The AMC Forum : Cutting coils lowering ride height http://theamcforum.com/forum/ This is an XML content feed of; The AMC Forum : Suspension, Steering, Brakes & Wheels : Cutting coils lowering ride height Thu, 23 May 2013 23:48:39 +0000 Fri, 20 Apr 2012 04:53:16 +0000 http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/tech/rss Web Wiz Forums 10.03 360 theamcforum.com/forum/RSS_post_feed.asp?TID=38426 The AMC Forum http://theamcforum.com/forum/http://www.theamcforum.com/forum/skin_images_amc/forumheader.png http://theamcforum.com/forum/ Cutting coils lowering ride height : just buy new spring made correctly... http://theamcforum.com/forum/cutting-coils-lowering-ride-height_topic38426_post354788.html#354788 Author: aussie rambler
Subject: 38426
Posted: Apr/20/2012 at 4:53am

just buy new spring made correctly , its bloody safer and, throw in new shocks  ya car will handle !Wink]]> Fri, 20 Apr 2012 04:53:16 +0000 http://theamcforum.com/forum/cutting-coils-lowering-ride-height_topic38426_post354788.html#354788 Cutting coils lowering ride height : I had the tire off to have... http://theamcforum.com/forum/cutting-coils-lowering-ride-height_topic38426_post354715.html#354715 Author: WeatherEye
Subject: 38426
Posted: Apr/19/2012 at 8:54pm

I had the tire off to have more arm room but had the brake drum resting on a block]]> Thu, 19 Apr 2012 20:54:20 +0000 http://theamcforum.com/forum/cutting-coils-lowering-ride-height_topic38426_post354715.html#354715 Cutting coils lowering ride height : Are you installing those clamps... http://theamcforum.com/forum/cutting-coils-lowering-ride-height_topic38426_post354678.html#354678 Author: tyrodtom
Subject: 38426
Posted: Apr/19/2012 at 4:55pm

Are you installing those clamps when weight is on the springs or with the car jacked up ?
 
  I would never use spring clamps, they're death to springs in the long run.  They force the spring to do more flexing in one area,  it leads early metal fatigue and failure.
]]> Thu, 19 Apr 2012 16:55:57 +0000 http://theamcforum.com/forum/cutting-coils-lowering-ride-height_topic38426_post354678.html#354678 Cutting coils lowering ride height : I installed some spring clamps... http://theamcforum.com/forum/cutting-coils-lowering-ride-height_topic38426_post354673.html#354673 Author: WeatherEye
Subject: 38426
Posted: Apr/19/2012 at 4:13pm

I installed some spring clamps on the right front spring on my 63 Classic and the front did not drop at all. I clamped the two middle coils, then tried the two bottom coils and I compressed them right together, nothing. Any ideas why there was no drop ?]]> Thu, 19 Apr 2012 16:13:33 +0000 http://theamcforum.com/forum/cutting-coils-lowering-ride-height_topic38426_post354673.html#354673 Cutting coils lowering ride height : They have them for 1969 Ambassador... http://theamcforum.com/forum/cutting-coils-lowering-ride-height_topic38426_post352882.html#352882 Author: 69 ambassador 390
Subject: 38426
Posted: Apr/12/2012 at 10:50am

They have them for 1969 Ambassador at least.  And YES they are different then the other big cars.  But Airbags would be very easy.]]> Thu, 12 Apr 2012 10:50:20 +0000 http://theamcforum.com/forum/cutting-coils-lowering-ride-height_topic38426_post352882.html#352882 Cutting coils lowering ride height : NEGATIVE on the spring compressor.... http://theamcforum.com/forum/cutting-coils-lowering-ride-height_topic38426_post352862.html#352862 Author: farna
Subject: 38426
Posted: Apr/12/2012 at 9:45am

NEGATIVE on the spring compressor. Look under a front fender. See those "ear" looking things with holes on opposite sides of the spring? There is a matching set just above the lower set. The tool we're talking about hooks in those holes and holds the spring compressed. Once hooked you just take the tire off, disconnect the shock, and push the lower arm down as far as it will go. Then the spring simply lifts out. Be careful with it! There's no way to get an internal compressor in the spring. I should add that the engine and trans must be in the car for the hooks to work. The factory hooks required the spring to be compressed a lot more -- you jacked the opposite rear corner up to transfer weight to the side you wanted to remove. I discussed this with Garry when he designed his tool, and he made it so that you don't usually have to do that. Might have to reach up and pull down on the fender a bit, but that's all. The downside is the shock has to be disconnected, but that's not much of an inconvenience when the more you compress the spring the more dangerous it is to handle.

If you send the coils out to a shop that can cut and heat treat the springs properly you should be fine. Just make sure it's a coil spring specialty shop, not just someone who's "done it all the time" or whatever. Heat treating spring steel is a bit of a science, though once the technique is practiced and you have the right equipment and chemicals it's not extremely difficult. It's like anything else, if you know how and have the stuff to work with, it gets easy... eventually.

There are coil-over kits that replace the spring entirely with a nice expensive coil over shock, but only for 1970+. Here's one: http://www.wscmotorsports.com/catalog/amc/amc_per1.htm.
It wouldn't be difficult to make a bracket that simply sits in the existing upper spring seat (drill and bolt thought top of spring tower) and sits on the existing upper trunnion spring seat (or make a new bracket -- the seat is threaded and screws on the trunnion on the big cars).  That might be something you'd want to do, wouldn't be hard to find a coil over shock the right length. They are on the high side though, $250 or so each with springs, plus the cost of making the brackets. On the bright side, once you make the brackets they will work for any 63-69 big car, and with a different lower bracket and probably different length shock, even the 64-69 American/Javelin/AMX. Don't know if there's much market for it, but I'm sure you could sell a few.

The only other alternative is a Control Freaks front suspension setup, which eliminates the trunnions. It's a complete crossmember with all new suspension and rack and pinion steering for the small cars and most big cars now (call if you have something other than the advertised 67-69 Rebel, they have them for a couple others now, 67-up anyway). It's accordingly a bit on the expensive side at around $3700 though. http://www.freakride.com/2011_amc_suspension.pdf
]]> Thu, 12 Apr 2012 09:45:02 +0000 http://theamcforum.com/forum/cutting-coils-lowering-ride-height_topic38426_post352862.html#352862 Cutting coils lowering ride height : 69 ambassador 390 wrote:You... http://theamcforum.com/forum/cutting-coils-lowering-ride-height_topic38426_post352831.html#352831 Author: xedge4lifex
Subject: 38426
Posted: Apr/12/2012 at 3:34am

Originally posted by 69 ambassador 390 69 ambassador 390 wrote:

You cannot cut ther front springs.  They will sit cockeyed and bow out.  The springs were treated after forming so you cannot re-form the ends.  I also want to know where you get your hacksaw blades.  You can just get some correct springs made.  That should cost about $150.00 per set.  Or you could go the way I did and go coil over suspencion.  I can put it in the weeds now if I like and none of that annoying seasick grampa car float that airbags give a car.  Also, if you go air bags on the cheap as suggested, don't connect the two hoses for a pair together at one valve.  On corners the air will transfer from the outside to the inside and greatly increas body roll and handeling problems.  Always seperate the four corners.  Thats why the factory did it on bag equiped cars.  The trunnion style suspension is very easy to bag because of the mounting style.  You should be able to find usable bags at the local truck stop.  Just drill the appropriate holes in the spring tower and you don't even need hoses.  Just put the valve right at the bag.  You'll have to open the hood for filling.  Also, no air tank needed.  Just get a nice air pump from the bike shop.  The kind that you put your feet on and lift and push the handle.  If you are going to run the car in the weeds, don't forget to reinforce the lower control arms and suspension stop areas by boxing the ends all the way around or you'll pop out the lower bushing from the stress.  It's just sheet metal at the arm ends.  Hope this helps.  By the way, there's a guy in Australia that did this exact same thing.  That post os a couple of years old and I beleive it was a Rebel.  You would have to search the Australia section for the pics.



what kind of coil overs are we talking here? adjustable? i dont want to go from my decent caddy ride, to some bumpy crud. and cutting the springs is kinda out of the question due to the way the springs sit in the seats. i need to get new tie rods, and bushings. ill probably end up refinishing each arm as i do it. the springs are getting heat treated. ive been looking around for spring clamps, but ill probably make something seeing as how i need 4.

http://www.allfordmustangs.com/forums/attachments/classic-tech/46430d1213502316-1967-mustang-coil-spring-replacement-internal_compressor.jpg

this also looks nifty, any idea if it would work on th 68 ambassador?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c1akqSJE0ss]]> Thu, 12 Apr 2012 03:34:14 +0000 http://theamcforum.com/forum/cutting-coils-lowering-ride-height_topic38426_post352831.html#352831 Cutting coils lowering ride height : what everyone else says -- plus... http://theamcforum.com/forum/cutting-coils-lowering-ride-height_topic38426_post351558.html#351558 Author: tomj
Subject: 38426
Posted: Apr/06/2012 at 9:18pm

what everyone else says -- plus changing ride height via spring cut or replacement, more than a small amount, affects bump steer, alignment, shock travel (they'll bottom sooner, breaking things) and all sorts of stuff. Bad idea.

Get or make lowering plates is a better idea. Safer, more reliable, straightforward.

]]> Fri, 06 Apr 2012 21:18:35 +0000 http://theamcforum.com/forum/cutting-coils-lowering-ride-height_topic38426_post351558.html#351558 Cutting coils lowering ride height : 69 ambassador 390 wrote:I... http://theamcforum.com/forum/cutting-coils-lowering-ride-height_topic38426_post351200.html#351200 Author: Exzion
Subject: 38426
Posted: Apr/05/2012 at 8:49am

Originally posted by 69 ambassador 390 69 ambassador 390 wrote:

I can put it in the weeds now if I like and none of that annoying seasick grampa car float that airbags give a car.  Also, if you go air bags on the cheap as suggested, don't connect the two hoses for a pair together at one valve.  On corners the air will transfer from the outside to the inside and greatly increas body roll and handeling problems.  Always seperate the four corners.  Thats why the factory did it on bag equiped cars.  The trunnion style suspension is very easy to bag because of the mounting style.  You should be able to find usable bags at the local truck stop.  Just drill the appropriate holes in the spring tower and you don't even need hoses.  Just put the valve right at the bag.  You'll have to open the hood for filling.  Also, no air tank needed.  Just get a nice air pump from the bike shop.  The kind that you put your feet on and lift and push the handle.  If you are going to run the car in the weeds, don't forget to reinforce the lower control arms and suspension stop areas by boxing the ends all the way around or you'll pop out the lower bushing from the stress.  It's just sheet metal at the arm ends.  Hope this helps.



Have you ever driven a properly setup air ride car?  I'm guessing that you haven't based upon your inaccurate assessment of the handling characteristics of an air spring.  A properly set up air ride system has only one disadvantage over a coil-over type setup, and that is the associated weight of the tank, fittings, and controls.  Other than that there is no more float or roll than a coil-over setup.  In fact there are many advantages to running air springs over coils on a less than racecar. 

For the record I have both setups and I have driven many different cars with both setups. I currently have Air on my Rambler and Coils on my MR2.  The main advantage to air is the ease of ride height changes, With the push of a button I can go from driving 'in the weeds' to pulling in the driveway or up onto a car trailer with ease.  This is a PITA with the coils on my MR2 and honestly I never really change my height settings due to the fact that once it's dialed in it's not the easiest thing to change and get back to where it belongs perfectly.  This is unlike air because with any decent air management system the height should be able to be set within +- 1/16" every time you return to a preset height.

On the idea of doing air on the cheap,  In theory it will work to run without a tank but as stated above do not run with any of the air springs plumbed together.  This will create the dangerous handling characteristics stated above.  I would at the very least run a small air tank and some manual valves, in case your air system isn't 100% air tight and the car leaks down a little.
]]> Thu, 05 Apr 2012 08:49:23 +0000 http://theamcforum.com/forum/cutting-coils-lowering-ride-height_topic38426_post351200.html#351200 Cutting coils lowering ride height : You cannot cut ther front springs.... http://theamcforum.com/forum/cutting-coils-lowering-ride-height_topic38426_post351184.html#351184 Author: 69 ambassador 390
Subject: 38426
Posted: Apr/05/2012 at 7:26am

You cannot cut ther front springs.  They will sit cockeyed and bow out.  The springs were treated after forming so you cannot re-form the ends.  I also want to know where you get your hacksaw blades.  You can just get some correct springs made.  That should cost about $150.00 per set.  Or you could go the way I did and go coil over suspencion.  I can put it in the weeds now if I like and none of that annoying seasick grampa car float that airbags give a car.  Also, if you go air bags on the cheap as suggested, don't connect the two hoses for a pair together at one valve.  On corners the air will transfer from the outside to the inside and greatly increas body roll and handeling problems.  Always seperate the four corners.  Thats why the factory did it on bag equiped cars.  The trunnion style suspension is very easy to bag because of the mounting style.  You should be able to find usable bags at the local truck stop.  Just drill the appropriate holes in the spring tower and you don't even need hoses.  Just put the valve right at the bag.  You'll have to open the hood for filling.  Also, no air tank needed.  Just get a nice air pump from the bike shop.  The kind that you put your feet on and lift and push the handle.  If you are going to run the car in the weeds, don't forget to reinforce the lower control arms and suspension stop areas by boxing the ends all the way around or you'll pop out the lower bushing from the stress.  It's just sheet metal at the arm ends.  Hope this helps.  By the way, there's a guy in Australia that did this exact same thing.  That post os a couple of years old and I beleive it was a Rebel.  You would have to search the Australia section for the pics.]]> Thu, 05 Apr 2012 07:26:42 +0000 http://theamcforum.com/forum/cutting-coils-lowering-ride-height_topic38426_post351184.html#351184