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85 timing cover question.

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304-dude View Drop Down
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    Posted: Dec/12/2018 at 2:23pm
Did AMC offer a complete timing cover with pump gears and cover? Also were the fasteners to the pump cover slotted hex heads?

If so I have a feeling timing cover may be a complete replacement assembly, that was installed back when the engine was professionally rebuilt. 
71 Javelin SST body
390 69 crank, 70 block & heads
NASCAR SB2 rods & pistons
78 Jeep TH400 w/ 2.76 Low
50/50 Ford-AMC Suspension
79 F150 rear & 8.8 axles
Ford Racing 3.25 gears & 9" /w Detroit locker
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AMXFSTBK390 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec/12/2018 at 8:48pm
Don't know about AMC offering a timing cover/oil pump gears package. I am the 2nd owner of my 68 AMX. The oil pump cover has hex bolts with three radial marks indicating the hex bolts are grade 5. I believe the oil pump cover bolts required 55 inch pounds of torque and probably did not have a slot for a screw driver to torque them. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 304-dude Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec/13/2018 at 4:59am
Ah, I figured something was not right, but never owning an 80s Jeep myself, to work on, I could only guess. All in all everything looks fairly newish, as if a few years of light use , though at least 20k had to be on the engine.

Outside of the part number on the cover, the only noticable difference is the timing marks are smaller than on the 70s covers. Though it still has the seal installed from behind.

Maybe I will attempt to get dirty and take the pump a pater and clean it up, to identify the pump cover date, to see if it too was a late replacement chosen for the rebuild. At around 20K on the engine, it's probably the best cover I could obtain right now as an OEM replacement. So of the few parts I can use for my build, this cover may be another bonus.

I, post pictures of the odd differences and condition. Haven't gone over it much, as it's dirty from a timing cover leak at the pump side, which has accumulated grime like mad for its few years of service. The most noticeable part is the water pump area, hardly any wear against the surface. Though, the water pump I pulled from it, was fairly new in condition, which shows,  how little use the engine had after rebuild. In fact if I had changed the oil before disassembly, I prolly would have guessed it was no more than 5k on the engine, it's that clean inside, just like the cars over all condition, just looks like a bad worn out coat on a beautiful model. Once stripped, then things are cracking! 
71 Javelin SST body
390 69 crank, 70 block & heads
NASCAR SB2 rods & pistons
78 Jeep TH400 w/ 2.76 Low
50/50 Ford-AMC Suspension
79 F150 rear & 8.8 axles
Ford Racing 3.25 gears & 9" /w Detroit locker
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote farna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec/13/2018 at 6:05am
Of course AMC had replacement timing covers!  Timing overs weren't an issue until some idiot threw the molds away a couple years after Chrysler dropped the 360 (Grand Wagoneer). Someone figured they wouldn't be needing them any more...  Then Crown started making them and they were slightly off due to being made in China. Actually a great, quality part -- but they were slightly off most likely due to inch to metric conversion, and it doesn't take being off much to chew up dizzy gears... it was discovered. That has long since been corrected, but for a few years there were a good many of those "off" covers circulating. Not likely to get one now.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 401MATCOUPE Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec/13/2018 at 6:29am
AMC never offered the timing cover as a package for the Gen 2 engines (gears, oil pump cover, etc), I have several NOS stashed back and a couple of variety of box styles (logos)....the only part that came extra on them is the front oil seal and oil pump idler shaft was installed.  None even have gaskets.  There are many "generations" of timing covers, all technically interchangeable, the last versions have the place for a crank pick up that was never used and all timing marks shifted to show 0 at one end of the scale.  All factory timing covers have casting dates cast into them with year and month, P/N and Drawing/Part Revision...which go into double letters (that is more then 26 revisions to the drawing in about 25 years of production...1966 to 1990 or so).

As far as Oil Pump Cover fasteners, originally they had a 7/6 hex head bolt, 1/4-20 full thread, many manufacturers over the years.  That fastener stayed in place until superseded by a 3/8" hex washer head, 1/4-20 thread bolt was used until the end of production.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 304-dude Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec/13/2018 at 6:47am
Originally posted by 401MATCOUPE 401MATCOUPE wrote:

AMC never offered the timing cover as a package for the Gen 2 engines (gears, oil pump cover, etc), I have several NOS stashed back and a couple of variety of box styles (logos)....the only part that came extra on them is the front oil seal and oil pump idler shaft was installed.  None even have gaskets.  There are many "generations" of timing covers, all technically interchangeable, the last versions have the place for a crank pick up that was never used and all timing marks shifted to show 0 at one end of the scale.  All factory timing covers have casting dates cast into them with year and month, P/N and Drawing/Part Revision...which go into double letters (that is more then 26 revisions to the drawing in about 25 years of production...1966 to 1990 or so).

As far as Oil Pump Cover fasteners, originally they had a 7/6 hex head bolt, 1/4-20 full thread, many manufacturers over the years.  That fastener stayed in place until superseded by a 3/8" hex washer head, 1/4-20 thread bolt was used until the end of production.

Thank you! Most likely I will use the existing fasteners as it won't be on a stock rebuild setup.  So moat likely the pump cover and gears were separate replacements. Though it is nice to see the pro rebuild actually used a new cover, other than the original, as to make sure everything was as good as factory new. The rebuild era I worked at obtained aftermarket parts firstly. So I wonder now, if the pump gears are actually a factory set, other than what was made back in the early 90s. 
71 Javelin SST body
390 69 crank, 70 block & heads
NASCAR SB2 rods & pistons
78 Jeep TH400 w/ 2.76 Low
50/50 Ford-AMC Suspension
79 F150 rear & 8.8 axles
Ford Racing 3.25 gears & 9" /w Detroit locker
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