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Plumbing the shop for air

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Mr. Ed View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mr. Ed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep/05/2012 at 8:21am
And here I thought Bruce was your name for the level! Tongue
 
Nice shop but too neat. Throw some sawdust and wood chips around will ya!
 
Later!
Mr. Ed
2014 Jeep Grand Cherokee Laredo "Gwendolyn."
1978 Concord Sport coupe "Mr. Black".
1982 Concord wagon. The Admiral. FOR SALE!
1976 Sportabout X, 304, auto, air. The Bronze Goddess

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sergi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep/10/2012 at 12:38pm
I have been in a few shops where the entire shop was plumb with pvc and have never had a burst or any problems, but it does kinda scare me when using pressure all day long but so far we havent had an issue yet and its been a number of years.  In the shop I work at now the whole place is plumbed with copper and we have to drain collecters.  We also have a dryer on our compressor, that helps alot.  Only after we have all been using the air for a few hours do we start to get alittle water in the lines but that is very rare.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote amx39068 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep/11/2012 at 12:03pm
My shop was PCV before it was converted to copper. They converted it to copper after the 3rd blowout with an industrial compressor that cranks up to 160 lbs of pressure. I now regulate it down to 100lbs for general use to reduce the on off cycling of the compressor motor.

Edited by amx39068 - Sep/11/2012 at 12:04pm
Dan Curtis-Owner and CEO AZ AMC Restorations; Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/amcmusclecars/ & Curtis Real Estate Development
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote billd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep/11/2012 at 12:14pm
I've seen too many photos of PVC blowouts, and read too many stories - FIRST HAND accounts....
It's wicked when it lets loose, and it does so more than you'd hear about.

I've seen copper blow. It's scary, but it usually simply splits. (and makes a heck of a racket!)
It takes a lot more to blow copper, too.
The PVC can blow when bumped - check some of the accounts on the web were folks were moving something or accidentally bumped it and caused it to shatter with shards of sharp plastic shooting 50 feet through the air to the other side of the shop.
Sure, there's a lot of it out there, gotta admit that, and a lot of folks say "never had a problem, it's fine", but it just takes one time............
I read in a forum on garages and shops where I fellow bumped his PVC line and it blew, and he had to have shards of needle-like plastic removed from his scalp, barely missing his eyes.

I'm running most of the copper high (I don't trust myself, accident prone) and most is in areas where I'm much less likely to be hitting it.

Dan, I see you caught your typo, darn, I was going to ask how that 1100 pounds was working out...   Wink
Seriously, same here - I regulate it down and it reduces compressor cycling - and most things I do don't require full compressor tank pressure and get the job done just fine.
I'd enjoy working in your shop. Geesh, I'd enjoy working in ANY shop full time again, but being where the cars don't have rust holes, and bolts that were just put in a year don't break because of rust.....that would be cool. And being surrounded by all the AMCs and muscle, man, I gotta stop thinking about that!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bigbad69 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep/11/2012 at 1:44pm
Originally posted by billd billd wrote:

I've seen too many photos of PVC blowouts, and read too many stories - FIRST HAND accounts....
It's wicked when it lets loose, and it does so more than you'd hear about.
I just replaced a rubber line that had a good sized goose egg in it. Better to replace it before it blows. If you survive the blowout, you're still dead in the water, mid-job, with no hose. 100 PSI is not something you want to take chances with.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote fast401 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep/11/2012 at 2:39pm
I am going to do some plumbing on my compressor.  I just talked to my local plumber he and recommends NOT using schedule 80 PVC (shapnel).  He recommended PEX (spelling?) as it will take 200 lb plus pressures and the connections are push type that they also use in industrial environments.  He also said if there is a leak/puncture you can cut the bad section and use push fittings.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bigbad69 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep/11/2012 at 5:00pm
PEX is what is commonly being used for water supply in houses now (replacing copper). It should hold the pressure, but may be more susceptible to damage than copper. It's also a lot cheaper than copper, which is why it is replacing copper in domestic plumbing.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote billd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep/13/2012 at 8:54am
Originally posted by bigbad69 bigbad69 wrote:

PEX is what is commonly being used for water supply in houses now (replacing copper). It should hold the pressure, but may be more susceptible to damage than copper. It's also a lot cheaper than copper, which is why it is replacing copper in domestic plumbing.


Most of what I found indicated that copper is still the top or number one choice in plumbing for air, PEX seemed to be climbing up to #2 really fast.
I see only 2 downsides to copper, I've tried really hard to be honest and think of why I should not use it, or why it might be a mistake, but honestly could come up with only 2 cons compared to say, just for example, PEX ->
1. Cost - copper pipe in 1/2 sizes being $12 on up, the fittings (some costing $2 or more each!)
2. the time and skill level. It takes TIME to properly prepare the pipe AND fittings, and to solder them right. A certain amount of skill is needed as well. If you don't do it right, you not only could have minor to major leaks, but you could end up with a weak joint which I suspect could eventually fail. Anyone can glue plastic or push PEX together. (for a new home, the labor savings could be great with PEX - fast, cut, push together, no soldering, any DIY'r could do it.)

IMO, copper still has the advantage of longevity, safety (if installed properly), less loss because of the large inside diameter and slick, smooth surface compared to some products, and since it often stays cooler, it will help "drop" some moisture from the air, especially if plumbed the way I'm trying to do it.
This means the water traps and filters have less to do, or can keep up more easily in extreme humidity like we typically have May through August (and some other months as well).
In some cases my guess is that one could get by without a water filter more easily for non-critical places.
I have noted that when I use an air nozzle to blow things off - say a board I just cut, for example, I no longer see a mist coming out the end, and I get no moisture on the things I am using air to blow off. There used to be times I'd see the air coming out of the blow nozzle due to the moisture! Aim it in the direction of my hand (carefully, of course!) and I could "feel the wet". Not any more. I drained the pipes last night after some blasting, about 30 minutes worth, and got 4 or 5 table spoons of water from the compressor tank itself, a teaspoon worth from the main drop pipe, a couple of drops from the pipe closest to the cabinets, and nothing of note from the filter, maybe a little bit of spray that would add up to a single drop.  It's no wonder the cabinets work a whole lot better now.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SirDigger Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep/13/2012 at 1:13pm
We run a Preassure Air System in the Companys Yard too.
In the Maschinery Shop, in every Storage Hall, on the gasstation.
All powerd by one central Compressor with an Air/water seperator.

Most of the lines are made of HD-PE100 (Polyethylen HighDensit 100% new) (i wont use PVC Pipe they are not so good for this kind of use,
they suck at longtimepressurechangescycles that creates weak spots,
and they dont like bending and are not real good at impact resistant,
PE HD is a bit more , but wont have this disandvantages.

The 1/2" PE-HD100 ((funny thing we metric ppl still use inch while speaking pipes) inside diameter so who has the bigger flow)
costs me on the 328feet roll from around 160$,
if u need cornerfittings there are 15/30/45/67/90° availeble for 3$, T-Fittings are 5$ , Wallmounted Air Outlets with auickconnector are 5,50$  T-(all with included wallmounts)

The normal Pressure in the System is 130psi,and we have noProblems.
Normaly this kind of Pipe is a Water pipe with an Burstpressure >365psi,
so there is enough safty in it.

One of the Best inventions in air system is an automatic hose recoiler,
as much hose u need, no unneeded hose to stumble over on the floor,
no time needed to hangup the hose nice and tidy.

And on the Workbench, a airoutlet with an spiral hose for 10 feet is nice.



SirDigger&his german Friends are looking for Parts http://theamcforum.com/forum/the-german-amc-forum-ambassadorsirdigger-needs_topic83570.html
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote billd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep/13/2012 at 2:18pm
Quote One of the Best inventions in air system is an automatic hose recoiler,
as much hose u need, no unneeded hose to stumble over on the floor,
no time needed to hangup the hose nice and tidy.

And on the Workbench, a airoutlet with an spiral hose for 10 feet is nice.


Yes, I hope to have a hose reel soon, and the goal on the west side is an outlet next to each bench, with one of those hoses.
I have that setup up in my wood shop upstairs - the yellow coiled hose, and I remove it and hang it on a very long peg in that closet when not in use.
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