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195.6 ohv performance engine build |
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tomj
AMC Addicted Joined: Jan/27/2010 Location: earth Status: Offline Points: 7544 |
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today i got the oil pump yanked, re-sealed and installed (t was seeping on one edge), the oil cooler installed, lines made, pressure relief spring replaced, and oil changed. hmm, in hindsight it seems like a lot of work.
i'll take pics later, but i mounted the B&M cooler in the passenger side valance, in front of the tire. i'll add a shield to block tire-tossed spark plugs, etc. nice neat screened hole in the valance (where most cars have a bumper). TONS OF AIR. the oil pressure relief spring is a story in itself. so on that LeMons heck on Wheels Rally '16 my oil pressure dropped at speed to high 40's, idle was still 20, and i melted the conn rod bearings, etc. i assumed the low pressure was from the bearings. since springs are pretty much unavailable i re=used the old one. turns out THAT is why the pressure was low -- the spring went soft, oddly, fairly suddenly. might be from heat!! Blaser's has 'em -- EIGHTY FREAKIN DOLLARS FOR A TINY SPRING. they got 'em, i need 'em, i paid 'em. it doesn't make me like them however, but hey, i get it, it's a business based on scarcity, thems the breaks. umm, yeah. there's the problem. the new spring is 2.625" long. the old one is a half inch shorter. to test that this was the issue, i shimmed the old spring with 1/4" of steel, brought pressure up to 60. new spring runs about 60 - 65 psi. i suspect a lot of 195.6's have old, weak springs. before i installed it i measured every aspect of it, so that we can source the part generically. i'll write it up, might even try to find a source. i'm running Lucas 20W-50 with high zinc. the short highway drive that consistently generated 230 degree oil is now just over 150 F. oil cooler fan did not come on. will gain experience with it in time. my guess is that a fairly modest cooler in the air flow without a fan will be more than adequate for most cars, but of course the problem with all by the '65 with full-flow filter is that there is no way to insert a cooler into the oil flow. |
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1960 Rambler Super two-door wagon, OHV auto
1961 Roadster American, 195.6 OHV, T5 http://www.ramblerLore.com |
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farna
Supporter of TheAMCForum Moderator Lost Dealership Project Joined: Jul/08/2007 Location: South Carolina Status: Offline Points: 19676 |
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Yes there is -- a spin on oil filter adapter. Mounts like an oil filter, goes between filter and base. They are made for most popular filters. Not as easy as the old 196 with the external lines already there though!
Few oil cooler setups run fans... I doubt yours will ever come on, but it might during hard, long rally runs on hot dry days. |
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Frank Swygert
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tomj
AMC Addicted Joined: Jan/27/2010 Location: earth Status: Offline Points: 7544 |
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lots of those, but i doubt the bypass system flows enough oil to take significant heat out. how did AMC ever think this thing was anything but fuggly and weird?! (oil cooler in lower valance.) |
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1960 Rambler Super two-door wagon, OHV auto
1961 Roadster American, 195.6 OHV, T5 http://www.ramblerLore.com |
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tomj
AMC Addicted Joined: Jan/27/2010 Location: earth Status: Offline Points: 7544 |
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OK i just went through my receipts for my 2010 engine build, and found that i had bought an oil pump kit, that includes that spring, from Kanter.com. it was NOT an old, used spring. it was a new replacement, and it lasted only 6, 7 years. not good.
i think i'll contact Kanter and tell them. 6 years is a long time to guarantee an engine part, and in spite of the cost of the OEM part (311 2400), i'm not concerned with the cost, but the quality control. i hadn't measured the height of the Kanter spring, but it did run 60 psi when i installed. for reference, the Kanter part is oil pump kit 24499G OPK 51043.
Edited by tomj - Apr/28/2017 at 12:13am |
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1960 Rambler Super two-door wagon, OHV auto
1961 Roadster American, 195.6 OHV, T5 http://www.ramblerLore.com |
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uncljohn
AMC Addicted Joined: Jan/03/2013 Location: Peoria AZ Status: Offline Points: 5394 |
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A couple of years ago some one showed up at a Cactus Cruiser spring show with a 196 and three carburetors on it. If memory serves two were false and strictly cosmetic but the package to me is just crying to modify the plate things bolt to for 3 YF's . I have only had one car with multiple carburetors, a modified (Oh yea) 32 ford with a pair of 2bbls on it. synchronizing them required some special tools that I modified Ovaltine jars to take the place of thus it was simple. I've just never been in the position to do over. But would like to.
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70 390 5spd Donohue
74 Hornet In restoration 76 Hornet, 5.7L Mercury Marine Power 80 Fuel Injected I6 Spirit 74 232 I-6, 4bbl, 270HL Isky Cam |
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farna
Supporter of TheAMCForum Moderator Lost Dealership Project Joined: Jul/08/2007 Location: South Carolina Status: Offline Points: 19676 |
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There is a problem with using three carbs on the old 196 though. There are four ports to the cylinders inside the head. The end cylinders have there own port, the center four are siamesed -- share two ports twice the size of the ends. The ports are angled towards the ends of the engine (front two to front, rear two to rear). When using dual carb the bor of the carb is placed at the front edge of the front siamesed port, with about 1/3 of the bore past the front edge of that port -- rear is done the same way (but to rear of course!). Otherwise you have a fuels distribution problem. With three carbs you can't place the front and rear carbs close enough to get much fuel to those siamesed ports. You could grind down that front/rear edge of the siamesed ports to round it more, but not that much, and it would interrupt the great flow and fuel distribution that "trough" surprisingly has. So three carb just won't work well. Now I had thought at one time that you could use a large single or small 2V in the center and two small 1V carbs on hte ends, but that would have the center carb basically feeding four cylinders and the end carbs (lawnmower or small motorcycle carbs?) feedin one each. Would be a nightmare to properly size carbs and get them balanced!
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Frank Swygert
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uncljohn
AMC Addicted Joined: Jan/03/2013 Location: Peoria AZ Status: Offline Points: 5394 |
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If one carb sits in the center and gets fuel to all the places it is supposed to go to then the fuel distribution on the head can be horrible and still work. A 3 carb situation would be with a progressive arrangement for the most part anyway. Considering the inefficiency of various types of homebrew intake manifolds over the years, I still think it would work. Work being defined as dreveable and tunable. And cool as all get out when the hood was opened.
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70 390 5spd Donohue
74 Hornet In restoration 76 Hornet, 5.7L Mercury Marine Power 80 Fuel Injected I6 Spirit 74 232 I-6, 4bbl, 270HL Isky Cam |
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tomj
AMC Addicted Joined: Jan/27/2010 Location: earth Status: Offline Points: 7544 |
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~ 200 cu in at the low speeds this engine turns means it simply can't pump a lot of air. it's something like 250 cfm at 4000 rpm. carbs need velocity, to create vacuum, to generate the signal they need to work. its super easy to overcarb.
though i've been quite happy with the Weber 32/36, on this new engine im going to replace it with the 38/38, which everyone i've explained the situation to says is a better choice. the 195.6 ohv for all it's stupid head design flaws has close to perfect fuel distribution. the trough isn't large, but it's short, with those odd little anti-reversion wedges that might actually have something to do with it. the 38/38 apparently has the exact same base pattern, throttle linkage, air cleaner pattern, etc, its under $400 so it should be a straightfoward swap. in poking around on various forums about people who've used them, and other webers, every single one having problems with tuning, not one of them followed the Weber recommended tuning procedure. its peculiar to the downdraft webers. |
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1960 Rambler Super two-door wagon, OHV auto
1961 Roadster American, 195.6 OHV, T5 http://www.ramblerLore.com |
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tomj
AMC Addicted Joined: Jan/27/2010 Location: earth Status: Offline Points: 7544 |
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oh btw here's my junker '65 engine with the head-circulation water pump...
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1960 Rambler Super two-door wagon, OHV auto
1961 Roadster American, 195.6 OHV, T5 http://www.ramblerLore.com |
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farna
Supporter of TheAMCForum Moderator Lost Dealership Project Joined: Jul/08/2007 Location: South Carolina Status: Offline Points: 19676 |
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Thanks for that pic! Makes one more iteration of the water pump... at least six now! All but the aluminum engine body will interchange though (shafts different lengths), would just have to use a plug/cap to use that 65 pump on an earlier engine, T into the heater hose to use early on a 65. The AL block is a totally different pump, then there are two different shaft lengths, and at least two different heater hose outlets. It should be possible to press the hub back on a long shaft pump, but have to be very careful not to damage the impeller.
I think the bypass WOULD cool the oil a noticeable amount. If 75-80% of oil goes through for lubrication, it would have to cool a good deal. Not as much as full flow, but even if it only removes 50% of the heat compared to a full flow it should be enough to justify an oil cooler. There used to be finned aluminum heat sink covers for oil filters. Now THAT probably doesn't remove a significant amount of heat, but at least it prettys up the filter! |
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Frank Swygert
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