196 flathead troubleshooting

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   Hey guys just getting into the nitty gritty now.
 She's in, she runs. I've got a leak at the old water pump, so I'm swapping that with the one off my OHV, oil pan leaks a little bit as well. Looks like it was sitting on the pan (before I got it.) But if my eyes aren't playing tricks I think I can take my clean oil pan from the OHV too.

So I've got some white smoke, nothing too thick, which I figure would be normal after a swap (especially my first one) but after maybe 5-10 min of running, still nothing has change. I also get some light smoke out of the radiator cap, not sure if that's normal for the 58 flathead or not. 

I don't know much about how this engine works but upon putting the exhaust back on, and starting it up, then taking the exhaust back off to adjust the clamps, I noticed some oil near the "manifold" as well as the top bolt of the far right exhaust port. 

Normal? Right now I'm gonna drain the oil, drop the pan, hopefully bolt the nice pan back up, also hoping I can take the oil filter system off the 59 OHV and replace it with the 58 Flathead paper filter system? Not sure if I read someone talking about full flow/partial flow or if that will make a difference. 

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59SeattleSuperSix Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List AMC Apprentice Joined: Mar/27/2020 Location: 98023 Status: Offline Points: 72	Post Options Post Reply Quote 59SeattleSuperSix Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Topic: 196 flathead troubleshooting Posted: Apr/04/2020 at 5:56pm
	Hey guys just getting into the nitty gritty now. She's in, she runs. I've got a leak at the old water pump, so I'm swapping that with the one off my OHV, oil pan leaks a little bit as well. Looks like it was sitting on the pan (before I got it.) But if my eyes aren't playing tricks I think I can take my clean oil pan from the OHV too. So I've got some white smoke, nothing too thick, which I figure would be normal after a swap (especially my first one) but after maybe 5-10 min of running, still nothing has change. I also get some light smoke out of the radiator cap, not sure if that's normal for the 58 flathead or not. I don't know much about how this engine works but upon putting the exhaust back on, and starting it up, then taking the exhaust back off to adjust the clamps, I noticed some oil near the "manifold" as well as the top bolt of the far right exhaust port. Normal? Right now I'm gonna drain the oil, drop the pan, hopefully bolt the nice pan back up, also hoping I can take the oil filter system off the 59 OHV and replace it with the 58 Flathead paper filter system? Not sure if I read someone talking about full flow/partial flow or if that will make a difference.

59SeattleSuperSix Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List AMC Apprentice Joined: Mar/27/2020 Location: 98023 Status: Offline Points: 72	Post Options Post Reply Quote 59SeattleSuperSix Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Apr/04/2020 at 6:01pm


purple72Gremlin Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List AMC Addicted Charter Member Joined: Jul/01/2007 Location: Illinois Status: Offline Points: 16614	Post Options Post Reply Quote purple72Gremlin Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Apr/04/2020 at 6:39pm
	White smoke smell like oil or antifreeze? If oil..ok. if antifreeze...you got problems.

59SeattleSuperSix Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List AMC Apprentice Joined: Mar/27/2020 Location: 98023 Status: Offline Points: 72	Post Options Post Reply Quote 59SeattleSuperSix Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Apr/04/2020 at 7:01pm
	hmm, smells like exhaust honestly but that's a good question, especially since its chopped pretty much under the firewall with no muffler lol. The puddle of oil on that exhaust opening had me curious though seems like it's not supposed to be there but I don't know. Does the flathead need to be torqued like the OHV does? I'd think those bolts stretch after a while but since it has fairly low miles supposedly 48k, not sure if that is any part of my issue. I guess where I'm at now is, the engine runs, and stays running. while there is a small leak in the oil pan, from the water pump, and a pin size hole in the radiator, I still maintain oil/water levels after starting and running here and there, it only drips a bit. where should I start troubleshooting making sure it's road worthy? in regards to the small leaks in the cooling system would it be a good idea to try some Steel Seal or like products? Thanks Purp

59SeattleSuperSix Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List AMC Apprentice Joined: Mar/27/2020 Location: 98023 Status: Offline Points: 72	Post Options Post Reply Quote 59SeattleSuperSix Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Apr/04/2020 at 7:04pm
	Also I guess with all the little starts here and there I haven't actually got the engine anywhere near running temperature, I've probably only had it running 2-3 minutes tops... Just don't want to ruin it like I did the OHV hahah

59SeattleSuperSix Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List AMC Apprentice Joined: Mar/27/2020 Location: 98023 Status: Offline Points: 72	Post Options Post Reply Quote 59SeattleSuperSix Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Apr/04/2020 at 9:04pm
	well, even though the exhaust smelled like OIL in my opinion, it's probably because I flushed the system after the swap, and only topped it off with water for troubleshooting. because once I checked the dipstick my oil is contaminated for sure. explains why the dripping at the pan probably wasn't just oil and the water was able to find a way out.. I guess I'm really gonna have to get the Steel Seal now or if anyone in the Wa/Or area has a 196OHV or 232 for me lemme know

Heavy 488 Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List AMC Addicted Joined: Apr/27/2019 Location: In the Status: Offline Points: 3557	Post Options Post Reply Quote Heavy 488 Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Apr/04/2020 at 9:21pm
	Have you done anything with retorquing or replacing the head gasket?

59SeattleSuperSix Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List AMC Apprentice Joined: Mar/27/2020 Location: 98023 Status: Offline Points: 72	Post Options Post Reply Quote 59SeattleSuperSix Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Apr/04/2020 at 10:06pm
	No I was wrong the flathead doesn't retorquing apparently and the head gasket is OG so I assume its blown. I trust the couple I got it from that it had 48k on it, so here's where I'm at. who has a gasket rebuild kit for a 58 196 flathead? 1. Do I try Steel Seal first for giggles, the flathead WAS free. 2. I know a guy with a 196 OHV with 68k for $800 local, is it worth dropping that much on it and having to rebuild the OHV or spending some time rebuilding the flathead if possible first?

tomj Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List AMC Addicted Joined: Jan/27/2010 Location: earth Status: Offline Points: 7553	Post Options Post Reply Quote tomj Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Apr/04/2020 at 10:39pm
	Hmm... > I think I can take my clean oil pan from the OHV too. Probably. I've got a flathead and ohv on stands side by side, its almost funny how similar they are. > I also get some light smoke out of the radiator cap, SMOKE out the radiator cap? Steam sure. Smoke? cracked block/head. > not sure if that's normal for the 58 flathead or not. Flathead no different from any engine regarding smoke and fumes. Since it's been sitting, handled, oil all over probably, it'll smoke all over if you got oily hands on exhaust etc. YOu have to wonder why an engine with only 48,000 miles was pulled. Keep in mind this is an engine designed most of a century ago, last run probably decades ago, and probably not maintained well in it's last few years. Also, engines go bad when they sit around especially outside on the ground. I hope you changed the oil before first starting it. What's that engines history? It's not a matter of trusting the sellers, I dont have reason to doubt them. BUt metal is metal, physics rules.
	1960 Rambler Super two-door wagon, OHV auto 1961 Roadster American, 195.6 OHV, T5 http://www.ramblerLore.com

59SeattleSuperSix Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List AMC Apprentice Joined: Mar/27/2020 Location: 98023 Status: Offline Points: 72	Post Options Post Reply Quote 59SeattleSuperSix Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Apr/04/2020 at 10:55pm
	Tom I was thinking the same thing similarities between the two. Oops*** , I meant from the dipstick, not the radiator cap, sorry I really need to practice proof reading my messages. Tom, the couple I got it from are the kind of people with MINT rides, and far from stock. So when they got the 58' american I believe them that it ran good etc, but the shop recommended doing a swap for a bigger engine etc. But, they said it was sitting for 1 year, on a pallet under their deck... I did change the oil, and topped it off with about 5 quarts of new oil. When I checked it today it's definitely watered down