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Twin 360's

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pipefactory View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pipefactory Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep/25/2016 at 6:42am
I need some input on this. I'm keeping the water pump on the front motor and blocking off the rear motors pump and putting 2 hose barbs on the plate. I'm thinking the water comes in the front pump goes out the back of front motors heads into the rear motors water pump block off plate hose barbs to fill both motors then both will keep there own thermostats and will return into 2 side by side aluminum radiators also the lower radiator outlets will be connected and feed the front water pump. How's that?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hurst390 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep/25/2016 at 7:43am
 I guess it would be easy enough to connect the two engine like you say. Use a bert or similar coupler and add a flange to one end of the input to bolt to the rear engine's balancer.
 In my experience you might want to use an aluminum coupler as the steel is very hard and carbide has a hard time. I had to use a cut-off wheel to open up the bolt pattern on a chevy coupler to work with the rambler crank. And I had to make a bushing to pilot it to the crank. In the future I may machine a ring to make the o.d. bigger and trap the bolts but so far it has been in service for 3 hard seasons on a dirt track.
 As far as cooling. its your project so I haven't spent but a few seconds thinking but I personally wouldn't start out by pumping water from one engine into the other. I would just plumb the rear engine around to two stacked radiators in the front. In a motorhome you probably have room to leave a space between the 2 radiators. Just my quick thoughts on it.
I see a mill,lathe,welder,etc in your future along with a lot of time and imagination. And a single HIGH TORQUE starter...lol


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pipefactory Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep/25/2016 at 8:16am
Originally posted by Hurst390 Hurst390 wrote:

 I guess it would be easy enough to connect the two engine like you say. Use a bert or similar coupler and add a flange to one end of the input to bolt to the rear engine's balancer.
 In my experience you might want to use an aluminum coupler as the steel is very hard and carbide has a hard time. I had to use a cut-off wheel to open up the bolt pattern on a chevy coupler to work with the rambler crank. And I had to make a bushing to pilot it to the crank. In the future I may machine a ring to make the o.d. bigger and trap the bolts but so far it has been in service for 3 hard seasons on a dirt track.
 As far as cooling. its your project so I haven't spent but a few seconds thinking but I personally wouldn't start out by pumping water from one engine into the other. I would just plumb the rear engine around to two stacked radiators in the front. In a motorhome you probably have room to leave a space between the 2 radiators. Just my quick thoughts on it.
I see a mill,lathe,welder,etc in your future along with a lot of time and imagination. And a single HIGH TORQUE starter...lol





I already have both mock up blocks and cranks coupled together. I used the same flange but re drilled and my friend counter bored them to center on the crank and balancer. Also going to use 2 starters.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote shootist Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep/25/2016 at 10:17am
This is very interesting indeed. I want to see some pictures once you get this put together. I am curious as to why would it not be best to just set both motors in synch with each other at 0 degrees and use only one distributor for timing and firing? I have never coupled two engines together but it would seem to me it would be easier to troubleshoot and keep running with a single timing source.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ghinmi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep/25/2016 at 1:53pm
Using one distributor would not be successful.  You can't link two plugs together, only one would fire.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Boris Badanov Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep/25/2016 at 4:09pm
Originally posted by pipefactory pipefactory wrote:

Originally posted by Boris Badanov Boris Badanov wrote:

As long as the harmonic balancers are intact internal balance should be unnecessary.
the only issue I see is you need to phase them at 22.5 degrees to get even firing pulses.

Very cool idea!
wouldn't it have to be 45 degree's I want #1 to fire on the 2nd between 1&8 on the 1st.


I stand corrected!
I have Harleys on the brain.....

Agreed, you would need two distributers.
Individual coils or coil packs might be a better option.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pipefactory Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep/25/2016 at 6:33pm
Should have some pics next week. My next step is connecting the blocks. When I'm done I want to Dyno in three steps break in and tune each separate then both together.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Boris Badanov Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep/25/2016 at 7:40pm
What are you going to do to place a balancer between the engines?
It will need to buffer both the flywheel of the front engine and
harmonic balancer of the real.

I love the idea, can't wait to see the results.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FSJunkie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep/25/2016 at 8:20pm
Connecting the crankshafts end to end like a true V16 would be a disaster even if there was a dampener between them because the rear crankshaft has to handle twice the torque. The torque of the front engine has to pass through the rear engine.

GMC managed to do it in the early 60's with their V12. It was basically two of their V6's stuck together, but there was way more engineering than that. I'm sure the crankshaft had to be strengthened considerably.

You'd be better off putting the engines back-to back, facing opposite directions but with the crankshafts in line with each other Connect them connect to a center gearbox. You might be able to repurpose an old rear axle. Each engine would power the axle shafts of the axle and you'd take power off the pinion. You might even retain the differential to let each engine balance the load and RPM of the other. It might also be good to put some kind of fluid coupling or torsional dampener between the gearbox and each engine just in case some bizarre vibrations are encountered. Unchecked, they could snap a crankshaft in no time.




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pipefactory Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep/25/2016 at 8:56pm
Originally posted by FSJunkie FSJunkie wrote:

Connecting the crankshafts end to end like a true V16 would be a disaster even if there was a dampener between them because the rear crankshaft has to handle twice the torque.
The torque of the front engine has to pass through the rear engine.

GMC managed to do it in the early 60's with their V12. It was basically two of their V6's stuck together, but there was way more engineering than that. I'm sure the crankshaft had to be strengthened considerably.

You'd be better off putting the engines back-to back, facing opposite directions but with the crankshafts in line with each other Connect them connect to a center gearbox. You might be able to repurpose an old rear axle. Each engine would power the axle shafts of the axle and you'd take power off the pinion. You might even retain the differential to let each engine balance the load and RPM of the other. It might also be good to put some kind of fluid coupling or torsional dampener between the gearbox and each engine just in case some bizarre vibrations are encountered. Unchecked, they could snap a crankshaft in no time.





it's been done many times in the past. The spirit of America was supposed to be power by 2-401's. Both engines will have there own balancer's and flex plates. Also running them 45 degrees apart would make a smoother running engine than one by itself. #1 fires on the front motor then 45 degrees later #1 on the rear fires another 45 degrees #8 on the front fires and so on.
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