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disc brake conversion |
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farna
Supporter of TheAMCForum Moderator Lost Dealership Project Joined: Jul/08/2007 Location: South Carolina Status: Offline Points: 19676 |
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Posted: Sep/08/2012 at 10:14am |
Don't worry -- I'm giving it a rest.
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Frank Swygert
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amx39068
Supporter of TheAMCForum Joined: Feb/21/2008 Location: Arizona Status: Offline Points: 11576 |
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That's Greg Beyer's website. He is no longer in Phoenix and rumor has it that he moved up to NoCal in Lodi to work with someone who was formerly an AMC vendor. It is my understanding that Greg was able to move most of his small parts but not sure if he ended up scrapping all the cars or not. |
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Dan Curtis-Owner and CEO AZ AMC Restorations; Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/amcmusclecars/ & Curtis Real Estate Development
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toolmanxiii
AMC Addicted Joined: Oct/16/2010 Location: Moncton Canada Status: Offline Points: 1384 |
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71 360 Hornet sst 83 2wd 360/727 Eagle wagon (crashed)
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ramblinrev
Moderator Group Joined: Dec/28/2008 Location: Wisconsin Status: Online Points: 11538 |
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Gentlemen, I think we have a difference of opinion here. Farna has made his points clearly, and they haven't satisfied all of you. I never encourage cutting corners on brake work and I don't sense that Farna does either. Maybe give it a rest...
Edited by ramblinrev - Sep/07/2012 at 6:41pm |
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74 Hornet Hatchback X twins (since 1977)
62 American Convertible (still worth the $50 I spent in 1973!) AMCRC #513, AMO #384 70 AMX 360 4-speed (since 1981) |
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toolmanxiii
AMC Addicted Joined: Oct/16/2010 Location: Moncton Canada Status: Offline Points: 1384 |
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I understand the difference in masters . I have rebuilt enough of them . but read what you just said . we do not know what he is running for calipers or master . so its better to go with the proper parts . yes some internals are the same . but what happens if you take the car in and tell the mechanic to top up the brake fluid while getting the oil changed and he forgets ? I check mine often as I do all fluids . but most people don't . sorry if you think I'm saying you are wrong that was not the intent . I think you should build a car for the next guy that might own it .
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71 360 Hornet sst 83 2wd 360/727 Eagle wagon (crashed)
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farna
Supporter of TheAMCForum Moderator Lost Dealership Project Joined: Jul/08/2007 Location: South Carolina Status: Offline Points: 19676 |
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If you don't understand the differences and why they are there, and why they MAY not matter, then you don't need to make changes. In some cases, such as for the 3.1" piston "Big Bendix" calipers, the MC needs to be different. Some disc system have a longer stroke as well as a larger piston, and some have a stepped piston with a larger section for the front brakes and a smaller one for the rear (I know that's how Wagner made some of their early drum dual MCs, not sure if anyone makes a disc/drum setup like that or not).
I can tell you from taking the MCs apart that the small piston calipers use the same internal dimensions as the drum brake MC. The only difference is the size of the reservoir, and I've already explained why the reservoirs were originally designed that way -- as well as why they aren't any more. At least the older 60s cars also used a different pedal for power vs. manual brakes. The reason is that the power brake cars used a bell crank to transfer motion up 3-4" for clearance. That's why the bracket holds the booster out from the fire wall, so there is room for the bell crank and the booster can be moved up to clear the intake on sixes, left cylinder bank on V-8s. The bell crank needs a bit more pedal stroke, not much, an inch at most. If you use a booster setup with a manual brake pedal the pedal will go to about 1/2" from the floor. You have to change or modify the pedal to sit about an inch higher to have the needed stroke without feeling like you're running out of brake pedal. Edited by farna - Sep/07/2012 at 4:05pm |
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Frank Swygert
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toolmanxiii
AMC Addicted Joined: Oct/16/2010 Location: Moncton Canada Status: Offline Points: 1384 |
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I worked at a Garage a few years ago with an older mechanic . He was almost killed when a car fell off the jack and broke his arm. when asked by investigators what happened he said "I don't understand , I've been doing it this way for 20 years" ..... Just because you can does not make it right . If drum masters were made for disc's why make one for disc's .
Just my 2 cent's Edited by toolmanxiii - Sep/07/2012 at 10:41am |
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71 360 Hornet sst 83 2wd 360/727 Eagle wagon (crashed)
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73hornut
AMC Addicted Joined: Jul/03/2007 Location: Southern Oregon Status: Offline Points: 3130 |
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I have front disk on the gremlin with the drum master, and have no problems with fluid level. Just check more often, say when you get oil changed.
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71 Javelin
74 Gremlin 79 Spirit AMX Rogue Valley Rumblers Like Us on FB https://www.facebook.com/groups/1602825606650796 |
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farna
Supporter of TheAMCForum Moderator Lost Dealership Project Joined: Jul/08/2007 Location: South Carolina Status: Offline Points: 19676 |
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Point taken Dan.
Bill just made the comment that once the fluid is in the piston that's it as far as the reservoir is concerned (more or less). As I previously stated, the reservoir size has nothing to do with the braking capacity or performance. Modern cars no longer use the larger reservoir. If you don't check the brake fluid for 30-40,000 miles (roughly the life of pads) there will be enough fluid in the large reservoir so that the front discs remain fully functional, that's the only purpose of the large reservoir on an old style disc brake MC. You know this, but for others... As the pads wear the piston doesn't retract as much and a little more fluid remains in the caliper, unlike drum brakes that have return springs that pull the wheel cylinders back to the same position all the time (the adjustment screw is at the bottom, doesn't affect wheel cylinder position). |
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Frank Swygert
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toolmanxiii
AMC Addicted Joined: Oct/16/2010 Location: Moncton Canada Status: Offline Points: 1384 |
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Any small body disc brake booster /master will fit . I installed one from an 86 eagle into a 74 Gremlin X. just remember the large bowl is always the disc brakes .
My 71 hornet now has the complete system from a 77 hornet wagon
And a drum master cannot hole enough fluid to support disc calipers . That is an accident waiting to happen. as pad wear the calipers need more fluid to take up the space . Edited by toolmanxiii - Sep/07/2012 at 4:46am |
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71 360 Hornet sst 83 2wd 360/727 Eagle wagon (crashed)
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