727 |
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the crane system has been in the car for a long time just started acting up the other day and it is not all the time just when ever it feels like it lol i have wired a kill switch in it just a ground wire to the neg side of the coil push the button and it shuts off
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72 matador 401 the beast
79 concord 2 door 72 matador 304 grasshopper 68 Rogue 406 93 Cherokee 4.0 5 speed |
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FSJunkie
AMC Addicted Joined: Jan/09/2011 Location: Flagstaff, AZ Status: Offline Points: 4742 |
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If you have verified that it's not Dieseling (running on compression without the ignition actually firing), and that the ignition itself isn't shutting off, then it could very well be the starter relay is sticking. There is a contact inside that wires the ignition coil directly to the batter while the starter is engaged. Sometimes that contact sticks on and will supply the ignition with power and keep the engine running even though the ignition switch is turned off. It also burns out the ignition points and eventually the coil. Whacking the starter relay with the butt of a screwdriver usually does the trick.
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1955 Packard
1966 Marlin 1972 Wagoneer 1973 Ambassador 1977 Hornet 1982 Concord D/L 1984 Eagle Limited |
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matty 401
AMC Addicted Joined: Jul/06/2007 Location: Iowa Status: Offline Points: 1727 |
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it is a new relay just changed it out about 2 weeks ago i unplugged the i wire with it running and did nothing just kept running and not dieseling can still throttle it do it is very confusing would using that kill button hurt anything ?
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72 matador 401 the beast
79 concord 2 door 72 matador 304 grasshopper 68 Rogue 406 93 Cherokee 4.0 5 speed |
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304-dude
AMC Addicted Joined: Sep/29/2008 Location: Central Illinoi Status: Offline Points: 9082 |
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The I terminal probably is not used with having an ignition module. So removing it should not disable ignition, unless you customise the wiring to look stock. Then it may be used to deliver the ignition power to the coil. I assume if a diode was used like from others stating to use one, it may have shorted out. Diodes work but given reverse bias current drain, after time and heat in environment, they end up breaking down at the unijunction, thus shorting and allowing current to flow in the reverse direction. That is why i specifically gave info about adding a relay to control the ignition box using the I terminal, as the ignition feed should be carried over from the harness after the resistance wire. Unless that has been ripped out, then no ignition feed from the ignition switch is at the I terminal. It is short and simple to do, and does not require a diode and is pretty much fail safe in keeping wiring intact and not taxing power elsewhere within the system. |
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71 Javelin SST body
390 69 crank, 70 block & heads NASCAR SB2 rods & pistons 78 Jeep TH400 w/ 2.76 Low 50/50 Ford-AMC Suspension 79 F150 rear & 8.8 axles Ford Racing 3.25 gears & 9" /w Detroit locker |
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matty 401
AMC Addicted Joined: Jul/06/2007 Location: Iowa Status: Offline Points: 1727 |
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there was never a diode in the system not an msd ing either the crane unit has been in for years it just does not want to shut off with the key no wiring has been changed from install i bought a new ing switch will try that tomorrow
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72 matador 401 the beast
79 concord 2 door 72 matador 304 grasshopper 68 Rogue 406 93 Cherokee 4.0 5 speed |
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304-dude
AMC Addicted Joined: Sep/29/2008 Location: Central Illinoi Status: Offline Points: 9082 |
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Not sure, I will look into my wiring charts for 71, which will be similar to 72 outside of the transmission controlled switch and a few emissions changes.
I think there is an internal diode to the engine harness to isolate current feedback. Assuming to keep the alternator from self exciting. Maybe it Is built in to the regulator but as with any diode (if that is the case) the failure is a 50/50 short. Though I am assuming nothing is modified to the wiring, so what I may find should point to why the module is failing to turn off. |
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71 Javelin SST body
390 69 crank, 70 block & heads NASCAR SB2 rods & pistons 78 Jeep TH400 w/ 2.76 Low 50/50 Ford-AMC Suspension 79 F150 rear & 8.8 axles Ford Racing 3.25 gears & 9" /w Detroit locker |
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