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Bendix vs Wagner backing plates: rear 10x1.75"

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amcenthusiast View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote amcenthusiast Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Oct/06/2017 at 6:32pm
That's a really nice effort to help that man 304dude-

When I read 'Wagner' ...I thought 'oh no'... because my '69 Rebel has Wagner and I'm having trouble finding the correct parts; NOT like Bendix!

So I looked this up in my '71 AMC TSM and the book does not show any model was made with Wagner drums -double checked not to make a fool out of myself... it only shows Bendix drums in the '71 AM TSM.

(were those brakes swapped on there by someone else?)

Anyway, not that the Wagner brakes are bad, but because the Bendix parts are so much more available I'd say if you have a choice and your car is a '71, install the Bendix parts!

(I think if you flip over the backing plates to show the 'working side' the upper anchor between the shoes should look different...? -that would require the 'different' Wagner shoe...)

IF you have the Wagner shoes & want them relined, there are also specialized brake re-liners listed in Hemming Motor News paperback books found in bookstore magazine racks in the 'services offered' section...

Also call or check Galvin's AMC Rambler Parts -he's got used parts not listed on his webpages (they purchased an all AMC junkyard back in '79?)

*You might benefit from buying a Chilton's Repair Manual (for example my '67-'74 Rebel/Matador book shows 'how to' on Wagner and Bendix... which might be helpful for a Javelin owner as well...)


Edited by amcenthusiast - Oct/06/2017 at 6:36pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 304-dude Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Oct/06/2017 at 7:02pm
I don't think the original owner swapped out backing plates. He was in his late 70s early 80s when I purchased the car. Everything outside of the transmission and engine were left intact without modifications, as they were rebuilt back in the 90s.

I have a feeling by May 71 most all AMC 20 rears had Wagner backing plates. As my car was just days from being a May build.

I never bothered checking the rear out any more than physical appearance of the brake hardware and how things looked for having years of service on the road, original dirt patterns, thickness and other accumulations to how well it matched the underside. The only parts that looked replaced was the shoes and required components for a brake job. The cylinders were original, but I tossed them, as they were easily found as new replacent parts.

I really did not know that 71 was an odd year for rear brakes, until this thread. I would have done a better job of checking details as I progressed on disassembly. Though the twin grip unit date code was made in late 70 on its stamp, so that may show for an original condition rear.

With older cars, I would look into relining, as it is a cost effective way to have better brakes without changing much to upgrade.





71 Javelin SST body
390 69 crank, 70 block & heads
NASCAR SB2 rods & pistons
78 Jeep TH400 w/ 2.76 Low
50/50 Ford-AMC Suspension
79 F150 rear & 8.8 axles
Ford Racing 3.25 gears & 9" /w Detroit locker
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jpnjim Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Oct/06/2017 at 9:06pm
The more I look deeper into this the more I think the Bendix & Wagner plates are actually both the same.

There's a listing error on Rock Auto,
where the 71-72 AMX listing is missing brake parts that are listed under 71-72 Javelin.

So when I opened the 1971 AMX section and compared it to the 1972 Javelin section I mistakenly thought there was a big difference in brake components year to year.

I assumed confirmation of this when I went to replace a bent 1971 Bendix backing plate,
and found the 1972 axle had Wagner plates.


Doing a little more research I now find the same components fit both plates,
Power Stop B267 10x1.75" shoes fit both
Monroe BX267, Centric 11101510, Wagner Z267R, etc etc all list as fitting 1968-74 Javelins.

Same with Wagner WC17507/WC17508 wheel cylinders.

So, I now think the plates are interchangeable, other than the Bendix punching 2 adjustor holes in each plate, and Wagner just doing one.

If I'm wrong (again) on this I'm all ears to anything I'm missing here.

Thanks 304!, and thanks Amcenthusiast for the helpful comments 
hopefully I have this right 
as it applies to the 10x1.75" brakes anyway 
71 P-code 4spd Javelin/AMX
some Jeeps and some Fords
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jpnjim Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Oct/06/2017 at 9:12pm
Originally posted by amcenthusiast amcenthusiast wrote:

 
(I think if you flip over the backing plates to show the 'working side' the upper anchor between the shoes should look different...? -that would require the 'different' Wagner shoe...)


*You might benefit from buying a Chilton's Repair Manual (for example my '67-'74 Rebel/Matador book shows 'how to' on Wagner and Bendix... which might be helpful for a Javelin owner as well...)

I will check the upper anchors as suggested, and might even go so far as mocking the Wagner parts on the Bendix plate just to confirm or dispel the idea that they're the same.

I haven't cracked open the parts books to check (yet),
but I'll look there in the FSM & yes I have some old Chiltons too (the small Javelin specific hardcover) to check as well
thanks again
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some Jeeps and some Fords
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jpnjim Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Oct/06/2017 at 9:20pm
Originally posted by 304-dude 304-dude wrote:



I really did not know that 71 was an odd year for rear brakes, until this thread. I would have done a better job of checking details as I progressed on disassembly. Though the twin grip unit date code was made in late 70 on its stamp, so that may show for an original condition rear.

With older cars, I would look into relining, as it is a cost effective way to have better brakes without changing much to upgrade.






I'm the opposite 304,
I always assume everything about the 71's is different LOL

It's funny that so many 71's survive,
back when I was buying and daily driving Javelins the 71 I have now is the only drivable one I ever ran across.

I had two 72's, and two 74's, but even back then the 71's seemed to be the toughest to find and had so many differences from the 72-74's.
Thanks again Smile
71 P-code 4spd Javelin/AMX
some Jeeps and some Fords
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