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Conversions to alcohol |
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Aljav
AMC Addicted Joined: Jul/18/2007 Location: Wisconsin Status: Offline Points: 1037 |
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Posted: Aug/14/2007 at 3:13pm |
Looking to know just what one need to have changed to run Alcohol fuel. what type of components don't like the alcohol.
shhhhhh Quite...its really all about E-85, I hate to have my friends think I have Gone Green!!! Its ALL about the cheaper cost and holy High as hell octane (105) of e-85, and the two gas station within 5 blocks of my house that have it. I have never been sure of what components that don't like it. Allan Edited by Aljav - Aug/14/2007 at 3:15pm |
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69 AMX 9.86 132 mph 71 JAV/AMX and 69 Javelin, .. NAMDRA member #1106
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billd
Moderator Group Forum Administrator Joined: Jun/27/2007 Location: Iowa Status: Offline Points: 30894 |
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You need to convert to computer controlled fuel injection..........
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Aljav
AMC Addicted Joined: Jul/18/2007 Location: Wisconsin Status: Offline Points: 1037 |
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You need to convert to computer controlled fuel injection..........
Ahhhh... No... LOL... Carburators can be set up for alchohol.. just looking to see what parts are not compatiable with alcohol
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69 AMX 9.86 132 mph 71 JAV/AMX and 69 Javelin, .. NAMDRA member #1106
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tufcj
Supporter of TheAMCForum Supporter of TheAMCForum Joined: Jul/10/2007 Location: Watkins, CO Status: Offline Points: 4085 |
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Anything rubber will need to be replaced in an older car. Fuel lines, gaskets and seals in the carb, accel pump, etc. E-85 also has a detergent effect. Any gum, varnish, rust will loosen and plug the filters.
You will need bigger jets, since it takes more alcohol to produce the same power. Most people report that mileage with E-85 drops 10-20%, so the money you save in price is lost in mileage, making it about a wash. I think your best bet is to make it as fuel efficient as you can on good old regular gas. Bob tufcj Edited by tufcj - Aug/15/2007 at 4:32am |
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69 AMX
74 Javelin AMX 67 Rogue If you need a tool and don't buy it... you'll eventually pay for it... and not have it. Henry Ford |
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billd
Moderator Group Forum Administrator Joined: Jun/27/2007 Location: Iowa Status: Offline Points: 30894 |
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You won't like the results on an older carbureted car...........
In fact, the state employees don't really like the effects on the NEW state cars! Lower power for certain, and lower mileage, too....... There's less calories, less heat energy per gallon. All you can do is say "I'm reducing our "need" for oil" Yes, rubber parts - replace, clean clean clean the tank!!!!!!!! Anything in the carb that dates back to about 1982 or before needs replaced. NEW kits are typically compatible with ethanol. |
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farna
Supporter of TheAMCForum Moderator Lost Dealership Project Joined: Jul/08/2007 Location: South Carolina Status: Offline Points: 19676 |
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If the car is over 25 years old replace all the lines -- maybe as far back as 30 years. Anything since around 1980 has alcohol resistant lines and seals.
The big problems with running E-85 in an older vehicle that's been running gasoline is deposits left by the gas. Sometimes the varnish and sludge left by evaporating gasoline will help a seal or seam leak (like in a gas tank). The main ingredient in carb and fuel injector cleaner is alcohol! Start running high concentrations like E-85 and everything will start to loosen and leak. It's not the seals giving way, it's all the built up varnish that was backing up the seal getting washed away. Run a couple good fuel filters for a while, and change often. Everything should clear up in 500-1000 miles. Alcohol has a higher octane rating, but less energy. What it really means is that the fuel will tolerate a lot more compression before detonation occurs. Dual fuel vehicles have to have compression consistent with the lowest octane fuel that will be run. So the engines are standard 8-9:1 compression. If it were being optimized for E-85 only, compression can be boosted to 10:1 or more. Then you gain most of the lost power, and will get more miles per gallon to boot since the overall efficiency of the engine is increased. Not enough more mpg to equal the loss in energy compared to gasoline, but enough to notice (2-3 more mpg from what I've been told). If you're building a car to run E-85 it needs to be optimized for the fuel to make the whole endeavor worthwhile. Just be careful! I wouldn't go more than 10:1 because you don't always get E-85. In the winter the blend is changed to what, 50/50?? I don't recall, but E-85 won't start well in cold weather. You need to find that ratio and build for optimum power on that blend. That is unless this is going to be a mild/warm weather project, like a drag car, off-road, or show/cruise vehicle. |
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Frank Swygert
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Aljav
AMC Addicted Joined: Jul/18/2007 Location: Wisconsin Status: Offline Points: 1037 |
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"I think your best bet is to make it as fuel efficient as you can on good old regular gas"
Who said anything about gas milage?..HAHAHAHA
Let me clarify myself.. Its all about the Horsepower...LOL
Its a work in progress, the motor isn't done yet, body come first, not much stock here. I am wondering what type of seals will replace the rubber o rings?
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69 AMX 9.86 132 mph 71 JAV/AMX and 69 Javelin, .. NAMDRA member #1106
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Peter Marano
Supporter of TheAMCForum Joined: Jul/01/2007 Location: Kenosha WI Status: Offline Points: 1650 |
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I think that to get the most out of E85 you should concentrate on alcohol's ability to cool the intake charge, forced induction without an intercooler.
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billd
Moderator Group Forum Administrator Joined: Jun/27/2007 Location: Iowa Status: Offline Points: 30894 |
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Well, then I'm afraid you may be disappointed. Most folks who run E85 or convert to any standard ethanol blend complain because there's much less energy per gallon. You'll need to do much more than replace rubber parts and rejet the carb.
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PHAT69AMX
AMC Addicted Joined: Jul/07/2007 Location: West Virginia Status: Offline Points: 5919 |
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Race cars that run Alchohol use methanol, E85 uses ethanol.
I think I got that right ? Or is it vice-a-versa ?
One is made from wood and is poisonious ( methanol ? ),
the other is from corn and same as Moonshine ( ethanol ? )
( edit - think I got'em changed around correctly ) Edited by PHAT69AMX - Aug/16/2007 at 4:56pm |
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