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Adapting a 200R4
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GnipGnop4 View Drop Down
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Points: 292 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GnipGnop4 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov/24/2014 at 8:21pm
By the way, my build thread can be viewed here: Hope to be rollin' by Christmas.

http://theamcforum.com/forum/1969-amx-project-veronica_topic64185.html
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I replaced the TH350 in my 68 Camaro with a 200 4R. The 200 4R was about a 1/4" longer not enough to make a difference. However, the transmission mount was over 2" further back. The driveshaft did not need modifying. I purchased a 200 4R Level 2 (rated for 450-500 hp and 400-450 lb ft tq), 2200 rpm stall convertor, TV cable made EZ System, cross member all from Bowtie Overdrives. I ran a transmission temperature gauge per BTO's advice. Also ran 3.43 rear axle gears. A 3.73 ratio is better for country road driving. I strongly recommend you visit BTO's website. Inspection covers are a bit tricky. It cost me about $2200 for the "Full Monty". Well worth it. I notched BTO's cross member so the exhaust was tucked up higher. See pix of TV made EZ System, temperature gauge bung, and cross member. Note four bolt pivotal exhaust flanges.
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Points: 497 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ga70amx Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov/24/2014 at 9:09pm
Originally posted by GnipGnop4 GnipGnop4 wrote:

I just did the M12 to 200-4R swap in my '69 AMX. I used the Novak Adapter kit ($500) plus I had to machine my crank end to fit the larger diameter/GM style pilot bearing (Bulltear has the adapter ring and Novak supplies the Pilot bearing). If you have the later model crank then you just need to press in the Pilot bearing and your crank is good for mating up to the GM torque converter. The cross member is a little tricky depending on the look you want. Since I have the Control Freak suspension, the cross member is made of tubular steel. I like the way it turned out, but you can definitely go a less custom route. By the way, if you are also running the CF IFS, you will need to fab up some offset motor mounts as the stock engine position is now moved about 1/2" forward with the trans adapter plate. I'm running an aluminum rad with dual electric fans, so I had plenty of room. Of course you'll need to cut down or have a new driveshaft made. But you will not need to modify the trans tunnel at all. Granted, it is a tight fit and you'll need some angle fittings for the trans cooler lines. But It all tucks up in there nicely. As far as shifters go, you'll need to get out the saw and modify your existing center console or throw it out and fab up something custom. I'm working with the stock center console and a B&M Hammer Shifter. I'm machining a custom bezel and replacing the console wood grain panels with new sheet metal (in the works now). Here are some pics. I will document this probably early next year and hopefully add it to the transmission section of the forum. [/URL]


Thanks for the information. The machining of the crank is the part I was afraid of. I really was hoping against hope that I would not have to do that. But I don’t know what has been done to this engine. When I bought the car there was some 747 linkage in the truck so maybe it has a newer crank already. Unfortunately I didn’t get the car from whoever built it to the state it was in when I bought it. No Freak Ride stuff, it is all slightly modified stock 1970 AMX. Modifying the console and making a custom cross member is something I can do, no problem. I’m a little confused on why the engine move forward. Why can’t it stay where it is and the transmission move back? Or is there not enough firewall clearance for the transmission adapter plate? I will check out you build site, the first page looks awesome.
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Points: 3489 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AMXFSTBK390 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov/24/2014 at 9:47pm
This thread was started by Aus69Jav. This question is directed to you:

Have you determined what engine is in your Javelin? Is your intention to install an over drive automatic transmission? I ask this because I have converted many automatics to AODs. There are alternatives you may not have considered. That is why I asked what engine/crankshaft is in your car.
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Points: 93 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Aus69Jav Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov/24/2014 at 9:48pm
Thanks for all the replies.
The information will be very helpful.
I am planning to buy a built box from one of the performance suppliers like,

http://www.extremeautomatics.com/th2004R.php - http://www.extremeautomatics.com/th2004R.php

or  http://www.bowtieoverdrives.com/catalog/catalog_inc/viewitem.php?ITEMID=13 - http://www.bowtieoverdrives.com/catalog/catalog_inc/viewitem.php?ITEMID=13

Any others I should consider?

Being in Aus these type of suppliers seem to be the best option as they don't need a core.

Seems like the 200 4R will fit well, just need to sort out the crossmember. I want to make it look stock as possible so I will use the stock piece. Has anyone sorted out the speedo cable & gears?
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Points: 3489 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AMXFSTBK390 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov/24/2014 at 9:53pm
BTO can help you with the correct speedometer gear. Email BTO or call them. Great people and customer service. I will not hesitate to use them again.
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Points: 93 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Aus69Jav Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov/24/2014 at 10:09pm
The engine that is in the car is a  1971 360.
I am looking at purchasing another complete 401 engine that has the later crank.
If the 401 works out I will use that engine.
I plan on using 3.7 or 3.9 gears so the OD will be very useful on the highway.
The car has 2.87 gears at the moment.

If there are other options for OD gearboxes that may work I would be glad to consider them.
The engine will be a performance build so strength will be a factor.
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Points: 292 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GnipGnop4 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov/24/2014 at 10:39pm
The 401 would give you the least amount of effort. You will need to just press fit the pilot adapter bearing and the rest is fairly straight forward. I live 50 miles from Art Carr www.cpttransmission.com. Art is one of the early pioneers of the performance built 200-4R. Other resources are transmissioncenter.net and Jakesperformance.com. Lots of good data to pour over. Naturally I chose the source closest and also who I felt had a good reputation in this specialized market. Some or all of these referrals might have shipped transmissions to customers near you. They might be able to provide some local customer references. Regarding gear ratios, you'll want to look at 3.54 or 3.73 depending on what type of driving and tire diameter. Also if you are running the AMC 20 rear then consider 1 piece axles especially if you are building up the 401.


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Points: 5808 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WesternRed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov/25/2014 at 1:21am
Might be worth considering a custom convertor to go between the early crank/flexplate and the transmission. That would overcome a big obstacle for those who have already built their engine.
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Points: 3942 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote carnuck Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov/25/2014 at 1:26am
This adapter should work with a bell plate about 7/16" thick (or whatever the crank adapter thickness is)
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